Need BF'ing Advice ASAP

[Jaydedeyz]

[My sincerest apologies if my X-posting is offensive to anyone,but I need as much help as I can get.Thanks for understanding!]

OK.I'm new on here,and I've got an important question that I need some experienced answers on,ASAP.
I've been unable to successfully nurse my son [who's just turned 3mo.]from the day he was born,due to various birthing complications [it was a hospital birth,go figure].And since we were both so sick for over 2 months afterwards [again,hospital's fault;we were both healthy when I was admitted]I've dried up completely.There's not a drop of milk to be squeezed out,but that doesn't mean i'm not trying.And my little boy's been such a trooper about it all,he still tries his hardest to latch on me every chance he gets,but gets really frustrated when nothing happens.I've been taking Mother's Milk Tea at full capacity for over 6 wks. now,along with the max dose of Fenugreeks capsules.Still nothing.I've read up on the prescription Reglan,but it says it's not advised for people with a past history of mental illness,so that's out.But there's an alternative prescription called Domperidone [look it up on Breastfeedingonline.com]which sounds like a viable option for me.Just have to convince my doc to go along with it.I've also done my research on a Lact-Aid device [talked to the inventor's wife],but I can't afford the 40.00+ dollars for it,or the 30.00+ monthly on the disposable baggies for it.But the immediate reason for this post is I need an answer to this:
My family's pushing for me to start putting cereal into my son's formula [he's 3 months,it's time].I'm really hesitant to do this b/c,if by some miracle I find some way of successfully relactating,my boobs can't produce milk w/cereal in it.So what should I do?Give up on breastfeeding?Start him on the cereal?Wait and try the prescription and BF'ing support device first?[No guarantee I can get either the medicine or the device.]I need some advice quick mamas.I'm the primary caregiver,but not the sole caregiver,my mom takes care of him and his older brother for me while I look for a job,or do household chores that she's incapable of doing herself.I know that I haven't started him on cereal,but I can't say that my mom or sister[s] won't sneak it to him when I'm not around.I've pleaded my case to them all,begging them to please do as I ask,since it IS my child.But I'm only 20,what do I know about childrearing? [They also did this to me with my firstborn,who I also was not able to successfully breastfeed.I have no BF'ing support,we're a family of formula-fed people.And since I have no transportation,or license,I have no way of getting to the local LLL meetings.]
I'd really appreciate any and all advice on these questions,and my BF'ing situation in general.PLEASE tell me what you think mamas.I'll be back around midnight tonight to look in on your answers.Thanks in advance.
Bless you All

[AmandaBL]

I wish I could help you with the situation in general, but other than telling you how wonderful I think it is that you're still working on nursing after 3 mo of such issues, I can't. As far as the cerial goes, I'm 99% sure it counts as solid food, and that's a nono till they can at the very least sit unassisted. Used to be it WAS recomended at 3 mo, and I'm sure some people still do it, but that's not the current practice. I'm sure more mamas will post soon. I hope you get some helpfull info & keep at the nursing - you're doing super (You seem like you know more about children than most moms I run into - regardless of age )

[alegna]

No cereal. Hang in there! Have you tried eating oatmeal? Might help a little.



-Angela

[rosie29]

Perhaps your ped will support you on the no-cereal thing. (I hope!) Well, whether he/she does or doesn't, you could just say that that's what the ped said!

[lactationmom]

CALL A LACTATION CONSULTANT!!!! Many will talk to you for free or very reduced rates to help you get going! You most likely can get milk going again but it will take pumping, which a LC can rent to you (and again, most will have really reduced rates for people who need help). They are in the profession because they truely want to help.

Hang in there! Oh also, NO SOLIDS YET. Research shows too early solids leads to diabetes and food allergies, better to at LEAST wait until your baby is 5 months old, even if you never get to nurse him. And don't ever give it in a bottle, it can choke him.

Let me find my link....Here it is:
http://www.kellymom.com/nutrition/so....html#momfoods

This site is GREAT! Print what you can and keep with you to show your family and anyone else dispensing very bad advice (I still do after nursing 3 kids, ha).

KEEP UP THE GREAT EFFORT, YOU WILL NEVER REGRET DOING EVERYTHING YOU CAN! KEEP US POSTED!

[darkstar]

I say call a lactation consultant too. You could find one through the hospital that you had your babe in. I think that it is so great that you are doing this for your baby. I have a portable breast pump that I could send to you if you want it. Its a meleda hand pump. PM me and I will send it to you after the weekend.

