Can we talk about mercury & amalgam removal?

[paisley]

Yes, again. I have read through all the other posts here on the topic and I still have some questions.

Basically I am trying to decide whether or not to go through with it at this time. If we did it now (next month), ds would still be bf so I would have to find a way to have him take a break from the nay-nays for a few days without actually weaning. We were also planning to TTC in Oct, so we would have to push that to Jan at the earliest in order for the fetus to be safe (according to the studies I've read). We would use a IAOMT dentist, so all the protocols would be followed. If we didn't do it now, we'd have to wait until dc #2 was weaned, so that would be another 4 years or so.

The big question in my mind is, would removing the fillings and thus mobilizing the Hg in my mouth & body be more beneficial to my nursing toddler and the baby we want to TTC vs. leaving them in? Some studies say that it's ok to get it done while bf but then others say you should wait up to 1.5 years after removal to TTC. So if I should be waiting that long to TTC, wouldn't that Hg floating around in my body be bad for my current nursling? And what if a 3 month wait until TTC isn't long enough to make my body safe for a new fetus? Would the higher Hg exposure to the fetus in the early months of pg be safer than the continual gradual exposure via leaving them in? Can I just say I wish my Mom or I had known about the dangers of amalgam before I got them put in 10yrs ago?

I have been struggling with this decision for days now and am starting to feel a bit . I wish there was a clear answer for all of us who are dealing with this. Anyone care to share thier thoughts and/or experiences?

[paisley]

Just remembered some other info for you all -

I got a Hg blood test 9/03 and it came back as "<4 ug/L" (unfortunately no specific number) whereas the EPA says anything under 5.8 ug/L is 'safe'. I eat 1-2 servings of fish per month and am always careful to choose the types that tend to have less Hg. I eat tuna maybe a couple times a year, but never any shark, tilefish, makerel, etc. My Naturopath said she can test me again but she uses a combo of DMSA with urine tests and isn't DMSA a no-no while bf? Ah, like I said !

[Ruthla]

Not an expert by any means, but my gut feeling would be to wait until you're done growing and nursing babies. That's what I would personally do anyway.

[circlemama]

I had mine replaced (using all precautions) and my dd's eczema got better, not cured, but better. The dentist found decay under all of my old amalgram fillings, he said 90% or better have decay underneath. Oh, and my daughter's articulation speech delay disappeared after I gotten these toxic things out of my mouth. My dd was over 2 1/2 years old when this happened, and she never discontinued nursing. I tried to limit her nursing for the first week after the procedures. I had 6 fillings replaced in 3 sittings.

[JaneS]

A DMSA challenge is VERY VERY dangerous if you still have mercury fillings in your mouth. Whoever would do that to you doesn't know what they are doing and you should seek treatment advice elsewhere.

The DMSA will chelate even more mercury out of your fillings. It then recirculates and settles again in your organs, with more going to your brain.

Blood tests are completely useless to test the body and brain burden of mercury. Mercury is in the blood only for a few days after exposure, and then it settles itself in your organs.

When mercury dumps out of your organs it does so very slowly at first. The DMSA challenge done just once doesn't always produce a large amount of dumping b/c the body holds onto the mercury very tightly.

The test you should do is the Hair Elements test from DDI.

Get this book www.noamalgam.com

Join Yahoo group Adult Metal Chelation, some files from that group are here: http://home.earthlink.net/~moriam/ including how to do hair test.

I don't know re: bf'ing. I continued to bf when I was having my fillings out by IAOMT protocol, but cut down by less than half of what I was bf'ing before. I reasoned that if my blood levels went up slightly, DS would still be getting less milk than in the past. Now sometimes I think I was stupid to do this because how can you really know the effect on your child. However, cutting down feedings to only 1 or 2/day was easy. But total weaning was very hard. I was emotionally very conflicted about continuing to bf with my fillings still in, it was a very very hard decision and I had to sit with it for a while. I couldn't cut DS off cold turkey, I couldn't continue to bf knowing what I knew. It was very difficult.

My advice to you is continue to mull it over and you’ll know when your decision is the right one for you. I do believe very strongly in mother’s intuition.

If there are studies on bf I haven't seen them. You have seen studies on TTC? The only one I know of is Andrew Cutler’s research. Can you post others you’ve seen?

