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post #41 of 370
I am so shocked. I have been disappointed in some of MDC's choices lately but this, honestly, disgusts me.

In case some of you are unfamiliar with The Pearls they are not just some bad you take with the good... these are people that advocate using a belt on a 6 month old baby. One article I read bragged about how their 15 month old was afraid of even seeing her dad's belt because she was beaten so often.

This is disgusting, contract or no. Will MDC accept an ad from a doctor who does Circumcision if he also supports homebirth? Take the good with the bad? Honor those all important financial contracts.

What is happening to this place? Why is it changing so much?
post #42 of 370

Stinky banner ad

When I came on here earlier, I tried to post about a banner ad for The Old Schoolhouse magazine. I wanted to bring it to the mods' attention that they run advertising for the Pearls' and No Greater Joy "ministries." In addition, they've had articles by Rebecca Pearl and ran a excerpt of Debi Pearl's marriage book in the last issue. Obviously, this stuff isn't in line with the Mothering philosophy, as they advocate spanking babies and children with "the rod."

Not to mention that one of the "19 free gifts" that the banner promises is a child training book by the Pearls!

Check out any of the past "baby whipping" threads for info on them, or google No Greater Joy and look at their "child training" articles. And we're advertising a mag that supports them?
post #43 of 370
Quote:
That said, no matter how many times I changes pages, I do not see that ad up top. Is it gone? I hope so!
No, I just refreshed over and over again and up it popped with an enticing statement about getting "19 free gifts".

The more I think about that up there, and read about the things that they suggest doing to children, the more disgusted I get. And we wonder why this place is attracting so many newcomers who are so far from what Mothering is "supposed" to be about that it's making our heads spin.
post #44 of 370
There's another thread about this in Questions and Suggestions. Apparently they are here on a month long contract and Mothering is going to continue to run the ad until the contract runs out.
post #45 of 370
OMGoodness! I read the link to the Pearls & the article sickened me. Literally sick to my stomach. I can't believe the ad that links to it is here at MDC.
post #46 of 370
Here's some quotes from the first chapter of their book:

"Proper training always works on every child. To neglect training is to create miserable circumstances for yourself and your child. Out of innocent ignorance many of you have bypassed the training and expected the discipline alone to effect proper behavior.

Just think of the relief it would be if by one command you could gain the absolute, silent, concentrated attention of all your children.

As in the military, all maneuvers in the home begin with a call to attention. Three-fourths of all home discipline problems would be instantly solved if you could at any time gain your child's silent, unmoving attention. "TO THE REAR--MARCH" translated into family language would be: "Leave the room," or, "Go to bed." Without question they turn and go. This is normal in the well trained family

Training is the conditioning of the child's mind before the crisis arises; it is preparation for future, instant, unquestioning obedience.

Try it yourself. Place an appealing object where they can reach it, maybe in a "No-no" corner or on an apple juice table (That's where the coffee table once sat). When they spy it and make a dive for it, in a calm voice say, "No, don't touch it." They will already be familiar with the "No," so they will pause, look at you in wonder and then turn around and grab it. Switch their hand once and simultaneously say, "No." Remember, you are not disciplining, you are training. One spat with a little switch is enough. They will again pull back their hand and consider the relationship between the object, their desire, the command and the little reinforcing pain. It may take several times, but if you are consistent, they will learn to consistently obey, even in your absence.

Hold him where he can easily reach your glasses. Look him right in the eye. He reaches out. Don't pull back. Don't defend yourself.' Calmly say, No." If anything, lower your voice, don't raise it. Don't sound more serious than usual. Remember you are establishing a pattern of command to be used the rest of his youth. When he touches the glasses, again say, "No," and accompany your command with minor pain. He will pull his hand back and try to comprehend the association of grabbing the glasses and pain

Through this process of association the child will involuntarily recall the pain every time he hears the word "No." There comes a time when your word alone is sufficient to gain obedience.

One particularly painful experience of nursing mothers is the biting baby. My wife did not waste time finding a cure. When the baby bit, she pulled hair...After two or three times of biting, with the accompanying head hurting, the child programs that information away for his own comfort. The biting habit is cured before it starts. This is not discipline. It is obedience training.

The mother clumsily holds her cereal bowl at arms length as she wrestles her infant for supremacy. When she places the bowl out of the baby's reach, he is taught it is off limits only if it is out of reach. To train him, place the bowl within easy reach. When he reaches out, say "No" and thump his hand. He will pull his hand back, momentarily look alarmed and again reach out. Repeat the process of saying "No" in a calm voice and thumping the hand. After several times, you can eat in peace.

