The term 'Happy Holidays" - Page 2

[DaryLLL]

Yes, I also thought the English said Happy Christmas, but then perhaps I am stuck in Dickens. Don't y'all wear top hats and corsets too? (don't get me wrong, i love the English, see Anglophile thread)

I think it is weird to learn the British say Merry Xmas to all, when I know there are lots of Indians, Indonesians, and Africans (and their descendants) there, and somehow I doubt they've all converted?!

(I use x for christ, as it is much easier to type, and is greek for the letter chi)

I think cultural sensitivity is a better word, that may cause those who are prone to it, to have less distortion of vision when they roll their eyes, than political correctness. Perhaps?

I quit sending "xmas" cards years ago. Even when I did, I would buy one pack of Happy Holidays cards for my Jewish friends. Never would I send them a xmas card, yet I wanted to send a holiday greeting, of course.

Never would I walk up to any person on the street, stranger, friend, Jew, Hindu, or Bahai and say, "good Yule" to them. This does seem, to me, to indicate they SHOULD be celebrating my holiday, which message I would never try to give.

If certain of you xians wish to hear the saying merry Christmas more often, well, go to church. you can say it to your fellow xians all you want. Don't just go to xmas eve mass, go this weekend. Join the choir, bible study, the flower commitee, just surround yourself with bona fide xians and wish away! Nobody's stopping you.

Happy Holidays from an annoying minority.

[hahamommy]

Happy Holidays from an annoying minority.

Thanks! and so ya know, my favorite kinds of minorities are the annoying ones ~ myself included :LOL

~diana

[frogertgrl]

Originally posted by DaryLLL
If certain of you xians wish to hear the saying merry Christmas more often, well, go to church. you can say it to your fellow xians all you want. Don't just go to xmas eve mass, go this weekend. Join the choir, bible study, the flower commitee, just surround yourself with bona fide xians and wish away! Nobody's stopping you.

I second this! Xians enjoys a wonderful majority in this great US of A and you've even got a born-again for President this Xmas!

There is an abundance of 'Merry Xmas' (read: Christmas if this offends you) and the rest of us non-Xmas'ers are forced to hear this whether we want to or not. How about giving us some space for a more inclusive greeting this year?

[Arduinna]

Originally posted by merebear
>>>>BIGGGG SNIFFFF<<<<<

That's me gratefully taking in the breath of fresh air that hahamommy just brought in.

What exactly is meant by that. The more you comment on this and Asherahs goodby thread the more you prove the point that you just don't get it.

I can't speak for Asherah, but your Merry Christmas Everyone at the end of your reply to her (earlier in this thread) could very easily been taken as a slap in the face, or at least passive agressive. She specifically says she doesn't welcome Merry Xmas' and then you make a point to tell "everyone" Merry Xmas. interesting. You could have easliy said Merry Christmas to those that celebrate. ANd left the rest of us of out of it. But I feel you were trying to make a point, that you will do what you want without regard for anyone else.

Your apology seems insincere.

[frogertgrl]

Arduinna, your post addresses everything that is so offensive about what is going on here.

THANK YOU!

And, I agree: the apology seems insincere at best. Seems that someone has a point to make (shove down throat) and she doesn't give a damn that anyone might be hurt by that. And, yes, offended here, too.

Bleh.

And, really, this is exactly the kind of disgusting arrogance which is behind so many 'Merry Xmas' propaganda. How dare someone assume that I subscribe to their belief system?

Our Way, or the highway, I guess, for those types.

[burritomama]

On topic: I agree with what some others have said about the popular evolution of the term "Happy Holidays" - it, I think, was meant to be inclusive, not necessarily as others have suggested "dilutive" (sp?) of the season -- after all, there is more than one holiday this time fo year.

Now, slightly off topic: I like Asherah's interpretation of "political correctness"...and how others have described it as simply being sensitive and aware in an increasingly multicultural community. (This is why now, as an adult I am identified by people as a Latino or Chicana instead of the slurs that were regularly used when I was a kid. Yes, isn't it nice that some of those terms have been retired?) But back to the topic at hand, I agree; holiday greetings are not about "me" but about the person being greeted -- that's why I try to tailor my greetings accordingly and to not make assumptions.

