Natural Consequences

[ebensmama]

Hi, I'm new to this forum. DH and I have a 2 yo DS and a 1 mo DS. Our older son has really been asserting his independence lately, which is great, except sometimes it's dangerous or hurtful to others.

DH and I are really working hard to GD, but we're stumped when it comes to natural consequences for some things. I'm looking for suggestions on how to handle things such as when DS climbs the tall toy storage units in the playroom, jumps on the couch near whomever is holding the baby, or throws things near the baby.

I have to say, for the jumping I've suggested other places for him to jump. If it's jumping that he's really into, he will move and jump on pillows on the floor...but sometimes he seems to more enjoy that he gets a reaction from jumping dangerously close to his little brother. We always firmly but respectfully say to him, "Eben, please get down from the furniture," (or "don't jump near Arlo," or "don't throw your ball near Arlo...but we always use "please" and speak in a non-threatening tone of voice), but he is in the stage where he often just tells us no, and we're left frustrated, sometimes angry, and scratching our heads.

I don't want to do time outs or resort to types of punishment that are irrelevant to what he's done in the first place. We've tried rationalizing w/ him 'til we're nearly blue in the face, and though he sometimes responds immediately, the same dangerous or hurtful behaviors crop up again in the next hour or day.

What I really don't like about the situation is that b/c we are out of ideas, we're becoming increasingly frustrated w/ ourselves, and I fear we will end up letting out our frustrations by yelling. I'd really like to hear some constructive options that we could use w/out having to time out or punish, so that we can start implementing new strategies before we start into a negative pattern of losing our cool.

TIA!

[nonconformnmom]

In my experience, in situations that involve safety concerns, I tend to use redirection rather than natural consequences because those consequences could result in one or more children getting hurt. My suggestion is to try redirecting to a different activity and see if that works for you.

[**guest**]

we found immediate time-ins rather than natural consequences work best if dd is acting out with respect to her baby brother. he really wants your attention.

i usually try to get dd close to me, on my lap, if possible, hug her, give her lots of love, and make sure she gets relaxed. when she is relaxed i tell her that her behaviour was dangerous and unacceptable.

this way she is much more receptive to the corrections. in the first weeks after ds was born i tried natural consequences, and she was getting defencive and more agitated.

now most of the time she would just say 'oh, okay mommy' and run off playing happily. not always :LOL , of course. but i find that if i do it 'right', she responds really well. if i have my own agendas, or if i am impatient or angry, then she feels it, and keeps on acting out, or runs away from me.

i found Hold on To your Kids by Gordon Neufeld really helpful in terms of implementing discipline that does not divide -- thinking 'relationship first', individual behaviours and consequences are not as important.

[Dal]

One minor idea that may help a bit. I've read that always telling an older sibling: "Careful! Baby might get hurt!" is less apt to be effective than "Please be careful, somebody might get hurt." This takes the focus away from the baby, who is already a source of jealousy.

Maybe you could try doing without punishments altogether (including natural consequences). A child who knows that her or his parents are deliberately allowing them to suffer (incuding cases of not offering help "because you've put yourself into that situation" or whatever) is apt to feel hostile or less trusting of the parent, which may create more power struggles (and other issues) and thus less desire on your child's part to be co-operative.

[**guest**]

Originally Posted by Dal

One minor idea that may help a bit. I've read that always telling an older sibling: "Careful! Baby might get hurt!" is less apt to be effective than "Please be careful, somebody might get hurt." This takes the focus away from the baby, who is already a source of jealousy.

ITA. i do this a lot. i used to say 'we have to be quite so that the baby won't wake up' but now i changed it to' we have to be quiet in the bedroom because EVERYBODY is asleep'. i try to keep 'the baby' out of my reasoning as much as possible.

[katallen]

I just pick my daughter up and carry her away from what she is doing that I don't want her to do and it takes about a billion times the first day that she has found a delightful new skill that I don't want her doing but after that things are a lot easier. As for consequences I have no idea. I am not big on punshment or rationalizing. I give her a reason why I don't want her to do something and I tell her that I will help her not do it if she needs me to and then I help her. I don't get angry or punish, I just bring her to do something else with me and that has worked for us. A lot of behavior is for attention so if you think he is doing this for attention try to find plenty of time to give him positive attention so he doesn't do dangerous things for negative attention.

[little bird]

Originally Posted by ebensmama

DH and I have a 2 yo DS


though he sometimes responds immediately, the same dangerous or hurtful behaviors crop up again in the next hour or day.

when our DS was 2, there was a lot of repeated (and undesired) behavior. no matter what we tryed, it was repeated, and after a few weeks, he'd be onto something else. i think that is just an age where they don't have the capability to perform perfect behavior, remember all the rules, and always act appropriotly, they are just unable. wait it out, and try redirecting him, but he will just row out of that eventually!

[ebensmama]

Thank you all so much!

I see how consequences are a moot point in these situations. I read a few of these responses two days ago and tried redirection with much more success! DS was couch-jumping at my Grandma's that night, but I was able to divert him by asking him to get me a blanket that was across the room. I've found he enjoys being a helper, so I'm going to use that in redirecting.

Also, I never even considered how annoying it must be for him to have all sorts of rules and requests made that revolve around the baby. It's a great suggestion to generalize, and leave the baby out of the picture.

I think if DH and I can work on our patience, we are going to see a lot more success w/ redirection. Eben is extrordinarily bright, and I think we forget he's only two because of his intelligence. Two is definitely pretty young to be perfectly behaved. When I see other two year olds, that makes perfect sense, but I have trouble applying the logic to my own kiddo b/c I'm thrown by how he does not act two on any other level.

Thanks, mamas!

[TripMom]

Originally Posted by ebensmama

I'm looking for suggestions on how to handle things such as when DS climbs the tall toy storage units in the playroom, jumps on the couch near whomever is holding the baby, or throws things near the baby.

I don't know if this has already been said . . .but all of these examples are inappropriate for "natural consequences" because they involve danger to the child or danger to another (in these e.g.s - the baby).