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A missing Link??? First thread on epigenetics  

post #1 of 36
Thread Starter 
Please read this:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...1026090636.htm
Quote:

These startling scientific discoveries illuminate the emerging field of epigenetics, in which single nutrients, toxins, behaviors or environmental exposures of any sort can silence or activate a gene without altering its genetic code in any way.

.....Co-initiator of the conference is Fred Tyson, Ph.D., at the National Institute of Environmental Health Sciences (NIEHS). "Each nutrient, each interaction, each experience can manifest itself through biochemical changes that ultimately dictate gene expression, whether at birth or 40 years down the road."

Such stealth changes often occur in embryonic or fetal development, but they set the stage for an adult's susceptibility to a host of diseases and behavioral responses, the data suggest. Moreover, epigenetic changes – so named because they sit on top of the gene and leave its sequence unchanged – can also be passed down from one generation to the next, said Jirtle.

In one example, Jirtle showed that four common nutritional supplements – B12, folic acid, choline and betaine from sugar beets – fed to pregnant mice actually altered the coat colors of their offspring. One or several of the nutrients methlyated the mouse agouti gene and gave rise to mice with brown coats instead of yellow coats. More importantly, he said, the supplements lowered the offspring's adult susceptibility to obesity, diabetes and cancer as compared to the unsupplemented offspring.

"Nutrition isn't a fleeting affair," said Jirtle. "We are, quite literally, what we eat as well as what our parents and even grandparents ate......

Even the lowest detectable limits of a chemical can have dire effects on a living organism, added William Schlesinger, Ph.D., Dean of the Nicholas School of the Environment and Earth Sciences at Duke. Atrizine is a prime example. Less than one part per billion of this widely used corn herbicide de-masculinizes developing frogs or causes dual male-female genitalia. Yet often the Environmental Protection Agency's instrumentation doesn't record such minute levels of chemical exposure, he said.
1) This seems pretty important to me..... what about what vaccines do in the body, or doesn't that count?

2) At least these people have some understanding of nutrition....
post #2 of 36
Aluminum is another example - it alters gene expression in the brain. Hep B vaccinated newborns get aluminum concentrations that are a thousand times higher than necessary to induce altered gene expression.
post #3 of 36
Thread Starter 
Wanna explain that a bit more?
post #4 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by Momtezuma Tuatara
Wanna explain that a bit more?
That's what I was wondering, too...
post #5 of 36
Who me?
post #6 of 36
Thread Starter 
Yes you.
post #7 of 36
Thread Starter 
It's your cookie jar!
post #8 of 36
Lol!
post #9 of 36
I thought I was pretty succinct. I'll admit I was a bit conservative with the aluminum concentration: in Hep B vaccinated newborns [Al] is closer to ten thousand times higher than the minimum required to induce altered gene expression.
post #10 of 36
Stirrin' the pot before taking it off the stove, huh?
post #11 of 36
Isn't it a good example of what MT's cited article was talking about?
post #12 of 36
Thread Starter 
Yeah you were succinct. In that short hand way like when we say "Thioctic Acid is a better expression than Alpha lipoic Acid" ~ as in we know what we are talking about, but does anyone else?
post #13 of 36
We're lookin' for some details, here.
The nitty gritty...you know?
post #14 of 36
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by insider
Isn't it a good example of what MT's cited article was talking about?
I wasn't stirrin no pot
post #15 of 36
Thread Starter 
Insider.......Mamakay and I would like an explanation of how Aluminium could alter gene expression, pretty please?

: lollypop held out as bribe.
post #16 of 36
Isn't that enough detail? Infants' brains have a specific pattern of gene expression that is necessary for proper development. Aluminum changes that. The amount of aluminum that changes the normal pattern of gene expression is very freaking small.
post #17 of 36
Does aluminum that's adsorbed to a viral antigen react differently to living tissue than "free" aluminum?
post #18 of 36
Thread Starter 
Well.... the questions that raises in my head are these. What are the way by which anything, be it aluminium or anything else can do that.

I dont' really understand the "loss of methylation" thing. I can't grasp a mental picture of it, and gum on a light switch doesn't quite do it for my brain. They talk about "it" sitting on top of genes and leaving its sequence unchanged.... and the reverse being methyl tags that are knocked off. Then they talk about how toxins and synthetic compounds can methylate genes and give rise to diseases....

So, does aluminium methylate, or de-methylate a gene. In other words, there are two possible mechanisms that they know of. Methylation or demethylation or silencing or activating a gene without altering its code.

What I want to know is exactly what does what. I suppose it doesn't matter since activation of methylation is the PITA anyway....
post #19 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by Momtezuma Tuatara
Insider.......Mamakay and I would like an explanation of how Aluminium could alter gene expression, pretty please?

: lollypop held out as bribe.
How specific do I have to get? Aluminum interacts directly with DNA. Exogenous aluminum interacts via membrane contact and cell signalling events. Both mechanisms take place and somewhere around 30 genes are affected. Seven of them are significantly up-regulated (genes that are primarily pro-inflammatory or pro-apoptotic: apoptosis = cell suicide). The consequences for brain development are unknown since scientists are just finding these things out. But even if you didn't know any specifics, all that matters is to know that aluminum in the vaccine is sufficient (way way way sufficient) to induce abnormal gene expression in the brain.

Lollypop taken
post #20 of 36
Thread Starter 
Ah. Okay.
Quote:
originally quoted by insider Isn't it a good example of what MT's cited article was talking about?
But.....

(another lollypop for another answer....)

methylation doesn't appear to directly affect the DNA if you believe this article? So.... Aluminium switches on, or off, as the case may be? ... sits on the DNA, or takes off methyl tabs... and results in the DNA looking the same but behaving differently? Correct?

It's not a case of getting specific. It's a case of me being able to "see" it in the head. That was my difficulty. Trying to wrap a solid idea around an amorphous concept.
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