Personal case in point: Two years ago, I experienced yet another painful, sad miscarriage. Say no more. A week later, it was Mother's Day and I was shopping with my sweetie in our local health food store. The cheery checkout clerk took one look at me and I guess assumed, "Hmm...woman of a certain age" and wished me a hearty Happy Mother's Day. I kept it together enough to simply smile and then excuse myself. My sweetie quiely told the guy that I wasn't a mother and the fellow said "Well, that doesn't really matter, does it? Everyone celebrates Mother's Day."

It did hurt. Sure, it was a small thing (especially when compared to one's religious commitment), but it hurt even though it wasn't meant to.

My two cents.

Happy Holidays.

[Irishmommy]

Originally posted by MysticHealerMom
And actor is gender neutral, no need for actress, but it does limit confusion at the academy awards

If actor is gender neutral, shouldn't prince be too?

[Arduinna]

NM,

You yourself posted that if you knew that someone was offended by Merry Xmas you wouldn't say it. Well, Asherah said she was and it wasn't repected. That is the point.

not sure if you missed that in the previous posts.

[sunmountain]

This thread reminds me of the racism thread and the discussion following mamapie's reiteration of the old hipmama boards policy.

merebear and NM, it simply is not possible for you to understand a Pagan's point of view fully, just as you would not be able to understand a POC feeling a little miffed about things we caucasions take for granted. You are right that these feelings belong to us and it is our responsibility to deal with them, but how about being a little more sensitive?

NM, you celebrate Christ's birth at this time of year b/c in the early part of the first millenium, Christians weren't recognized as a religion, and then when they were, they added their celebration of Christ's birthday to the list of already existing celebrations at this time of year. Your Christ is NOT the reason for the season. Everyone getting sick of the cold weather is

For me, this has nothing to do with some perceived "majority privilege".

Of course not, mearbear, you are the majority, how easy it is for you not to see how "privileged" you are. You seem to be the one with the chip on your shoulder, and I agree with Arduinna, you seem very passive agressive.

Burritomama, I am so sorry to hear about that experience at the store. That guy was super insensitive

LoveBeads, same for that ditz of a salesclerck who waited on you. ugh. What a clueless woman.

[frogertgrl]

Originally posted by Nursing Mother
disgusting arrogance!!! You've got to be kidding. What up with you anyway? Cause you say "merry Christmas, you're assuming someone is a Christian. I should say not!! Give us a break well you? Neither Merebear nor I have ever dis-respected anyone intentionally on this board. and I've known Merebear a whole lot longer then most of you.

Please by all means go start a thread on Pagan greetings. I wouldn't find that offensive at all.

As I am way too hurt, I won't beposting this thread any longer. So you'll have your 'break', as requested.

And I don't think you really care NM what is up with me so I'll go now.

[sunmountain]

What I resent is the watering down and taking the meaning out of the season and making it all commercial and PC, by not showing the nativity, or saying Christmas, or singing certain songs intended for the season thats all.

Please let's remember it was OUR celebration BEFORE it was yours. It only seems to be "Christmas around the world" to you because you have been surrounded by it and promote it in your own circles. Christmas is only ONE of the celebrations that happen this time of year. We are a country without a national religion, and I for one am happy to see the movement away from the Christian POV, and a more secular way about it. My celebration does not include the nativity, but many of your songs come from my herritage

Complain to your Christian friends who are bastardizing the holiday, who buy too many useless gifts, who think it's all about getting not giving, who "forgot" the nativity this year. They need to hear your words, they need to be shown that what they are doing is not holy. But please don't tell me I am taking the meaning out of your holiday. You guys actually took the meaning out of mine. But it's OK, I don't hold it against you

[CanOBeans]

How can Christ possibly be the "reason for the season" when the holiday "season" includes important holy days for people of non-Christian religions?? Not to mention the actual history of the traditions of Christmas itself, and the fact that historians believe Christ wasn't born at this time of the year anyway (at least that's what we were told in my church growing up...someone will of course correct me if I'm wrong).

I'd venture to say many Christians don't get the offensiveness of it all because they believe their religion is universal, applies to all humans, is the one true religion, etc. They believe that their truth is truth for all, whether others believe in it or not, so if it's The Truth, how can it possibly be wrong?

For the record, that's what I find myopic and offensive, more than the greetings or lack thereof.