But I will say I would definately wait longer to TTC after removal. Once the body's main source of mercury goes away (your fillings) the body will gradually dump out mercury from your organs over the next year and half. Andrew Cutler bases this recommendation to wait 18mos or more to conceive is based on his study of this phenomenon (detailed in his book).

The fetus and mercury have a great affinity for each other... a larger percentage of mercury has been shown to be present in the blood of a fetus than in the blood of the mother. Sickening isn't it.

I'm devastated I have to wait so long to TTC, as I'm now 39 but after I've read about it there is no other choice I feel I can make. And there was no way I could have left the fillings in and conceived, knowing what I know now and believing that a number of our health issues have been caused by mercury poisoning.

[paisley]

This is such a hard decision. I am just not ready to wean ds (and of course he isn't ready either) and I don't want to wait 1.5 yrs before concieving #2 for so many reasons. I almost feel like I am having to chose the health of one child over the other, yk? As in, do I expose ds to an increase of Hg via nursing in the name of reducing exposure for his sibling-to-be, or do I endanger the more suceptable fetus so that ds doesn't face an increase? Then throw in the conflicting info from the different sources, oh and the cost - I was quoted $250-$450 per tooth x 5 teeth plus a $250-$400 per visit fee and the closest place is 100 mi away.

So I think I have come up with a compromise of sorts. I am thinking of waiting until the next (our last) child is weaned to get them removed. In the meantime I will be even more vigilant about the fish I am eating and find out more about a chelation diet to help flush out whatever Hg is floating around in my body. This way I wont put ds or dc-to-be at an increased risk from disturbing the amalgams. It's not a perfect solution but it is the best all-around one that I have come up with. What do you all think?

[paisley]

Originally Posted by JaneS

A DMSA challenge is VERY VERY dangerous if you still have mercury fillings in your mouth. Whoever would do that to you doesn't know what they are doing and you should seek treatment advice elsewhere.

Thank you. I thought I remembered reading something like that. Do you have any links with more info or studies about the DMSA being bad for those with fillings? I would love to help my ND be more informed on this. Is the hair test you mentioned by chance the same as the $25 one Greenpeace is currently offering? (https://secureusa.greenpeace.org/mercury/)

Originally Posted by JaneS

If there are studies on bf I haven't seen them. You have seen studies on TTC? The only one I know of is Andrew Cutler’s research. Can you post others you’ve seen?

I can't remember exactly where I read the info about how long to wait after TTC. I have read so many articles lately! Actually it may not have been a study on TTC per se, but I came across several studies that talked about when Hg levels started to decline post-removal and that is probably where I got my 3 months idea from. I did see at least 1 bf study somewhere. I think it was the one where they gave amalgam fillings to pregnant sheep. Basically the study showed that Hg does indeed cross the placenta and that the fetus primairily stores it in their liver and kidneys, and that the highest Hg levels in the bm were found in the first 15 days. Now, I don't know how long the study continued after those first 15 days of bf, so take that with a grain of salt, but that piece of info makes me think that colostrum & higher fat bm carry more Hg. Maybe it is fat soluable? Or maybe since it is a heavy metal it is easier transmitted in a substance that weighs more than water? However, I did read somewhere else that the type of mercury in amalgam fillings is easily passed through the placenta/breastmilk but not as readily absorbed by the baby as opposed to the Hg you get from eating fish which is transferred in smaller amounts but easily absorbed by baby. Organic vs. non-organic Hg or methylmercury, something like that? And dh wonders why I can't sleep lately! Who could with all this info swimming around in their head??

The one page I found to be the most helpful of all the sites I've been to was this one: http://www.algonet.se/~leif/yaTITLfr.html It's a bunch of different abstracts from all sorts of mercury related studies and has the references so you can look up the actual studies too. I found it very helpful to be able to look at the actual data rather than someone else's interpretation of it.

[applejuice]

I have not read any of the other threads on this subject, HOWEVER, I did ask my sister, a pediatric dentist, if I could have all of my amalgam fillings removed and then have a porcelain or non mercury filling replace all of them...she said I could, but I would also perhaps be scraping off a miniscule but precious layer of my own tooth in the process...

