Split-off: Where does Support for Gifted Children belong?

[A&A]

Originally Posted by Destinye

I really wish there was a sub-forum to discuss things with as I don't know anyone else to talk to about this issue and specific threads would be better!

I completely agree!!!!! How do we go about requesting this? Anyone know?

[eilonwy]

Originally Posted by Destinye

I mostly lurk here too, mostly because DD seems to fit more in here than anywhere else, and is probably bright or moderately gifted though I guess time will tell. I really wish there was a sub-forum to discuss things with as I don't know anyone else to talk to about this issue and specific threads would be better!

Personally, I don't think it's a reasonable request to make; I mean, there are only a few of us here and I'm sure that there are a few lurkers, but to have a whole subforum for gifted issues would necessiate offerring subforums for every special need with more than a few posters-- one for autism (with a further subforum for Asperger's), one for medical issues, one for sensory issues... it just doesn't seem reasonable to me. Then there's all of the cross referencing that goes on; gifted kids with Asperger's, autistic kids with sensory problems, etc. I think making a bunch of subforums for each special need would make things a lot messier around here. JMHO.

[loraxc]

I don't see too much of a need for a subforum either. I kind of like the way this one thread meanders around.

. I have had to come to terms that my children will be misfits in society and will never fit in b/c of their giftedness and also their artistic abilities and insights and also that their parents are *weird*

Well, I don't know. I think it's a bit risky to have *decided* that your kids will be misfits. DH and I were both identified as gifted (I'd say I'm on the low end of the range, while he is more towards the middle-high range) and though our childhoods were not always easy, we both had plenty of friends and were not what I would call misfits. We were not expected to be misfits, either.

Depression/anxiety HAS to accompany giftedness. It is not possible to understand what happens in this world and not become anxious or depressed about it.

I also don't really agree with this. I sure as hell WORRY about the world and feel depressed and anxious *at times*, but I do not suffer from clinical depression or clinical anxiety, and many of the very bright people I know do not either. To be sure, some of them do, but I would hesitate to say that depression and anxiety are necessary consequences of giftedness, you know?

I don't remember a death-obsession phase, although I was extremely concerned with animal welfare from a very early age and tried to get my parents let me be a vegetarian (they wouldn't--so I finally turned veg when I went away to college, and have remained so for the last 12 years). I was very focused on injustice, though, and was a feminist at a very young age.

[A&A]

Originally Posted by eilonwy

Personally, I don't think it's a reasonable request to make; I mean, there are only a few of us here and I'm sure that there are a few lurkers, but to have a whole subforum for gifted issues would necessiate offerring subforums for every special need with more than a few posters-- one for autism (with a further subforum for Asperger's), one for medical issues, one for sensory issues... it just doesn't seem reasonable to me. Then there's all of the cross referencing that goes on; gifted kids with Asperger's, autistic kids with sensory problems, etc. I think making a bunch of subforums for each special need would make things a lot messier around here. JMHO.

Ok, I see your thinking. But I guess since those parents dealing with autism, etc. feel free to post individual threads about individual concerns, questions, etc. we should be able to, as well. We shouldn't be stuck in just one thread.


Re: death -- I went through this phase as a child, too. I remember being about six and telling my mom that I would die if I went to sleep, so I didn't want to go to bed!

[oldcrunchymom]

Originally Posted by A&A

Ok, I see your thinking. But I guess since those parents dealing with autism, etc. feel free to post individual threads about individual concerns, questions, etc. we should be able to, as well. We shouldn't be stuck in just one thread.

I can only speak for myself, but I stick to only this thread to post about gifted issues on MDC because some people get freaky about it and feel that we're "bragging" or whatever. I know we've had one or two people come onto the gifted threads and accuse us of trying to make others in the Special Needs forum feel bad. I don't think a lot of (or even a few) separate gifted threads would be received well.

There are gifted message boards out there but IMO they're pretty cliquey and they aren't in the greatest format. Maybe I'll make a better one sometime.

[A&A]

Originally Posted by lckrause

I can only speak for myself, but I stick to only this thread to post about gifted issues on MDC because some people get freaky about it and feel that we're "bragging" or whatever. I know we've had one or two people come onto the gifted threads and accuse us of trying to make others in the Special Needs forum feel bad. I don't think a lot of (or even a few) separate gifted threads would be received well.

