Being forced to immunize myself for school

[paganmommy]

Help. I am going back to school to get my nursing degree and I am told I have to get the MMR vaccine which of course I don't want to do. I sent in my waiver but got back a letter from the nurse in the health department at the school saying "I AM NOT IN COMPLIANCE AND A THERE WILL BE A HOLD ON MY ACCOUNT UNTIL I RESOLVE THIS MATTER". I have sent another letter stating that I object due to my religious and philosophical beliefs and outlined the law in NY state. I cannot afford an attorney if I have to use one and feel I am up against some difficulties. Any advice?

[LongIsland]

Originally Posted by paganmommy

I have sent another letter stating that I object due to my religious and philosophical beliefs and outlined the law in NY state.

What did the first letter say? I need you to post the exact text.

You stated you sent another letter. Did you literally send it already? If so, please also post the exact language of the second letter. If you didn't send it already - DON'T send it yet!

Also, please post exactly what the nurse wrote - the entire text of the school's letter to you.

Thanks.

[LongIsland]

Have you already been vaccinated for MMR? Even as a child? If so, can you provide proof (calling your high school records to obtain records, ped's office records)? In NY, they only want proof of prior immunization, you don't need to be revaccinated in order to enter if you have proof.

[aira]

My only advice is to do whatever it takes to avoid the MMR. I was "forced" to get it to enter college b/c I got the separate doses (pre MMR) as a child. Plus I had had measles and rubella from the shots. I had to have the actual MMR. How's that for logic?!

I had a major reaction in which I lost 20 lbs in 2 weeks (and I was not overweight). I turned jaundice everywhere. My clothing bruised me. I vomited. I could not eat, for months. My joints lcoked up and I was unable to write at times. I had to quit playing piano, which is what I went to college to study. How's that for irony?

Now I have arthritis.

[LongIsland]

Here are the immunization guidelines for NYS (post secondary institutions):
http://www.health.state.ny.us/nysdoh...k/postsec5.htm

Paganmommy - please read this entire page.

[paganmommy]

I dont' have time to write both letters but the first letter i wrote was a standard waiver letter stating that I wish to not be vaccinated based on my religious and philisophical beliefs. The letter I got was a standard letter that they send stating I am not in compliance with the New York STate law stating students who have not received their vaccination by a certain date are in need of vaccination,etc. I am from rural VA. and can't get my records. I don't have a titer to rubella but the Measles and Mumps I showed immunity. I sent the second letter already.

[LongIsland]

Originally Posted by paganmommy

I sent the second letter already.

Did the second letter state the same exact thing?
Did you use the word "philosophical" in the second letter as well?
Did you go into detail regarding religious beliefs? Regarding philosophical beliefs?

If you have time later or tomorrow, please post the exact text of the letter.

At this point, you're going to have to wait and see what happens b/c it's very probable it will be rejected if you claimed your beliefs are philosophical in nature. NY State only allows for medical and religious exemptions.

[paganmommy]

letter i sent

Sorry had to go to class. Here is letter I sent.

I received your letter regarding the MMR vaccination. I don't know if you received my waiver which clearly states that I am waiving the right to vaccinations due to my religious and philosophical beliefs, however, I am sending this letter as reminder to this effect.

I am very much aware that in New York State, a individual has the right to refuse
vaccinations based on their religious and philosophical beliefs. My religion does not allow me to receive vaccinations and I am using my rights as a citizen of New York State to refuse all vaccinations. Please see attached regarding New York State Law in terms of post-secondary schools receiving immunization. Highlighted are the rights of an individual who chooses to not vaccinate based on their religious beliefs.

