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"That's good, for a girl"  

post #1 of 22
9/15/05 at 11:07pm
Thread Starter 
Last night, while my DH and DD were sort of playing boxing/karate, I heard my DH say "That was good, for a girl."



I nearly flipped! I told him that was insulting his wife and daughter (the two people he cares most about) because we are female.

He smirked and tried to sort of laugh it off. I pressed, and he finally apologized (with the smirk just barely off his face).

I've had a very VERY stressful week (very little sleep, my dog died, I started a new job), and maybe I was being too sensitive.

What do you think? How would you react to someone saying that to your daughter (or ANY little girl)? Was I wrong, or did he need to apologize?
post #2 of 22
9/15/05 at 11:21pm
I'd be pretty ticked too. He owes you (and your DD) a real appology, IMO
post #3 of 22
9/15/05 at 11:35pm
Oh, I would flip my lid over this one. He absolutely owes you an apology on hands and knees. Where does he get off implying to you and your dd that women/girls are "less than" than men/boys?
post #4 of 22
9/15/05 at 11:54pm
depends on how he says it. if he was just teasing it was one thing, but if he was serious it is totally different. I have said that to my dd joking and she usually responds by kicking my but :LOL it is just a joke.
post #5 of 22
9/16/05 at 12:06am
If it wasn't something that you feel comfortable with him joking about then he shouldn't be joking about it.

-Angela
post #6 of 22
9/16/05 at 2:04am
it is one of those things where context matters a lot. even if he meant it i wouldnt take it so personally as he was probably making an observation. for instance my ex taught our dd how to throw ball so she wouldnt throw underhand like a girl. when he said that i understood the context of what he was saying.

now if he discouraged his dd taking karate lessons because she was a girl - i would be furious.
post #7 of 22
9/16/05 at 2:07am
No, you don't say that to a little girl. It's a way of saying that girls do things in an inferior way. It's hard to break old habits, but your dh wouldn't want you to say "That half-hearted smirking apology wasn't too bad...for a MAN." Right?
post #8 of 22
9/16/05 at 2:16am
Quote:
Originally Posted by captain optimism
No, you don't say that to a little girl. It's a way of saying that girls do things in an inferior way. It's hard to break old habits, but your dh wouldn't want you to say "That half-hearted smirking apology wasn't too bad...for a MAN." Right?
:
post #9 of 22
9/16/05 at 5:54am
The whole point of martial arts is that it ISN'T about brute strength- that it's about using your body's resources to their maximum capability in order to outwit a bigger opponent. This is why men and women train alongside each other.
I know it's evil, but are there any women he trains with regularly? I'm sure they'd like the opportunity to- erm, set the record straight for you. In the meantime, he's overdue a flash of realisation of what, exactly, fathering a girl really means.
post #10 of 22
9/16/05 at 6:09am
That is absolutely unacceptable. Even if it's said joking but friendly, it plants seeds in a little girl's mind that she is naturally inferior. It is so, so hard to raise an emotionally healthy girl to, and through adolescence! I would get your DH some books like Reviving Ophelia and Growing a Girl and stick them next to the toilet where he can't ignore them.
post #11 of 22
9/16/05 at 7:20am
IMO apology is needed for the you and your dd. It may give inferiority to your child.
post #12 of 22
9/16/05 at 8:51am
Quote:
Originally Posted by meemee
it is one of those things where context matters a lot. even if he meant it i wouldnt take it so personally as he was probably making an observation. for instance my ex taught our dd how to throw ball so she wouldnt throw underhand like a girl. when he said that i understood the context of what he was saying.
Ummm, girls aren't born throwing balls underhand while boys naturally throw overhand. That's cultural just like everything else.

Substitute just about any other group for "girl" and you can see how offensive the statement is..

"You do that really well....for a (racial group) (religious group) (whatever)."

Sexism is just as bad as racism.
post #13 of 22
9/16/05 at 12:26pm
:

WQhether he was joking or not, it's inappropriate. I'm sure most men, if asked, would say they do not want their daughters growing up believing that they are inferior to men and boys.