Stay strong and do what you know is best for your kids. If you listen to your heart you know what is right


darkstar

[DeepGreen29]

Do not put cereal in a baby's bottle no matter what age the child is.

When cereal is eaten it should be in a bowl, with a consistency of a *food* so the baby can regulate his appetite.

I am really sorry to hear about your difficulties! It is especially hard without support. Re lactation is possible, and can only be good for your child. (I have no idea how to go about it. A lactation consultant woudl be best I assume)

Talk to your doctor about the solids...the AAP recommends no sooner than 6 months old. Tell your family that ;P

I wish you and your baby all the luck and wisdom in the world, please trust your instincts

[Jaydedeyz]

I've tried the lactation consultants around here.Haven't found a helpful one yet.The only one that "helped" for free was at the hospital at birth,and b/c I wasn't "allowed" to nurse [due to conflicting meds between me and the babe]that did nothing for me.But I wouldn't let her touch me to start with,she's the same one who "helped" with my 1st born.She shoved my breast into his mouth so far that he gagged on me.Guess what?He was bottle fed too.Wouldn't get near my chest skin-to-skin again without screaming for months.Poor little guy.And all of the unaffiliated LC's around here charge.I can't even afford a decent pump.[I've rented one from WIC before,it tore muscle tissue on my breasts on it's lowest setting.]I have the manual that was given to me at the hospital,but on it's highest setting it doesn't even suck enough to suck,KWIM?
I was given some advice on how to fashion a home-made supplimental system.Any ideas on this?
As for the cereal,I've tried explaining to them about my wanting to hold off on that,but they use the excuse,his older brother started it at 3mon.s,and he's fine![And yes,he DID get it through the bottle with his formula!]
As I've said before,I'm the primary,but not the sole caretaker.So I have little control over what's being done when I'm not here.[And believe it or not,he's with the best of the brood already.]
I try to understand their perspective,especially my mom's.[She raised her kids,aside from me,in the 60's.Not helping here!]She gets VERy defensive with me when I try explaining to her why I want to do things with my children a different way than hers,she bring's out the "I didn't raise 7 kids for nothing.All of you are alive.I guess I don't know anything then,funny how you all raised yourselves.".I hate when she does that!!
As for my sisters,all of their kids are my age [I'm the baby of 7,and ONLY 20].And they all used my mother's methods of childrearing,so there's more "proof" her way works.I love my mother dearly,and I KNOW she's only trying to help,and do what's best for her grandchildren.
I've asked them all [mother and sibs] how they'd feel if I babysat for them and did something with/to their children that they didn't want done.All I've ever got is "I'd kill you","I'd disown you",and "you'll never get that chance".
Tell me honestly mamas.Am I ?Is there a chance for me and my second child to establish this special mother-child bond that me and my first born were denied?
This has been driving me nuts so bad that I'm now dreaming about it!
I dreampt [sp?] last night that I borrowed a close friend's BF'ing child,so the child could teach me what to do! Is that nuts,or what?!
[Not an option,BTW,don't have any BF'ing mamas within RL reach around here.]
And the LLL isn't an option yet,I'm too far out of the city limits to be picked up.I have no car or license either.So I'm really screwed with this whole BF'ing situation.But you know what?I'm just too damned stubborn to give up without a fight!
's to all of you for all of your support and advice.You are the best people on the internet,and by far the cream of the crop on the planet!
Love to you ALL
PS: Darkstar-
I would be eternally grateful if you'd be so kind as to lend me your pump.I even cried when I read your reply,b/c it means so much to me to have a stranger be so willing to help.I promise to care for it as if it were made of gold,and return it in pristine condition.You really have no idea how grateful I am for your offer.Many blessings!

[William's Mom]

For me, these tinctures REALLY helped with my supply!

http://www.motherlove.com/products_extracts.php

[lactationmom]

Jayde-

You poor mama! You seem to have the world against you with your family right now!


Well something to consider- YOU are your babies mother. NOT your mom, not your sisters so they have to listen to YOU. But, I bet that's really hard when they are helping take care of your kids.

Well, have you looked at the "TRIBE" area of MDC? Put a note in your area that you need help and I can bet you will have some awesome mamas locally help you out! Seriously, the moms here are great and you live in a fairly large area (I'd help you if I lived closer, but I live in Tennessee!).

HANG IN THERE. YOU CAN DO IT.

