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[stayathomecristi]

I'm new to GD, so please be gentle with me. I'm having a real hard time with some things, but this one really has me stumped.

DD 8yo has been into "spy stuff" for a while. She and her best friend exchange "info" etc on siblings and others. DD has a small notebook in order to write down her findings. She keeps it in a special bag in her room and hides the bag.

DS 10 yo is the subject of many of her "spyings" and she has much written about him to share with her friend. Somehow ds got a hold of the notebook and read that she had disclosed certain information (mainly about a girl that ds has mentioned that he likes) and he is really angry.

My stand is that her notebook is like a private journal and that she can write whatever she wants in it and that he should just leave it alone. He keeps finding it even though she finds new places to hide it. He has become violent and threatens to rip it up. He yells at her, yells at me etc. He keeps threatening to kill her and kill me.

I should mention that his rage is nothing new and I really need help managing him when he gets out of control.

I guess I'm looking for a reality check: Is it wrong for me to stand by her and tell her that she can keep that notebook? Or, is he really out of line for violating her privacy? Or, something else?

Addendum: DS just came downstairs all proud of himself that he took all the pages out of her notebook, ripped it up and soaked the pieces. DD is hysterical and ds is still out of control. At the very least he will be buying her a new notebook. Any other suggestions?

ETA-Five minutes have gone by and ds went up to dd and pulled her hair HARD, then started screaming at me when I asked him how it would make him feel if someone pulled his hair. He yelled at me and told me that she deserved it. No remorse, nothing and I'm sure it's not over yet. I sincerely don't know what to do with this child. Remember he is 10yo and still has temper tantrums with rage and hitting. How do I diffuse this?

[NiteNicole]

My stand is that her notebook is like a private journal and that she can write whatever she wants in it and that he should just leave it alone.

Maybe she needs to learn about HIS privacy.

I don't think I'd enjoy having someone "spy" on me and share personal information with their friends. If she wants privacy for herself, she needs to respect it for others.

IMO, he is protecting what he views as a violation of his privacy.

[flyingspaghettimama]

Uh, I think I would seek counseling or therapy of some sort, in a fast sort of way. Some AP/GD authors offer phone counseling. Sounds like some interesting boundary issues for everyone, and you're about to enter the teen years in which it becomes worse if there's not a nonviolent way to deal/cope with those issues. She should have a place where she can write anything she likes; and he should feel that his personal life is not betrayed publicly in any way. Has she been reading a lot of "encyclopedia jones" or "harriet the spy" - this is a really normal stage; but the way things are playing out sounds really intense to me, particularly the threats of killing and physical outcomes - pulling hair, destroying things, etc.

My younger brother liked to threaten to kill people too at this age, and he never really got a grip on his anger because my mother ignored it or thought he'd grow out of it. He was not fun to live with throughout all the teen years, and very abusive to younger siblings. I would seek outside help.

I do not think buying a new notebook or regular consequences that you think of will help the underlying emotional issues or tantrums, or him feeling heard and finding a way to communicate without hurting himself or others. I think the empathy piece sounds like it's way missing for both of them, and it's hard to make amends or accept an apology without that piece.

[stayathomecristi]

Point well taken--that is why I asked for feedback. I can see both sides of that issue: Should she even be writing some of this stuff? I dunno. Should he be snooping in her stuff? Probably not, but if he knew there was something written about him I could see why he would.

The bigger piece of the puzzle is that even if someone writes something about you that you don't like, it doesn't give you the right to tantrum, hit, yell and basically flip-out.

[plein_soleil]

While I believe he has some anger issues, she is violating his privacy (and anyone else's) by sharing her findings with her friends. Can you tell her that she is not to spy on her brother anymore because he doesn't like it? In fact, how about supervising and having him tell her and back him up. Then tell her what she "can" spy on. There are other things she could find out, and maybe you would not want that shared with the neighborhood.

I also believe she can write whatever she wants in a secret, private diary, but that should not be shared.

[stayathomecristi]

O.k. I will do that (supervise him telling her he doesn't like it and to stop) and mention to her about a private diary.

But, what about his anger issues? I am at a total loss. On top of that I really hate to think that my not knowing what to do in these types of situations pushes him toward losing control : If I missed it on this one, where else am I missing it? What else am I doing that provokes his anger?

I do know that he is addicted to sugar and carbs, so I know this plays into his problems. When his blood sugar goes low he tends to have more behavioral issues. He refused to eat anything for lunch today. I can't force him. In a little while I will need to watch him because he will try and get his hands on anything that has sugar in it and will melt-down when I offer him something more appropriate. This is one piece of the puzzle.

Maybe I need a good book to start with. I'm so discouraged I feel like a total failure as a parent.

[ZanZansMommy]

Christi you're not a bad parent. PM me if you get a chance O.k. Been thinking about you a ton.

[nancy926]

I have only a 2.5 year old, so what do I know....but maybe THEY need to solve the problem, not you. Sit down with them and help them figure out what would work for both of them.

