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please help, need advice on what to tell friends who are planning on circ  

post #1 of 7
Thread Starter 
hi all,

listen, i am really frustrated and really don't know what else to say to my friend. let me give you some history.

a really good friend of mine, who is on this list and myself have little boys, we chose not to circumsize after doing the research by reading lots of material.

a friend who is pregnant with a boy, in the middle of her pregnancy asks us if we circ. we said no, she said oh good cause i don't want to, non of my brothers are, but my husband wants too. so we talked about it and gave her some info to tell her husband. then we loaned her the natural family living book. for her and her husband to read the circ. chapt.
personally i thought it was a pretty convincing chapt if you ask me.
her husband just said it is biased.
so we told her to research it.
so she is due in 2 weeks.
yesterday she comes over. and it is just me and her (thankfully the latest mothering mag just arrived) and i ask if they made a decision.
she said they are probably going to do it cause every person she talked to says it is ok and has done it except for me and my other friend.

so apparently her form of research is asking around her mainstream friends and their opinions. i gave her the mag to read while i nursed my son, i don;t know if she read the whole article. i tried to tell her we are the only industrialized nation who routinely performs the SURGERY. she said she has heard from people about infections if you do not circ. i said what about infections from the surgery itself. what about complications, scarring, hemorraging.

anyway, i could see i was making her uncomfortable. so i stopped, cause i didn't know what else to say, my friend who would help me in this matter is away in london. her husband is around and i talked to her husband (the one who did Not circ his son ) and my husband. they might send the guy who wants to circ his son an email.

get this. the only reason my friend wants to circ. his son is that so his son will look like him.

i am so frustrated. i dont know what to do. i mean am i just supposed to let it go? who is going to be a voice for this unborn child?
what pisses me off, is she was originally against it, but now is going to go ahead and do it so her baby can look like his father.

um...forgive me....but really....how does a tiny baby penis or childs penis actually look like a full grown males. ? my husband says by the time they actually look like each other-it is a topic that you just wouldn't discuss anyway.

anyway....if youare reading this far...thank you. you are obviously committed to the cause.
please tell me what else we should do in this situation, if i just need to stop and let her make her choice.

thank you.
stephani
post #2 of 7
I get vicious on this topic. Personally in your shoes I would say something along the lines of - please don't hack off a hunk of your baby's penis- it's barbaric. When research doesn't get them sometimes shock value will.

BUT, this is coming from someone who would cut off family and friends who chose to circ. their child after they had the information.

-Angela
post #3 of 7
s to you for trying so hard Stephani! Have you looked in the thread above titiles "Web Resources"? There is a lot of great info there. If they have a computer maybe you could send them some info with your favourite links attached.

There is a link in my siggy that has all of the methods of circumcision used, maybe a video will change his mind? Or seeing some of the common circumcision complications? There is also a great article called "Separated at Birth" that was in Men's Health Magazine. Very mainstream and geared towards men.
http://www.noharmm.org/separated.htm

Here is an article entitled "Like Father Like Son" that also may be of some help,
http://www.mothersagainstcirc.org/Like-Son.htm

Maybe mention to your friend that "Look like Daddy" is a lousy reason to put a baby through the pain and risk of circumcision. What's next, baby nose jobs if he doesn't have Daddy's nose?

I know this is hard, a friend of mine just did the same thing a few years ago. Given my strong feelings about this topic, our 15year friendship has sadly become distant since then. Not just because of that mind you, our parenting styles are, shall we say, polar oppisites.

I hope you have better luck than I had.

Take care,
Tara
post #4 of 7
I left this decision up to my dh (who is circumcized). He decided that it was better not to circ and let ds make that decision for himself when he was older.
post #5 of 7
Ask her if her husband is insisting that their little boy be surgically altered on any other part of his body to match the dad.

My sons would need their noses broken, 2 teeth removed with a baseball bat, and tattoos on their legs to match Sean. Oh and they'd need their foreskins ripped, crushed and sliced off too.
post #6 of 7
I would go over there and sit with her and make sure she watches the video at www.intact.ca

If she can't stand to watch it, ask her what makes her think her baby boy should have to SURVIVE that happening to him.

Ask her to imagine her dh as a tiny baby strapped down like the baby in the video - because it is 99.99 % certain her dh didn't get any pain relief.
post #7 of 7
Quote:
Originally Posted by stargazersteph
she said they are probably going to do it cause every person she talked to says it is ok and has done it except for me and my other friend.

so apparently her form of research is asking around her mainstream friends and their opinions.
Yep, this is what I call making medical decisions by an opinion poll of people who have absolutely no medical background. It is the most pathetic excuse for research I can imagine. Would she poll those same people for an opinion on thorasic surgery over the information available from legitimate medical sources? I suspect not.


Quote:
get this. the only reason my friend wants to circ. his son is that so his son will look like him.
Circumcision of the masses is a fairly recent thing. There's a fair chance his father was intact. Ask him if he knows. If his father is circumcisied, it's a pretty sure thing that his grandfather is intact and definitly all of the men in his family before that were intact. Why is he so insecure in himself that he has to make his son the scarred image of himself? Is this vanity or immaturity? Get the jist?


Quote:
um...forgive me....but really....how does a tiny baby penis or childs penis actually look like a full grown males. ? my husband says by the time they actually look like each other-it is a topic that you just wouldn't discuss anyway.
Most men have no idea whether their father was circumcised or not, they just assume because they were that their father is as well. What is it about this man that wants to force something on his family that was forced on his forebears by some unknown medical hack? Shouldn't he be proud that his son has his nose or eyes? Why the penis that he won't be going around jerking his son's pants down and jerking his pants down saying "Just look at that d**k and look at mine! They look just alike, don't they? That's my boy!!!"

It will be the father's DNA that put that foreskin there. Does he want to deny his own DNA? Does he really want to make it appear that his son has aposthia which is from defective genetic material and the child is born without a foreskin or perfect DNA and a perfect penis passed down the family line from the father?



Frank

anyway....if youare reading this far...thank you. you are obviously committed to the cause.
please tell me what else we should do in this situation, if i just need to stop and let her make her choice.

thank you.
stephani[/QUOTE]
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