[CanOBeans]

Originally posted by Nursing Mother
I do not resent people who do not celebate Christmas at all, why should I? What I resent is the watering down and taking the meaning out of the season and making it all commercial and PC, by not showing the nativity, or saying Christmas, or singing certain songs intended for the season thats all.

I celebrate Christmas. Just because the meaning Christmas holds for me isn't the same as for you doesn't mean my celebration is meaningless.

And I love the songs intended for the season. Grandma Got Run Over By a Reindeer isn't exactly something to be sung any other time of year! :LOL

[peggy]

Let's be gentle with each other please

Here is the original post..maybe that will help us get back on track...



The term 'Happy Holidays"
In the UK, we don't use the term 'Happy Holidays'. We would say 'Merry Christmas', or be specific if we meant Hannukah, Eid or any other celebration. But the term 'Merry Christmas' tends to be said as a general seasonal greeting, without worrying whether or not the person being greeted actually celebrates Christmas. I have friends in the UK who aren't Christian, yet happily use and respond to 'Merry Christmas'.

In schools, children learn the Christmas story the way they learn about Diwali and other festivals. Of course, there is no separation of church and state and religious education is part of the curriculum, although parents do have the right to remove their children if they wish. In fact, very very few parents do so. (The only ones I have known have been Johovah's Witness families)

Maybe we are just very backwards and politically incorrect, but I am curious about this terminology and way of thinking. Since I came to the US I have missed the feeling that Christmas is Christmas - the holidays seem to be lumped in together with little attention to the details of differences. The commercialism is bad in the UK, but ten times greater here.

Am I just backwards? What is the history of the 'holiday' term? Has it always been used, or is it relatively new?

I"m rambling, so I'll stop before I get myself into hot water! Apologies if I'm just being very politically incorrect. Dh tells me that non-Christians here would be offended by Christmas greetings so I don't use them here, I want to respect the culture here and would hate to offend people, but it's a cultural difference that right now I don't get. And I miss being wished a 'Merry Christmas'! (Although we tend to follow the US and so maybe 'Happy Holidays' will catch on soon in the UK too
)

[CanOBeans]

Originally posted by Nursing Mother
thats true, but I was thinking more of "Away in a Manger" "Joy to the world", "God rest ye merry Gentlemen" and such. Songs that really speak of the true meaning of Christmas.

See, there you go again, assuming your meaning is the true one. I beg to differ, and apparently so do some others. Christmas has as many true meanings as it has celebrants. It ain't just your holiday, and you can't really dictate its meanings.

I love Christmas music by the way, no matter which "true meaning" it celebrates -- religious, secular, or downright fluffy. I play nothing else in the month of December, from morning to night!

[Luma]

Asherah COME BACK!!!!!!!!!
sensitive souls like you are precious!
you have thought me to be more sensitive and I thank you for that!
I hope you stay

[AmyB]

I tend to say Happy Holidays because there are a bunch of holy days festivals and celebrations clustered around the winter solstice and since I am a UU I get to celebrate them all.

I have to say, it's a surprise to me that Christians are so touchy about insisting that Christmas is the main event amidst all the trees & orniments, electric lights, parties, gift giving, TV specials and so forth that goes on between Thanksgiving and New Year's Day.

--AmyB

[gossamer]

I don't understand, first we (christians) are being informed in this thread that

Christ-mas. Gee I always thought that had something to do with the day Jesus was supposedly born on.

now we're (christians again) being told

Christmas has as many true meanings as it has celebrants. It ain't just your holiday, and you can't really dictate its meanings.

It feels to me like some of you are just offended that we are christians. I have never intentionally offended any body on this board, pagan or not, but I get the impression that if I live my life by what I believe and speak according to my faith "Merry CHristmas" than I am automatically being insensitive and shoving my faith down somebodies throat.

Thouroughly Confused Gossamer

[merebear]

I would have been happy to clarify further my beliefs and admit where I messed up and to listen to your perspectives, but since this thread turned into mostly personal attacks I'll leave you to your own cherished assumptions.

Does that mean that I'll be chased off of the boards or bemoan the lack of tolerance and sensitivity when I exhibit the same? Nope.

And if I had to choose... I'd pick passive aggressive over up-front-nasty aggressiveness. That kind is just so ugly.

[merebear]

Oops! Nursing Mother, I forgot to give you a great big hug and kiss!