...do not know if she was telling the truth to me or trying to talk me out of it.

[JaneS]

Originally Posted by mama2toddles

This is such a hard decision. I am just not ready to wean ds (and of course he isn't ready either) and I don't want to wait 1.5 yrs before concieving #2 for so many reasons. I almost feel like I am having to chose the health of one child over the other, yk? As in, do I expose ds to an increase of Hg via nursing in the name of reducing exposure for his sibling-to-be, or do I endanger the more suceptable fetus so that ds doesn't face an increase? Then throw in the conflicting info from the different sources, oh and the cost - I was quoted $250-$450 per tooth x 5 teeth plus a $250-$400 per visit fee and the closest place is 100 mi away.

So I think I have come up with a compromise of sorts. I am thinking of waiting until the next (our last) child is weaned to get them removed. In the meantime I will be even more vigilant about the fish I am eating and find out more about a chelation diet to help flush out whatever Hg is floating around in my body. This way I wont put ds or dc-to-be at an increased risk from disturbing the amalgams. It's not a perfect solution but it is the best all-around one that I have come up with. What do you all think?

Yes, it is, it's a horrible decision to have to make. And I truly TRULY know the meaning of the phrase, "Ignorance is bliss."

Environmentalists like RFK Jr. and even John Kerry a few months ago, quoted the figure that 1 in 6 women have high enough mercury load in their bodies to potentially harm their fetuses. It's a tragedy. And I'll my comments about politics.

Just be careful re: chelation diet. Not sure what you are referring to but any "natural" methods of chelation such as cilantro or chlorella will indeed mobilize mercury, which is what chelation does. And if it does mobilize out of your organs, more goes to your bloodstream and more will go into your bm or fetus.

[JaneS]

Originally Posted by mama2toddles

Thank you. I thought I remembered reading something like that. Do you have any links with more info or studies about the DMSA being bad for those with fillings? I would love to help my ND be more informed on this.

The best thing to do is get Andrew Cutler's book, he is a researcher that has devoted many years to the study of mercury toxicity and explains it very well. I got it from a inter library loan.

Originally Posted by mama2toddles

Is the hair test you mentioned by chance the same as the $25 one Greenpeace is currently offering? (https://secureusa.greenpeace.org/mercury/)

No, the Greenpeace hair test is just for mercury and it is only accurate for 1/3 of mercury toxic people I believe. The Hair Elements test is comprehensive for mercury, lead, aluminum, antimony, tin, etc. all heavy metals, plus all needed minerals such as calcium, selenium, magnesium, etc. Andrew Cutler's book explains why this is important... mercury impairs mineral transport, so the relationship between them will reveal if a problem is occuring.

http://home.earthlink.net/~moriam/HOW_TO_hair_test.html

More info on mercury testing and the subleties of different test at this site:
http://www.healing-arts.org/children/holmes.htm

Thank you for that link, it's a good one.

[JaneS]

Originally Posted by applejuice

I have not read any of the other threads on this subject, HOWEVER, I did ask my sister, a pediatric dentist, if I could have all of my amalgam fillings removed and then have a porcelain or non mercury filling replace all of them...she said I could, but I would also perhaps be scraping off a miniscule but precious layer of my own tooth in the process...

...do not know if she was telling the truth to me or trying to talk me out of it.

Personally, I think a layer of my teeth is a small price to pay to stop mercury being vaporized into my body 24 hrs. a day. I don't understand the theory really.... how is a layer of tooth so precious? I guess it depends on how deep your cavities are, whether the tooth can be saved or not. Is one bad tooth or even 2 worth the many effects a toxic metal like mercury can have on your body and your brain?
http://www.noamalgam.com/#WHAT%20IT%20DOES
http://www.noamalgam.com/#diseases

Several of my fillings were old, chipping and had to be removed anyway. Thank goodness I didn't listen to my conventional dentist who wanted to drill them out when I was pg!

The information about mercury amalgam is only gradually becoming known. Most dentists believe it to be perfectly safe because that is what they are told. The ADA would never come out and say mercury fillings are dangerous. Can you imagine the uproar and lawsuits? Every person in the country must have them. It's mind boggling.

So the ADA doesn't do studies on safety either. Certain states have pulled the credentials of dentists who won't place amalgam fillings and openly say that they are not safe.