[DaryLLL]

I just want to add that even if you think you can't make it to a LLL mtg, you cna call the Leader(s) anytime you want and get free phone information and support. AND They may be able to help you get to a mtg, you don't know unless you ask. Maybe a member lives right near you and can pick you up?

Be strong mama. You are in a tough situation!

[darkstar]

You can private message me your address and I will send off the pump. You just have to click on my name and it will give you the option to private message me. I have two pumps, which one do you want? The manual or the electric. Or I could just send you both. I have a pump that I really love, so you can keep them.

I second the find your tribe ideal. Are you in NC? I think that there is a huge populationo f mamas there.

I wish you all the luck in the world and think that you must be pretty awsome to be wanting to do this.

As for your mom...IGNORE her. As with me, I take the advice in one ear and out the other. My mom told me that you couldnt birth a 10 pound baby naturally...and I did, 10.5 pounds at home, so what do they know anyways


darkstar

[Nickarolaberry]

Oh, Mama, hugs to you.

It takes a lot of guts to persevere in a situation like yours and you just hang in there.

As to the cereal, NO NO NO NO NO NO. You can tell your mom and whatever family is pushing you on this that my dad, a pediatrician of over 37 years, absolutely FORBIDS his patients to do such a thing with cereal -- either in or out of a bottle -- before the baby shows absolute signs of being ready for solids (usually around 6 months, occasionally before between 4-5 months, and frequently after 6 months). Those include:

1) Tongue-thrust reflex is diminished
2) Baby can sit unassisted
3) Shows interest in what adults and other children are eating; actively tries to mimic eating
4) Seems unsatisfied even *after* milk (breast or formula)

Early cereal can be a choking danger; it can also promote a higher likelihood of allergic reaction to foods as the baby's gastrointestinal system is not equipped to handle it. Especially grains. And in any event breast milk (or formula) should make up the vast majority of the baby's nutrition for the entire first year.

I understand where your mom is coming from, but clearly medical knowledge and understanding of children's systems has advanced in the last few decades. Now we insist on the "back to sleep" (babies sleeping on their backs) to avoid SIDS, carseat safety has been written into law, we know that too much time in an infantseat can promote "flat head" syndrome -- we know a lot of things that we didn't before.

The American Academy of Pediatrics recommends breast (or bottle) feeding EXCLUSIVELY for at least 6 months. To your mom this might be a very good authority. (?) It's not you...it's the doctors. (see what I mean? deflects antagonism to somewhere else :LOL )

Sweetie, stand firm on this one. Don't let them sneak around you; in this as in other matters later on, you can politely and nicely - but firmly - establish that as the mom, you make these decisions. Emphasize this is a health issue, and one you won't compromise on. *even* if you don't ultimately succeed with breastfeeding, the baby does NOT need and SHOULD NOT have cereal in the bottle (or in a bowl) for several months yet.

Good luck, and if you still need a pump please pm me.

Take care and hugs!

[underthebluerug]

Jayde: YOU are AMAZING!

Your family situation sounds incredibly challenging. You sound very strong and very smart.

I just want to second that you can telephone LLL. They are all volunteers, so they are in it because they are *genuinely* committed to helping mamas like you, and will go out of their way to do so. A lot can be accomplished over the phone. Wish I were closer; I'd drive 100 miles to pick you up knowing how determined you are.

As for cereal in a bottle at three months, Nicole said it best. I nearly spit out my coffee when I read that you were under pressure to do this. (Note to Jayde's mom---When we know better we do better. And we can do lots better than "alive" for our kids these days

[paquerette]

Is there any possibility of getting out of this living situation? I would seriously consider looking into what kind of support services there are for helping single moms get out on their own in your area. You shouldn't have to be pressured into giving up parental control like this.

There was recently a study posted around these boards on early solids/cereals causing celiac. I wonder if your mom would read something like that.