He is returned to the toy and left alone long enough to again become engrossed. Another call, and, if no response, the father gives a patient explanation and demonstration of the desired response. The parent, having assured himself of the child's understanding, once again sets up the situation and calls the child. This time, if there is not an immediate response the child is lightly spanked and lectured. The father continues this throughout the evening until the child readily and immediately responds to a summons. Thereafter, until the child leaves home, he is expected to drop everything and come upon the first call. As long as the parents remain consistent, the child will consistently obey. This "obedience training" is carried out in the utmost patience and concentration. The spanking should not be viewed as punishment, but as reinforcement to commands.

One of our girls who developed mobility early had a fascination with crawling up the stairs. At four months she was too unknowing to be punished for disobedience. But for her own good, we attempted to train her not to climb the stairs by coordinating the voice command of "No" with little spats on the bare legs. The switch was a twelve-inch long, one-eighth-inch diameter sprig from a willow tree.

Clearly, the lines were drawn. The battle was in array. Someone was going to submit his will and learn his lesson. Either the father would confirm that this one-year-old could rule his parents or the parents would confirm their authority. Everyone's happiness was at stake, as well as the soul of the child. The father was wise enough to know this was a test of authority. This episode had crossed over from "obedience training" to discipline for attitude. For the next weary forty-five minutes, fifteen times the child would make his legs move, and the daddy would turn him around and spank his legs
post #47 of 370
Ok, I read that thread.

And all I really have to say is, "but, but, but..."

We're running advertising for a company that promotes the Pearls.

The Old Schoolhouse mag:
* ran a positive product review for them on their site
* has included their books as "free gifts" for the past two years
* ran a book excerpt from Debi Pearl
* had an interview with Mr and Mrs Peatl
* Has run at least two articles by Rebecca Pearl (their daugher)
post #48 of 370
i JUST CHIMED IN WILL SOMEONE POINT ME TO THE LINK PLEASE?

tHANKS
post #49 of 370
Quote:
One of our girls who developed mobility early had a fascination with crawling up the stairs. At four months she was too unknowing to be punished for disobedience. But for her own good, we attempted to train her not to climb the stairs by coordinating the voice command of "No" with little spats on the bare legs. The switch was a twelve-inch long, one-eighth-inch diameter sprig from a willow tree.
A foot long switch on a FOUR MONTH OLD BABY?
I am shocked to see a link to a company like that here. Training by whipping a FOUR MONTH OLD via a switch is not love. There is no love about that.

Cynthia, it would be very nice if MDC was able to relieve themselves of this ad. I understand it is hard to police all ads before they go up, but this one seems to stand out as needing a response from MDC. I am sure you are cringing as much as the rest of us.
post #50 of 370
Quote:
Originally Posted by phathui5
Ok, I read that thread.

And all I really have to say is, "but, but, but..."

We're running advertising for a company that promotes the Pearls.

The Old Schoolhouse mag:
* ran a positive product review for them on their site
* has included their books as "free gifts" for the past two years
* ran a book excerpt from Debi Pearl
* had an interview with Mr and Mrs Peatl
* Has run at least two articles by Rebecca Pearl (their daugher)

:
post #51 of 370
Quote:
Originally Posted by wende
And we wonder why this place is attracting so many newcomers who are so far from what Mothering is "supposed" to be about that it's making our heads spin.
I think this is sort of a superior thing to say. We should welcome new people here whether they are exact clones of you or me, or not, as long as they are respectful.

Also, where are all these unacceptable new members? I don't see them.

Also, it's silly to think that mainstream people are coming here because of an ultra-conservative homeschool banner ad. A person first must find this site before seeing the ads, not the other way around.

If there *are* a bunch of inappropriate new members, which I don't necessarily agree with, they are probably finding this place through google or other search engines. Mothering comes up a lot in google. Try searching your own username, for instance.
post #52 of 370
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I don't feel superior to anyone and I think it's insulting to insinuate that I do. I also didn't call anyone unacceptable. I said that there are a lot of people coming here who are far from what Mothering is supposedly about. I'm quite certain you've seen the threads with people wondering where all these people came from. They don't generally stay long, but they do come. I also didn't mean to imply that the banner would bring people here, only that by allowing that banner that those people may see it and think that this is the right place for them and their beliefs (spanking, etc). Now I would hope that those who stumble upon this place take some good from it, I hope that most of them stay, but I also know that a lot of them come and stir the $&^* and banner ads like that one won't help.