I agree that if the notebook were actually private, that your son was out of line. but if your DD was sharing info with her friends, that's a bit different.

[alegna]

Several issues as I see it. DD should not be spying on ds. Not polite. DS should not be snooping in dds stuff.

Then there's the anger issue. I am not a big fan of therapy, but it honestly sounds very needed in this situation. It sounds like your ds is out of control and that's no fun for anyone- himself especially.

good luck!

-Angela

[CerridwenLorelei]

you say he is addicted to sugar and carbs?

the anger when his sugar gets low ..has he been tested for hypoglycemia or diabetes?
When I had hypo pp I had anger issues with the sugar and finally got dx and on the road to mend
I had to use glucose tablets for a time but it sounds like he does need to be tested asap
and in the meantime it sounds like you might have to more strongly encourage him to eat something at the time you normally would see a meltdown...maybe there is a certain cracker or something he likes? or blueberry muffin?

[meemee]

Originally Posted by stayathomecristi

I do know that he is addicted to sugar and carbs, so I know this plays into his problems. When his blood sugar goes low he tends to have more behavioral issues. He refused to eat anything for lunch today. I can't force him. In a little while I will need to watch him because he will try and get his hands on anything that has sugar in it and will melt-down when I offer him something more appropriate. This is one piece of the puzzle.

it seem u do have an answer to the anger issue. that is to get him to eat. but that's a tough one. can u just sit down and talk to him and tell him he has to eat every meal and snack. that his body needs it and talk to him about sugar stuff that is not good for him. give him a talk about whats proper food and what is junk.

check his angry outbursts and see if it is always food related. i have a 3 year old so i am not quite sure how u can get him to eat. maybe others can give u some ideas. check out the health and nutrition board too. maybe find out what other 10 year olds eat.

i would definitely work on his food issue before proceedign with therapy or anything further.

now the incident that u described and ur sons anger over it i find v. appropriate - esp. if he is a v. private person. that he will kill u i too find ok as long as he doesnt say it for every angry outburst. if he does at every outburst then i would be concerned at ur sons depth of frustration.

on teh whole diary case i agree with pp. ur dd did invade privacy by sharing and even though ur son got angry he has a reason to be. esp. at 10 and regarding a relationship.

[stayathomecristi]

Hi Lorelei,

Lately I'm beginning to think that he LIKES to be out of control and that is why he's refusing to eat. We've had the discussion before about how he needs to eat more balanced and healthfully and that sneaking treats is not the best way to stay in control.

Crackers or a blueberry muffin would send him (not as bad as not eating) because both are carbs and turn to sugar pretty fast in your system. He really needs to eat some protein at regular intervals during the day, but is really, really picky.

DH just thinks that ds is just rebellious and chooses to behave the way he does. Maybe so, but I've noticed that the food issue is a huge one for him. His behavior clearly deteriorates when he doesn't eat or when he eats too much of the wrong thing. DH was home this weekend (we're in the middle of an interstate move as well ) and I was really upset that he was giving him all kinds of junk. I pointed out that we would be dealing with major behavioral issues because of it all and he really poo pood the whole thing. Then, IT happened. Ds lost it, dh lost it and I basically said, "I told you so". Not productive I know, but that's what happened.

Now, I've spent the entire week since dh left undoing all the harm from this weekend's overindulgence. Ds is more addicted than ever to the junk and has been going through withdrawals. It's not a pretty sight.

If it was up to me, I simply wouldn't have any of that stuff in the house.

[stayathomecristi]

I forgot--we did sit down and talk about the diary thing. I coached ds ahead of time about how to tell his sister that when she writes things down about him and shares them with her friend, how it makes him feel really angry. She apologized and agreed not to do it again. He apologized for ripping up her book. I did learn that he's asked her before not to do this and she just keeps doing it, so I will monitor to make sure it's not continuing.

In the morning I will sit him down again and go over the diet thing again. Last month I had him pick out some things that he likes to eat and even had him go to the grocery store with me. Many of the things he said he would eat are still sitting here, so I need to regroup with him about that. I'm really nervous about "forcing" him to eat because I know that some people can develop eating disorders etc, but he really needs to be persuaded somehow. He needs to remember how good he feels when he's eating well, so maybe when we've got a couple of good days under our belts I will point that out to him.

Thanks for all the input. I'm feeling a little encouraged at the moment. Just wearies me day in and day out to be having power struggles with this little guy. For those of you who have stuck it out this long, thanks for putting up with my endless posts as well

[CerridwenLorelei]

I should have known better about

the muffin and cracker
was thinking protein in the berries and the low carb crackers they have out now
I did the protein snack in evening with ds #3 but it wouldn't work with yours cause we used drinkable yogurt
even though he is ten he may still need the instruction/direction for the food issue
keep a diary with him or calendar. Have him look at the marks/notations when things go nuts when he doesn't eat..