am I right or am I right?

[Piglet68]

So I've been learning so much from reading these threads, and starting to rethink things that I've always taken for granted.

I was looking at DD the other day, musing to myself about how beautiful and innocent she is, and how sad it was that soon she would find out how mean the real world can be. Soon she will discover that kids will find something, anything, that is "different" about her and tease her and make her feel horrible inside for something she has no control over. I always thought it was just "human nature", that it was just normal for kids to do this to each other.

But now that I'm learning about homeschooling, I'm starting to question whether this IS in fact unavoidable, and "normal". Is it normal for kids to spend the majority of their time in a group of kids only their own age? Does a mix of ages prevent this sort of nastiness from happening? Is the phenomenon of the bully, the hierarchy of "cool" vs "nerds", the whole lot of it..is it necessary? Is it normal? Or is it some nasty byproduct of schooling?

How liberating it is to discover these things!

[ekblad9]

We just got back from our homeschooling Christmas party. (We always do it after Christmas and New Year's so that more people can come). Anyway, as I watched the kids playing I noticed how all of the kids were involved in each activity without age bounderies of any kind. There were 14 year olds playing tag with 10 year olds and 4 year olds. My 6 year old was painting and playing play dough with 8 year olds and 2 year olds. The older kids look out for the younger kids. It's really amazing to me. I, like you, took for granted that there would be teasing and hurt feelings and that my kids would get along best with only kids their own ages. I was very wrong. My ds1 was subjected to PS for the first four years of his schooling. It was a nightmare. And I noticed how he was seperated from his siblings because they were "little" or "babies". It's not like that at all anymore. We've been HS for a year and a half and they are the best of friends. Yes, they fight, but they also look out for eachother, play games together, build snow forts for hours together. It's a wonderful thing to watch.

[khrisday]

I don't think that spending the day separated into peer groups is normal for children, and I think that it's this isolation that breeds the social heirarchy. Just because you homeschool does not mean that your child will not encounter teasing, bullies, and cliques (o yes, it happens to homeschoolers, too), but they won't be spending 6 hours a day in that atmosphere, nor will they be out of parental supervision.

[SagMom]

Originally posted by ekblad7
My ds1 was subjected to PS for the first four years of his schooling. It was a nightmare. And I noticed how he was seperated from his siblings because they were "little" or "babies". It's not like that at all anymore. We've been HS for a year and a half and they are the best of friends. Yes, they fight, but they also look out for eachother, play games together, build snow forts for hours together. It's a wonderful thing to watch.

Change the timeframes (my ds1 was subjected to ps for 3 years--and we're in our 3rd year of hsing) and I could have written this! It is, indeed a wonderful thing to watch!

I think a lot has to do with competition as well. In ps the kids are competing for the teacher's attention and recognition, for grades, for awards, for stars, etc. etc. etc. At home, I've seen them cheer each other on, and help each other out rather than trying to beat each other. They do sometimes argue of course and push each other's buttons, but overall, life is more peaceful and best of all, my kids are FRIENDS.

[sha_lyn]

Just the other day my 13 DS was playing with a friends almost 1 yr old. She look at him and said "you know you just wouldn't see a 13 in PS that would play with little kids like he does". A couple of weeks earlier we were at the 3 brithday party for her older DS. My DS was great at keeping up with watching over the younger kids at Chuckie Cheese.

Back up 2 yrs ago (or more) when he was still in PS. He wouldn't play with kids 2 yrs younger than him because his friends (one in particular) would make fun of him. Even when DS was 5 this kid teased him (the kid was a yr older) because he watched Barney.

[hahamommy]

You are sooo right Piglet!

I was just thinking of this the other day... in *my* life, looking at the friends I have ~ as adults, you're friends and even peers with others in a wide range of ages, why are you kept from these people for a vital 13+years of your life?? I'm saddened to think that even if we had all grown up in the same town, we wouldn't have had much in common as traditional schooling prevented it. My very best friends are 5 years older and 8 years younger than me... we would have *never* interacted during those oh so important developmental years! I'm so glad to have them now
Though my kids tend to stick with kids their own ages, they have no problem spending time with those older or younger, probably because no one has told them they can't.