I don't care what good you were able to find from their site, the overall feel of it is that it is bad, bad, bad.
post #53 of 370
so am I correct in assuming MDC doesn't even read the ads before running them? that is just too weird
post #54 of 370
i found this place from a referral by someone i met whom
CD's and told me to check it out. I guess I am not really sure what MDC is "supposed" to be able. From what i was told prior to coming here, there was somethign here for everyone. When I was told abou the TP restrictions and posting requirements, the remark was "don't worry...there is a ton there and you wont have any problem finding threads to respond to" (im paraphrasing).
many times, i dont respond to a thread b/c i feel like i respond to too many sometimes (as a newbie). i dont think postings have anything to do with how interested someone is in MDC but i understand the rules are there for a reason and since "having" to post, i have come to rely on this community. its amazing how i lived without it in the first place.
im dont post on other sites (other than an NS site for my son with that disability but even there infrequenty).
my point is that i am a newbie, i have enjoyed this forum, and i dont really know what MCD is supposed to be able. can someone explain?
i will tell you right now that i dont homeschool and my children are better off for it. not because HS'ing is not good for kids, but it would not be good for MY kids if i were the teacher. i dont have the skills, patience, etc. to do it. i would not be a good teacher to anyone until age 25! i have conducted a lot of seminars on my own, etc. but when it comes to teaching my children on a daily basis the skills they need to learn in school, i dont think i would be benefitting them. i have the highest respect for parents that do...and thats all i ask in return...that they (i hate that word) respect my decision to know that HS'ing would not work for us.
as for what this is supposed to be (MDC), please enlighten me.
post #55 of 370
And on the Pearls' website, they have an glorifying interview from Old Schoolhouse with their daughter. So there is definitely a two-way love affair here between the Pearls and Old Schoolhouse.

http://www.nogreaterjoy.org/index.php?id=43

"Ever had a child training problem and not know what to do? I have, and I have turned again and again to a wonderful little book entitled, To Train Up A Child by Michael and Debi Pearl. This book has gone world-wide and helped countless numbers of parents with their child training questions. "

We also learn that the Pearls were under investigation by the big bad CPS as well during this time. It's a pity that they were under investigation (supposedly) for homeschooling. I imagine there were probably a few other things in their file as well. Switching babies would land a person in a lot of trouble where I live. As would letting a child molester back into your home, as other people have noted, which the Pearls advocate.

I know that sometimes people have trouble reconciling ads with ideology or mixed-messages - (i.e. Sears and the formula fiasco) but really, this way takes the cake, particularly if the Old Schoolhouse really *hearts* the Pearls. Ew!
post #56 of 370
I agree, this takes the cake. I would like to know who we can contact to protest this ad? I got the impression that Cynthia is not the one who chooses or approves the ad. I feel like this needs to be a call for activism.
post #57 of 370
Quote:
Originally Posted by aisraeltax
i found this place from a referral by someone i met whom
CD's and told me to check it out. I guess I am not really sure what MDC is "supposed" to be able. From what i was told prior to coming here, there was somethign here for everyone. When I was told abou the TP restrictions and posting requirements, the remark was "don't worry...there is a ton there and you wont have any problem finding threads to respond to" (im paraphrasing).
many times, i dont respond to a thread b/c i feel like i respond to too many sometimes (as a newbie). i dont think postings have anything to do with how interested someone is in MDC but i understand the rules are there for a reason and since "having" to post, i have come to rely on this community. its amazing how i lived without it in the first place.
im dont post on other sites (other than an NS site for my son with that disability but even there infrequenty).
my point is that i am a newbie, i have enjoyed this forum, and i dont really know what MCD is supposed to be able. can someone explain?
i will tell you right now that i dont homeschool and my children are better off for it. not because HS'ing is not good for kids, but it would not be good for MY kids if i were the teacher. i dont have the skills, patience, etc. to do it. i would not be a good teacher to anyone until age 25! i have conducted a lot of seminars on my own, etc. but when it comes to teaching my children on a daily basis the skills they need to learn in school, i dont think i would be benefitting them. i have the highest respect for parents that do...and thats all i ask in return...that they (i hate that word) respect my decision to know that HS'ing would not work for us.
as for what this is supposed to be (MDC), please enlighten me.
MDC is supposed to be a "Natural Family Living" type of place which includes Attachment Parenting. Not everyone here homeschools, it doesn't work for many families. Mine weren't hs'd until a year ago, in fact. Not everyone here co-sleeps. Not everyone here cloth diapers. Some people feel it important to vaccinate their children. Not everyone here does the exact same of anything, really, but there ARE general guidelines. You'd be hard pressed, though, to find a family here who thought that it was acceptable to formula feed a baby out of convenience or believed that spanking is the proper way to discipline a child. Those are pretty common themes around here.
post #58 of 370
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheena
I agree, this takes the cake. I would like to know who we can contact to protest this ad? I got the impression that Cynthia is not the one who chooses or approves the ad. I feel like this needs to be a call for activism.
Sheena-ITA. I think as a community -even though we are not allowed to question MDC- we can not stand by and let this ad run here....especially when you consider that children could see it.
post #59 of 370
That is sick!!!

I am outraged that any advertising money would be taken from someone who has ANY information about hitting infants or pulling breastfeeding babies hair! I am honestly crying right now just imagining an innocent baby being hit or having their feathery hair pulled.

This is UNEXCEPTABLE!!!!!!!

I would gladly contribute financially to make up for the amount that the ad has brought into MDC.
post #60 of 370


UNEXCEPTABLE.
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