[zanelee]

:

[Aquaduct]

I personally think you would be ok to have mercury fillings removed while breastfeeding, if you did it properly. The main thing is to saturate your body with sodium ascorbate (like 60 grams) a couple of hours beforehand, and take a whole lot more for the rest of the day, close to bowel tolerance.

Take plenty of selenium also, as it also chelates.

Now that ought to take care of any mercury you inevitably will breath in as the fillings are taken out.

If you want to do it cheaply, you don't have to go to a specialist holistic dentist by the way. I have done it both ways ie. gone to a holistic specialist, and a cheaper ordinary dentist. The former used a special nose pressure gadget which was supposed to prevent me from breathing in vapour, plus rubber dam. The latter, just the rubber dam. I had all of my mercury fillings removed on 4 separate occasions, once with the conventional guy, and thrice with the holistic. And only on one occasion did I get affected by mercury and that was when on one occasion when I saw the holistic dentist I forgot to take the full mega dosage of vitamin C!!!

I ought to add that I am extremely sensitive to mercury due to a health condition, and I can easily become alienated feeling, get insomnia and tired, if I come into contact. Like I said, this only happened when I didn't take enough vitamin C beforehand. You have to take reasonably large amounts too over the following 2 or 3 days too, though not as large as on the day.

And yes, I agree that having mercury fillings while pregnant is very bad potentially for unborn children. The fetus is a kind of cul de sac repository for the mercury that is circulating in the maternal bloodstream....it has nowhere to go, and so starts concentrating. Unlike the mother the fetus doesn't have any bile to "chelate" out the mercury. So studies have shown fetuses can have up to 40 times more concentration of mercury than the mother.

In Mimamata, Japan, where a fishing village got contaminated by eating fish full of mercury from industrial effluent in the 1950s, it was found that a mother could be seemingly unaffected by mercury she had ingested, yet give birth to malformed by mercury babies. They called it "Mimamata disease".

[zanelee]

You have to take reasonably large amounts too over the following 2 or 3 days too, though not as large as on the day.

The main thing is to saturate your body with sodium ascorbate (like 60 grams) a couple of hours beforehand, and take a whole lot more for the rest of the day, close to bowel tolerance.

Take plenty of selenium also, as it also chelates.

If you don't mind...how do you know this? I'm needing some dental work, am breastfeeding 2, and want to be as safe as possible. Is there some book or website where I might find out safety guidlines or something?
TIA

[Aquaduct]

I just explained. I am extremely sensitive to toxins. I know what subtle mercury poisoning feels like. You can't help but not breath in some mercury vapour when it is drilled out I have decided, even when you do all the protocols. By taking the vit. c you will take care of the small amount that gets into your bloodstream.

I did all the recommended protocols, but forgot to take enough vit. c, and it affected me, on one occasion. My holistic dentist doesn't wear an oxygen mask, and told me he takes massive amounts of sodium ascorbate every day, as he is often drilling out amalgam fillings.

Anyway, obviously you need to do your own research as well. Check out halhuggins.com and Boyd Haley's site too. garynull.com might be worth checking too.

Chorella is another chelator of mercury in the bloodstream. They use it in Germany.

The only problem with taking vast amounts of vit. C while breastfeeding is that it will start releasing toxins stored in your body thru the breastmilk. But you have to weigh it all up. I think if you did that just for a few days it will be ok for your breastfed children. You would have to monitor the situation. If your child started throwing up after a feed....well that would mean a lot of toxins coming out. You might want to stop.

[3_opihi]

Holy crap you guys! I know this is an old thread, but I am freaking out right now. I have a mercury filling in almost every single one of my teeth, except for the front ones. And I have alot of the symptoms of mercury poisoning...autoimmune issues, depression, ADD, asthma...omg!!!

So, is this curable? I also have a 14 month old dd who I am breastfeeding. I would like to nurse her until she's at least 2.

Seriously, I', totally freaking out. Please talk me down someone!!!

[JaneS]

See 'Metal Fillings replaced while Breastfeeding' thread:

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=241750

The best advice I can give you is to learn about superior nutrition for your body and your child's body to detox and deal with this naturally. The Nutrition/Immunity 101 thread is a good place to start.