I think the expectation that boys are just naturally more athletic or physically agile is so deeply ingrained in most men that even if they do not think of themselves as sexist, this sort of thing comes out every once in a while. They probably don't even realize that those beliefs are there.

However, your husband's smirk would bug me. Seems disrespectful.
post #14 of 22
9/16/05 at 2:30pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quirky
Substitute just about any other group for "girl" and you can see how offensive the statement is..

Sexism is just as bad as racism.
post #15 of 22
9/16/05 at 3:09pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by captain optimism
It's a way of saying that girls do things in an inferior way.
That's it! That's exactly why I got upset, but I couldn't find those words. He said it in a joking way, but I still got very upset. It's just sexist to say something like that, even if you are joking, IMO.

My dd said it didn't hurt her feelings, but I was just terribly offended.

DH and I haven't talked about it again. I think that he understood that it is NOT acceptable to me. But if it happens again, I am going to have some talks with him - not one, several.

Thanks for all your responses.
post #16 of 22
9/16/05 at 3:13pm
You're not being oversensitive- even if he didn't mean it to be anything negative, it's innapropriate, period.

But, I guess the comment wasn't all that bad, for a man :LOL
post #17 of 22
9/16/05 at 3:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ann-Marita
That's it! That's exactly why I got upset, but I couldn't find those words. He said it in a joking way, but I still got very upset. It's just sexist to say something like that, even if you are joking, IMO.

My dd said it didn't hurt her feelings, but I was just terribly offended.

DH and I haven't talked about it again. I think that he understood that it is NOT acceptable to me. But if it happens again, I am going to have some talks with him - not one, several.

Thanks for all your responses.
I think you shouldn't wait until it happens again. I think you should find a calm moment (yeah I know) and bring it up when you are not emotional. What subtle messages is he giving your daughter? That, in fact, she isn't a good/capable/knowledgeable/ etc as a boy. It isn't just that it's not acceptable to you, it's that it belies an underlying prejudice that GIRLS aren't as capable as boys. Is this REALLY what he wants her to learn. Again, as a PP said, what if we used that term expression about black people or polish people. How would that feel to you DH? How does he think his DD will internalize those messages, not from society, but from her own family?
post #18 of 22
9/16/05 at 3:45pm
and PS - the President of Harvard got in BIG TROUBLE for hinting that girls are less capable in Math and Science than boys. NO - you are not being sensitive.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...2005Jan18.html
post #19 of 22
9/16/05 at 3:49pm
IMO it is important to help your dh realize that though such comments may be considered acceptable and standard by society, he should think twice before making them himself. Ask him what he really meant by it, and what he thought it implied. Frankly, I'm sure he wasn't thinking it would be considered hurtful. In fact, I'll bet he felt he was giving a huge compliment! (e.g. you did well - and the fact that you may have started at a disadvantage means you did better than someone who started off with more skills/ability than you have.) I think it's the assumption within that statement which we object to. Why should a girl be starting off at a disadvantage? Especially in martial arts? Perhaps helping him to see the assumption implied within the comment will show why it was offensive to you. But I highly recommend approaching him in a not-so-emotionally-charged time, and not taking too aggressive of a stance. It didn't seem that he really meant to be hurtful, and I'm guessing the smirk was a sign of his discomfort with being called out on regarding a comment he thought was a positive. Besides, he was having a good time with dd, and then it became uncomfortable. It doesn't excuse the smirk, but it might explain it.

Just my $.02, good luck.
post #20 of 22
9/16/05 at 4:45pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by captain optimism
No, you don't say that to a little girl. It's a way of saying that girls do things in an inferior way. It's hard to break old habits, but your dh wouldn't want you to say "That half-hearted smirking apology wasn't too bad...for a MAN." Right?

I agree. That would bother me quite a bit. We make a big effort even at this young age to encourage our daughter to choose activities that she enjoys not just "girl" activities or toys. Another Poster mentioned the book "growing a girl" -- "things will be different for my daughter" by Mindy Bingham is another excellent book (not to throw at your DH, but for the two of you to use as a resouce - it's a great book!)
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