Keep up the good work mommies! We'll eradicate age-ism one homeschooler at a time!!

~diana

[RainbowMom]

Even as I write this, my just turned 7 year old daughter is running around with her dear friends, two girls who happen to be sisters, ages almost 6 and almost 8. So, if they were all in school, they'd probably be kindergarten, first grade, and second grade and never even meet each other and have this wonderful friendship. Maybe they'd have 20 minutes together on the playground, whooppee! Is that enough time to meet and develop a friendship with all the chaos going on at recess?

They met a the homeschool center where we gather weekly just for fun, though sometimes someone will offer a planned craft, activity or class. There they have hours to play together inside and out with very few toys but big imaginations. And there I see kids from 3 to 16 playing all kinds of games together weekly, and everyone enjoying themselves immensely! In fact, the older sister-friend of my daughter announced one day that she was going to produce a play and anyone who wanted to be in it could. Over the next two months, she wrote the script, organized (with a lot of help from mom and dad) the cast which included these kids of all ages who willingly volunteered and drove several towns away for rehearsals, secured a hall with stage to perform, etc. It was fabulous for everyone! That would never happen in PS.

I have come to believe that from the first day of school, kids begin to realized that they are being judged and ranked by their teachers. This unspoken ranking permeates the knowing of all children and their parents. Therefore, even children who are at or near the "top" of the ranking begin to feel insecure as they realize how hard they have to work to stay there, and children at the "bottom" feel they can never get to the top, and kids in the middle feel just "average", like nothing too great is ever expected from them. I suspect this has a lot to do with how kids come to treat each other in some of the mean ways they do. They aren't truly encouraged to be themselves for the sake of being themselves; they know they are in competition with one another. But they don't feel secure with this ambiguous competition going on so they niggle at each other, trying to make themselves feel superior and better about themselves by making someone else feel their inferiority in some way. I know a lot of adults who continue to do this for the same reasons. They don't feel secure in their relationships, jobs, etc. Despite all the self-esteem boosting teachers claim they try to do, as long as this ranking goes on, children will know they are not valued for themselves.

I just hope I never have to subject my kids to that kind of environment again!

Beth

[bestjob]

I think homeschooling is great for many families, but I'm starting to feel like my children are being insulted! They go to public school and they are kind, loving children who do play with kids of either sex and either age quite happily. Their peer group is an important influence on them, but it isn't the only one.

[anythingelse]

I agree that a multiage grouping of children has some wonderful benefits kids do not normally get in a traditional classroom. Maria Montessori wrote extensively on this and modeled her groupings of 6-12 yr olds and 3-6 yr olds in her schools to ensure the children would experience the advantages.
It is one of the reasons we value homeschooling- seeing how our children have bonded with each other so well and are able to make friends and interact with others despite age/sex differences. The chance to work with other grade levels or be best friends with a child of the opposite sex did not occur in the public schools my older kids attended.

[Piglet68]

bestjob, I'm sorry if you felt offended. I wasn't meaning to say all kids in ps are horror shows. I am just really excited about the way my research into homeschooling is changing the way I think, the things I took for granted.

I remember all too well the teasing, the class hierarchy of cool kids vs the non-popular ones. I don't know many people who don't look back on those years as very tough and often hurtful ones.

The possibility that it might not be "inevitable" or "just the way kids are" is a huge revelation to me. I am starting to see that it just isn't natural, and maybe not even in a kid's best interest, to group kids together of just the same age.

None of this is meant to say all ps kids are bad. I'm just thinking out loud here...

[ekblad9]

I don't think it's the kids themselves that go to PS are bad. To me, it's the situation. Ds1 went to PS and I thought he was a great kid. When I pulled him out he was even better. I just think the way they are seperated in the schools make them more likely to stick with children of their own age groups. Not all children are like that, of course, it's just been my expereince. No one should feel insulted here. The majority of us on this forum homeschool so we think it's the best way to go. I try not to read the "learning at school" threads b/c I know at some point I would feel insulted!