Intact & catheters?

[Leiahs]

So since I started visiting this board, I've seen several mentions of intact boys and problems with getting a catheter. Are the doctors/nurses performing them just doing it wrong, or should they not be doing it at all (as in, is there a different way to collect urine?) And if I ever have to take DS into the hospital where they might want to put in a catheter, what should I be watching out for, and how *should* they be doing things? I just want to make sure I am educated on this front in case of an emergency where I can't consult the boards.

[wendy1221]

They sould be able to insert the cath w/out retracting, ut the idiot nurses almost always try to. I had to physically remove the hand of a nurse when ds2 needed cathed. So she had to call ina more experienced nurse who had the nerve to lecture me on not circing.

[MCatLvrMom2A&X]

Are the doctors/nurses performing them just doing it wrong, or should they not be doing it at all (as in, is there a different way to collect urine?)

Sometimes they can do a urine catch using a bag, it is kinda like a ziplock back but has adheasive that ataches to the skin around the penis and when they pee it goes in the baggy. Most dr that I have read about here tho dont do this method as they say it is to easy to contaminate.

And if I ever have to take DS into the hospital where they might want to put in a catheter, what should I be watching out for, and how *should* they be doing things?

Before the dr/nurse even removes the diaper u ask them r they familiar with how to cath a intact penis in a baby/young unretractable? If they say it is the same as circed then u know they dont know what they r doing. U make sure to tell them that they r in no way to retract even the tiniest bit. The proper way to cath. as I have read it here is to insert the cath tip into the forskin opening and sort of "fish" around for the opening in the tip of the penis. If the person doing the cath is familiar with this it is simple for them to perform. U have to be prepaired to stop the proceedure by actually taking there hands away if they show any sign that they r gonna pull down the forskin any amount at all. Because they have no idea how far is gonna hurt ur little guy because all babies r different on the amount that will tear the skin.

A big for u that u r looking into this just in case. The odds of this being a issue for u tho r truly very tiny. But I know what it is like to worry.

[shaylahc]

My 13 mos old son has unfortunately been catheterized several times. The first few times I was lucky and the nurses who did it did a wonderful job. I told them ahead of time that I did not want him retracted, and they respected my wishes. The 3rd time, however, I got a cocky nurse who retracted my DS SO fast I did not have time to react. My son SCREAMED (and I will NEVER forget that scream) and the %^%^&% nurse had the nerve to tell me it had retracted all by itself when she pulled on it just a little (which is total bull^&*&^). She ended up ripping his foreskin in several places I was SO angry---I felt like I had done what I could to avoid the situation (I clearly told the nurse ahead of time that she did NOT have my permission to retract his foreskin) but it was futile. The %^*&^ retracted him anyway. I ended up calling up the ER manager the next day and raised holy hell, made sure this nurse never ever did this again, and sent literature to the ER manager AND spoke to her several times to make sure she understood that you should NEVER retract a baby or small child. Apparently the people at that ER are pretty behind on the times, and I have never taken any of my children to that hospital again.

If my son needed to be catheterized again in the future, before I laid him down I would tell the nurse that she absolutely did not have my permission to retract him, and that unless she could do it without retracting him that she did not have my permission to perform the procedure at all and needed to find someone who could do it without retracting him. Unfortunately, once the procedure starts if the person chooses not to listen about the only thing you CAN do is simply watch them closely and call them on it if they do it. If the situation ever arose again I would raise holy hell right then and there, when it happened to me I was so shocked and angry I didn't know WHAT to do. Now I know to make a huge stink and make sure that is ingrained in that nurse's brain so that it never happens to anymore babies again.

We do what we can to protect our little ones, but unfortunately sometimes it doesn't always work To this day I feel horrible that my son had to go through that. He had scabs on his foreskin for a week and was in a lot of pain It still makes me sad and angry to this day.

[LoveChild421]

I was taken off guard on this matter- I took ds in to the ER for a severe chest cold and low and behold they wanted to cath him to rule out a UTI! I had not anticipated that and had no idea what to say or do- my mom was with me thank goodness and just told them that "no he is not getting cathed, he isn't in pain when he pees and there's no sense in putting him through that" so they agreed to let us use the little ziplock bag taped over the penis to collect the urine.

so in the future I think I will always ask for the bag instead of a cath unless it's absolutely necessary- I've been cathed and it hurts like a

[bunniemunch]

Originally Posted by shaylahc

My 13 mos old son has unfortunately been catheterized several times. The first few times I was lucky and the nurses who did it did a wonderful job. I told them ahead of time that I did not want him retracted, and they respected my wishes. The 3rd time, however, I got a cocky nurse who retracted my DS SO fast I did not have time to react. My son SCREAMED (and I will NEVER forget that scream) and the %^%^&% nurse had the nerve to tell me it had retracted all by itself when she pulled on it just a little (which is total bull^&*&^). She ended up ripping his foreskin in several places I was SO angry---I felt like I had done what I could to avoid the situation (I clearly told the nurse ahead of time that she did NOT have my permission to retract his foreskin) but it was futile. The %^*&^ retracted him anyway. I ended up calling up the ER manager the next day and raised holy hell, made sure this nurse never ever did this again, and sent literature to the ER manager AND spoke to her several times to make sure she understood that you should NEVER retract a baby or small child. Apparently the people at that ER are pretty behind on the times, and I have never taken any of my children to that hospital again.