I thought about this as well........perhaps having a thread (or threads) in Special Needs about kids doing things faster than average is painful for those parents dealing with children who will probably do things slower than average. How about a sub-forum in Parenting Issues, called "Parenting the Gifted Child" (or accelerated child, or whatever word seems to fit) ?

[ChristaN]

Originally Posted by A&A

I thought about this as well........perhaps having a thread (or threads) in Special Needs about kids doing things faster than average is painful for those parents dealing with children who will probably do things slower than average. How about a sub-forum in Parenting Issues, called "Parenting the Gifted Child" (or accelerated child, or whatever word seems to fit) ?

:

That's pretty much what I was thinking, too. Your suggestion seems like a good compromise. I can totally see how creating new forums for everything could be a bit much for the mods. However, Special Needs Parenting may not be the best location for discussions of this nature.

[A&A]

Originally Posted by ChristaN

:

I can totally see how creating new forums for everything could be a bit much for the mods. However, Special Needs Parenting may not be the best location for discussions of this nature.

Right, because "Special Needs" rarely actually implies the kind of needs our children have.

Could we all just agree to move to the Parenting Issues forum, and then it wouldn't even have to be a subforum? Or is that asking too much?

[ChristaN]

Right, because "Special Needs" rarely actually implies the kind of needs our children have.

Gosh, I don't know if this was meant to be sarcastic or not. I do think that my dd has different needs than other children; whether they are "special" or not, I don't know. I guess that my only point was that I can see how parents whose children are struggling with slow development could resent our presence here and/or view it as irritating in comparison with the different types of issues that they are facing.

[A&A]

Originally Posted by ChristaN

Gosh, I don't know if this was meant to be sarcastic or not. I do think that my dd has different needs than other children; whether they are "special" or not, I don't know.

In what way would my comment have been sarcastic?

Of course our children have needs, and unique ones at that. But, for example, if you walked into the local public school and announced, "My child has special needs," what would the principal think? Gifted? Of course not. He/should would immediately think developmentally delayed, disabled, autistic, or something. Because, rightly or wrongly, that is what "special needs" has come to imply in our society.

And I completely agree that other parents on the "Special Needs" forum may resent our presence. So, that's why I'm proposing moving out of this subforum and back to the main "Parenting Issues" forum.

[Destinye]

Well didn't mean to stir up a can of worms (seem to be doing that all day here oops) it was just a suggestion and I do feel there is a need for more than this thread for people with questions and specific discussions related to their possibly gifted children. It feels a little weird to be in the Special Needs forum to me too and not necessarily tactful when there are parents struggling with very sad and difficult situations with their special needs children.

It would be nice to have a place to ask specific questions as they come up which I don't feel comfortable asking here, or for example in the toddler forum.

[USAmma]

Many gifted children are considered by the schools and psychologists to have special needs because of different levels of development across different areas. They may be a physical 4 year old, academically a 7 year old, emotionally a 2 year old.

They have special needs in the classroom, in social situations, and many gifted children come with other "issues" such as sensory, emotional, even learning disabilities.

Even children with no other issues, who are otherwise typically developing children, must deal with the fact that they are different and don't fit in. To have a special talent in one or more areas makes that child stand out, and often in school that child is then made fun of and teased.

All of these must be addressed. Having a gifted child is both a joy and something that we must handle with great care, for our children would not fit the mold even if they tried.

I can see how being here in this forum might be painful to those whose children have other developmental things going on. How the parent of a child who is developmentally delayed would see "gifted children" and feel sad or bitter about this thread being here, when they are trying to find a refuge from the world of able bodie and able minded children.

With that in mind, would anyone object to being moved to Finding Your Tribe?

[eilonwy]

I see what you're saying about wanting a special place to discuss the needs of our kids; I have a proposal: How about we start a Yahoo! group?

I don't have a problem with moving this thread over to Parenting Issues or Finding Your Tribe (though I think that Parenting Issues might be the better choice), but I would ask that we emphasize the *support* aspect of this thread. Even here, people have come to post that "only 3% of children are gifted, blah blah blah, your kids probably aren't all that special and they don't need anything other than breastmilk and hugs...." I understand that some parents of kids with other issues might be offended by this thread, but I think that if it was in any other forum it would be seen as a brag thread, which it most assuredly is not. I think that the people who come to this forum (Special Needs) looking for support for dealing with their gifted children are actually working out issues and not here just to talk about how cool it is that their child can do x,y,z. A lot of people in the other forums will say "your child doesn't actually have special needs" or "your child isn't actually gifted" and I think the thread will quickly degenerate into us trying to defend ourselves against attacks.