[Jaydedeyz]

Thank you all for all the support and helpful suggestions.It really helps me cope with this situation to know that I have some form of support [even if it's only virtual].
As for my living situation,I'm here b/c I WANT to be here,not b/c I have to be.My mom's in her mid-60's now,she's a recluse,and I'm her main help.I'm here to help her live outside of a retirement home.She's not bed-ridden,but she has difficulty getting around,and can't do most household chores anymore,so she babysits while I do what needs to be done around the house as well as in town [like buying groceries and paying bills].Both of her parents,and all 4 grandparents died before reaching 75,so that combined with her severely poor health makes me believe that she doesn't have much earth time left,and I want my children to have as much time [and memories] with their grandma as possible.Even if it means having to listen to the patronizing comments about how things were done when I was born.Don't get me wrong,she's all for new technology [plays internet bingo nightly!],and she'll read anything I send her way,but just b/c she understands my point of view doesn't mean she'll change hers.She's just trying to help me care for my children the best way she knows how.And I have drawn the line at the cereal,and a few other things [like vaccines,circ'ing,etc.].But you should have seen the look on her face tonight when I mentioned homebirthing my next child [if/when I have another].But once I helped her realize that that's just another way of getting closer to nature,she seemed a little less shocked by it.And it doesn't hurt to mention that that's how our Native American ancestors gave birth to us.Even her mom and dad were home-birthed.So was she!
I have contacted the local LLL leader,and she gave me every bit of helpful advice she had,but that wasn't as successful as I'd hoped.I think I'd benefit from a face-to-face meeting with an experienced nursing mama who could show me what I'm doing wrong and correct me.But until I have the chance to get to a meeting,I'll take all the help I can get,from everywhere it's available!
I have posted in the Tribes section,and made a few new friends,but I'm almost an hour away from the city;I'm surrounded by corn and tobacco fields. So hitching a ride with a new buddy's not an option either.
Thanks for the links! I'll look around my not-so-local herbal store for the tinctures the next time I get the chance [hopefully this weekend!].
I was going to try the Mother Love tinctures to begin with,but I had an employee there help me compare the prices of a few products with how long they'll last me [due to the high quantities I need to ingest],and I wound up buying the Fenugreek and Mother's Milk Tea instead.not olny b/c they were cheaper,but they'd last longer [with the Mother Love tincture,I had her help me figure out my dosage,and it would be 60 drops a day,EVERYDAY!].That's approx. 2 days worth per bottle.20.00's a bottle.I can't afford that! But that's the recommended dosage for my weight and severe lactation difficulties.
I appreciate all of the support and understanding here so much,you ladies just don't realize how much your being here for me really means to me.I only wish I had just ONE RL person around that was HALF as supportive as you've all been.I greatly appreciate all the helpful suggestions and tips.Got a couple more questions for you all.
Has anyone ever used :
*Blessed Thistle?
*Bitter Fennel?
*Goats Rue?
*Hops?
*Dark beer? [This was a recommendation on another thread here,6 oz. of dark beer per day.]
for the record,the Fenugreek and Mother's Milk Tea has done nothing for me.I've been slighlty sore,and barely noticibly swollen,but no amount of stimulation has produced a drop.
Any thoughts on the priscriptions Reglan and/or Domperidone?[I've been told Domperidone's no longer FDA approved,but some still use it.]If I got a prescrip. for Domperidone,how would I get the meds?Reglan's not a good option for me,I'm prone to depression.
Let me know what your experiences were/are with any/all of these.Also let me know if there's something I haven't heard of or tried yet.
Again,thank you so much mamas.You're the best!
Blessings!

[rosie29]

You sound like a strong and resilient woman! You will accomplish many things with those traits!

[lactationmom]

Dang I wish I lived closer, I'd be there in a heartbeat.


Hang in there, you sound very strong, you are doing a super job. How wonderful for your mom to have you around!

[sarahwebb]

I responded on your other thread.

Sarah

[Quirky]

Blessed thistle and fenugreek in combination are good. You would need to take them in capsule form. 3-4 capsules of each, 3 times a day (you should smell like curry/maple syrup). Goats rue is good as well. There was a recent study that said alcohol actually inhibits letdown, so I would stay away from the beer.

You can order domperidone from New Zealand without a prescription at www.globaldrug.tv It's not cheap, though. It is safer than Reglan for both you and the baby, however.

At this point you are basically going to have to relactate if your baby has not been nursing for a couple of months. If you check out the main breastfeeding board and search for "relactate" or "relactation" you will probably find some helpful threads. Here are some more links that might be useful:

http://www.kellymom.com/bf/supply/index.html

http://www.kellymom.com/bf/supply/ma...pply-pump.html

http://www.kellymom.com/bf/supply/relactation.html

http://fourfriends.com/abrw/Boot%20Camp/bc1.htm (Relactation Boot Camp)

OH, just had a thought - do you qualify for WIC? Many offices will offer breastpumps. You really need a hospital grade one if at all possible. This more than any herbs, etc. I think is the most important thing to spend any money on.