If my son needed to be catheterized again in the future, before I laid him down I would tell the nurse that she absolutely did not have my permission to retract him, and that unless she could do it without retracting him that she did not have my permission to perform the procedure at all and needed to find someone who could do it without retracting him. Unfortunately, once the procedure starts if the person chooses not to listen about the only thing you CAN do is simply watch them closely and call them on it if they do it. If the situation ever arose again I would raise holy hell right then and there, when it happened to me I was so shocked and angry I didn't know WHAT to do. Now I know to make a huge stink and make sure that is ingrained in that nurse's brain so that it never happens to anymore babies again.

We do what we can to protect our little ones, but unfortunately sometimes it doesn't always work To this day I feel horrible that my son had to go through that. He had scabs on his foreskin for a week and was in a lot of pain It still makes me sad and angry to this day.

how did you stop yourself from hurting this nurse back, because i sure would have! poor lil guy. big hgus for u

[Frankly Speaking]

Originally Posted by bunniemunch

how did you stop yourself from hurting this nurse back, because i sure would have! poor lil guy. big hgus for u

I'm with you! I think I would have gotten very violent very quickly.



Frank

[Leiahs]

Originally Posted by bunniemunch

how did you stop yourself from hurting this nurse back, because i sure would have! poor lil guy. big hgus for u

No kidding, my gut reaction would have been to give that nurse a swift punch to the eye....

Thanks for the cath info, nice to be informed! The horror stories, awful as they are, at least do teach me what can happen if I'm not on my guard.

[aira]

Another ER horror at 8 weeks old here...

Basically, I could've written LoveCild421's post, with the exception that my mom (a nurse) would never side with me for anything (esp medical), and tried to stop me from the fit I did throw after the nurses retracted him faster than I could stop them.

I didn't even know that it was something they would do.

I also am haunted by my son's cry and the look of his face.

[hummingbear]

YAY

I am so glad you asked this question before you were in a situation that you could not ask it. It is so devastating to hear about the forced retractions that occur in the ER for the purpose of a catheter to catch a urine sample.

You are way ahead of things. The thread entitled "A Warning for Parents of Intact Sons" has a sentance about keeping watchful in the ER but it hasn't been there long. How would you suggest that we get this info out to all parents before they actually need it?

[travisandjill]

Originally Posted by aira

Another ER horror at 8 weeks old here...

Basically, I could've written LoveCild421's post, with the exception that my mom (a nurse) would never side with me for anything (esp medical), and tried to stop me from the fit I did throw after the nurses retracted him faster than I could stop them.

I didn't even know that it was something they would do.

I also am haunted by my son's cry and the look of his face.

Unfortunatly the SAME thing happened to my 8 week old (now 5 mos). My son was running a fever of 101 and my DR. told me to take him to the ER as babies under 3 mos old should not be having fevers at all! So I take him in and this male nurse comes in to take care of DS. I guess its standard procedure to cath a baby under 3 mos with fever to rule out UTI's. Now this was my first son, and being 23 I am a little ignorant I guess also but I assumed that nurses were "trained" how to take care of the intact penis. Boy was I wrong. After a half hour of trying to insert the cath and trying to retract my son, I couldnt take it anymore! I asked for another nurse to try to insert the cath(BTW my son was screaming thru all of this and I was also in tears). So the nurse calls a NICU female nurse to finish the cath. She comes down and inserts it in seconds! The male nurse tells me "Why didnt you circ your baby when he was born? Your gonna have to now!" I said why and he tells me "Its not normal to not be able to retract him". The male nurse said "I tried very hard and I could not retract your son!" That comment still sends chills down my spine. The first thing I did when I got home was to look up as much info of intact care as I could. I now know that the ER nurse was wrong and I will NEVER let my son endure that kind of pain again!

Jill

[aira]

So sorry Jill!

It really is traumatizing for mom and baby to have this experience.

Just hug your boy and tell him that you know better how to protect him now...

[hummingbear]

:

So sorry.

Look for the thread about the lawyer who is willing to contact health professionals who forcibly retract infants. If you can't find it I will look and edit my post.

[mattemma04]

//

[PuppyFluffer]

I think that if I were in this situation, I would clearly state that forced retraction is not necessary for this procedure. I would clearly state that forced tearing of my child's genital skin is sexual assault and that I would be persuing a legal case against the person and the establishment that employed them if it should occur. How this is not considered sexual assault is beyond me! I may even go so far as to have a written statement of this and require it to be signed before allowing any medical personel to touch my child. I wonder if they would sign it! Medical establishments have no trouble asking you to sign consent and liability releases. I wonder what they would do if the tables were turned?

[Devaskyla]

Until I started reading this forum, I never knew anyone ever cathed babies for any reason. My older ds had several urine samples done as a baby and they always used a bag. One nurse did look like she might be going to retract, but she was just wiping the end.

[orangebird]

Originally Posted by Devaskyla

Until I started reading this forum, I never knew anyone ever cathed babies for any reason. My older ds had several urine samples done as a baby and they always used a bag. One nurse did look like she might be going to retract, but she was just wiping the end.

It's hard to get a clean sample for a culture usng the bag method. They order us to do cath's frequently at the NICU I work in and I absolutely hate it. You definitely don't need to retract the foreskin on a boy to do one, but I think they are horrible to do to either sex baby. I think it is real easy to mess up one being done for a culture, especially on a girl. Not to mention what we might be dragging up into the bladder even with the most careful cleaning. What is better, IME and IMO, is to do a bladder tap. Sounds painful but so must a catheter be on a little baby. To do a tap they clean the skin good with iodine or chloraprep and then with a small needle puncture through the skin into the bladder and aspirate some urine. Much more sterile, and not as damaging. I don't know how the pain would compare, but the procedure is sure quicker.

[PuppyFluffer]

Mara, that is the same way that it's done in dogs and cats at the animal hospital I worked at. They often hardly flinch, so it doesn't appear to register much pain for them. It's fast and seems easy.