ChristaN-- that website sounds very funny. I can think of quite a few cases where a child's future might be drastically affected by the results of the test, but not nearly enough for me to want to pay for it. :LOL

"This bishop leaves behind a suffering pawn.
There is none but me who can intercede,
In Mercy's name, three moves are all I need."

:LOL

[USAmma]

FYT is for support only, while PT is open to debate.

[isisjade]

[

[NoHiddenFees]

Originally Posted by eilonwy

I see what you're saying about wanting a special place to discuss the needs of our kids; I have a proposal: How about we start a Yahoo! group?

There are already lots of gifted mailing lists, including: the TAG lists; the GT World lists, and a whole bunch of Yahoo! groups. I prefer to keep it here in an AP environment. Feels more like home. However, I'd wager the chances of getting a subforum are slim. I have no problem with the thread where it is or in FYT. I'd be hesitant to place it in Parenting, because I'm soooo tiring of responding to the assertion that I'm a pushy parent, that all children are gifted and even if they aren't, they all even out in 3rd grade anyway. There's enough of a forum for that in Learning At Home.

[oldcrunchymom]

I'm up for whatever... Yahoo group, Special Needs, FYT. I do think wherever we put the thread on MDC, we're going to have people coming in with the issues NoHiddenFees mentions above. I personally don't think it's insensitive to keep it in Special Needs, but I can certainly see that POV.

I don't know if the mods would let us stay in FYT if we were actively talking about gifted issues rather than just idle chitchat. : I know this was an issue with the atheist thread recently, where they moved it because the word "religion" was being mentioned, even though it was not really debate, just mamas relating their life experiences. So I'm kinda fuzzy on what's allowable by way of chat and what's not.

Anyway, I'm off to the Land of Nod... or maybe I'll watch some Mulder before I retire. Decisions, decisions...

[Britishmum]

When we started these threads I emailed with Cynthia before hand to check that she was OK with it being in Special needs.

Personally, I do think my children have special needs. They don't fall within the normal curve, and their needs are different to the vast majority of children. I face as many challenges, albeit different ones, parenting my special children, as others face parenting children whose development is delayed.

I do see my children as special needs, and felt enormous relief when our threads were accepted in the SN forum. For me, it feels safe to be there. I can chat, ask questions, talk about worries, get support - all on one thread. That is not the same imo as FYT.

Many of our children also have other SN issues (mine have SID). It works for me to be in SN where I can talk about all aspects of my child's needs, not try to split it all up.

Anyway, in the UK, giftedness is seen as a special need, and gifted children are often placed on schools SN registers with IEPs to meet their needs. IRL when I have spoken of my children as having special needs to American friends, I have often been met with horror and denial. I have been relieved to find the support and recognition that I need here.

I for one would be very sad to be sidelined to FYT or parenting issues. I'd feel far more vulnerable. We occasionally have to deal with the cynics entering our thread to tell us that we're bragging, or that we're hurtful to those with 'real' special needs children. But it's rare, and as time goes on, I feel that we've become increasingly accepted within the special needs community. If we were 'out there' in Parenting Issues or elsewhere, we'd be very much more vulnerable to attack. Ugh. I don't think I'd feel comfortable being involved in discussions about my children in a more general forum.

[Britishmum]

Originally Posted by A&A

for example, if you walked into the local public school and announced, "My child has special needs," what would the principal think? Gifted? Of course not. He/should would immediately think developmentally delayed, disabled, autistic, or something. Because, rightly or wrongly, that is what "special needs" has come to imply in our society.
.

First, we're not all American. And just because SN may imply learning delay in American society doesnt mean that giftedness is not a special need.

[LeftField]

I also agree that having it in Special Needs is a bit uncomfortable. I'm just remembering one poster coming and asking us how we could cause them so much pain, when they were struggling with theirs and we had ours. I always feel kind of nervous posting there.

OTOH, putting it out in regular Parenting makes me feel funny too. I'm always waiting for someone to accuse me of being pretentious and doing that whole gifted stereotype thing. In the past, I've used a pseudonym on the other lists and even given my kids nicknames, because people can be so weird about it. A Yahoo group would be awesome, because lurking is limited.

But if the thread gets moved elsewhere at MDC, I will still participate here and there, if you will keep having me.