§ 2165. Immunization of certain post-secondary students.
1. As used in this section, unless the context requires otherwise:
a. The term "institution" means a college as defined in section two of the education law.
b. The term "student" means any person born on or after January first, nineteen hundred fifty-seven, who is registered to attend or attends classes at an institution, whether full-time or part-time. "Part-time student" shall mean a student who is enrolled for at least six but less than twelve semester hours, or the equivalent per semester or at least four but less than eight semester hours per quarter at an institution.
c. The term "health practitioner" means any person authorized by law to administer an immunization.
d. The term "immunization" means an adequate dose or doses of an immunizing agent against measles, mumps and rubella which meets the standards approved by the United States public health service for such biological products, and which is approved by the state department of health under such conditions as may be specified by the public health council.
2. Each student at an institution shall provide to the institution a certificate from a health practitioner or other acceptable evidence of such student's immunization, unless such student presents a certificate under subdivision eight of this section or is exempt under subdivision eight-a or nine of this section. Upon compliance, no student shall be denied attendance at an institution because of the requirements of this section.
3. A student who has not complied with subdivision two of this section shall present himself or herself to a health practitioner and request such practitioner to administer such immunization.
4. If any person is unable to pay for the services of a private health practitioner, such person shall present himself or herself to the health officer of the county in which such person resides, or the county in which the institution is located who shall then administer the immunization without charge.
5. The health practitioner who administers such immunization to any such person shall give a certificate of such immunization to such person.6. In the event that a student registers at an institution and has not complied with subdivision two of this section, the institution shall inform such student of the necessity to be immunized, that such immunization may be administered by any health practitioner, or that the student may be immunized without charge by the health officer in the county where the student resides or in which the institution is located. In the event that such student does not comply with this section, he or she shall be given notice that attendance at the institution requires immunization unless a valid reason is provided by such student pursuant to subdivision eight or nine of this section.
7. No institution shall permit any student to attend such institution in excess of thirty days without complying with subdivision two of this section. However, such thirty day period may be extended to not more than forty-five days for a student where such student is from out-of-state or from another country and can show a good faith effort to comply with subdivision two of this section.
8. If any licensed physician or nurse practitioner certifies that such immunization may be detrimental to the person's health or is otherwise medically contraindicated, the requirements of this section shall be inapplicable until such immunization is found no longer to be detrimental to such person's health or is no longer medically contraindicated.
8-a. Proof of honorable discharge from the armed services within ten years from the date of application to an institution shall qualify as a certificate enabling a student to attend the institution pending actual receipt of immunization records from the armed services. If while awaiting the receipt of actual immunization records a health risk shall arise at an institution, a student presenting a certificate under the terms of this subdivision shall be removed from the institution if proper immunization cannot be proved or otherwise rectified.
9. This section shall not apply to a person who holds genuine and sincere religious beliefs which are contrary to the practices herein required, and no certificate shall be required as a prerequisite to such person being admitted or received into or attending an institution.[/B]
10. The institution shall provide annually to the commissioner, on forms provided by the commissioner, a summary regarding compliance with this section.
11. The commissioner may adopt and amend rules and regulations to effectuate the provisions and purposes of this section.
12. The commissioner shall report annually to the governor and the legislature concerning the immunization of all students pursuant to this section.
13. a. Prior to August first, nineteen hundred ninety-one, this section shall not apply to (i) part-time students or (ii) any student who attended the institution he or she is attending prior to August first, nineteen hundred eighty-nine.
b. Prior to August first, nineteen hundred ninety-one, the thirty and forty-five day periods referred to in subdivision seven of this section shall be deemed to be sixty and ninety days, respectively.
http://www.health.state.ny.us/nysdoh...k/postsec5.htm
Please feel free to contact me if you should have any further questions at Sincerely


I think this pretty much states this is based on my religious beliefs and I know I didn't go into too much detail but I don't want to give my personal situation unless I absolutely have to. What do you guys think?

[libba]

Don't know what to tell you or how to get out of it. I vax but understand those who don't. That being said I am a nurse and most places won't hire you without certain shots. Hep B and MMR being the most frequent. They won't let you on an OB ward to work without the MMR! Sorry! Will be following to see what response you get.

[aira]

Please edit out your phone number! ASAP!

[Devaskyla]

:

[DesireeH]

Can a mod edit it for her until she comes back?

[paganmommy]

OOPs

I guess I will worry about getting a job when that comes around. Right now I got to get through school. But, I will let you know what happens until then.

[tayndrewsmama]

If you still get any hassles, I just recently talked to a nurse I know about a homeopathic doc that we are going to check out. Now, I know there has been discussion here about the "fluff" of homeopathic vaccines and that they don't really do anything, but she got one for a requirement and I asked her why. She said the requirements stated that she had to have the vaccine, just not in what form. She said it was a bend the rules kind of thing. This particular doc who is a homeopath also is an M.D. and is affiliated with a local hospital, so I think that's how it was able to fly through for her. Maybe that's an option? Hopefully you won't have to worry about that at all anyways. Your letter looks very well put together.

[stopper1]

Have you tried finding a naturalist that has an MD behind thier name and will give you an herbal vaccine that they will sign for? We are looking at these methods for our twins. We have yet to give regular shots. ST

[LongIsland]

Originally Posted by paganmommy

Here is letter I sent.

I received your letter regarding the MMR vaccination. I don't know if you received my waiver which clearly states that I am waiving the right to vaccinations due to my religious and philosophical beliefs, however, I am sending this letter as reminder to this effect.

You shouldn't have put "philosophical" in your letter, but now you just have to wait and see what happens b/c they already have it.

If someone should call you over the phone for clarification, play dumb and say that you thought NY had a philosophical exemption and that this language had to go in the letter in addition to the religious language. You should state your beliefs are not philosophical, but religious and it was an error on your part b/c you didn't know the procedure for New York.

If no one notices what you wrote, you can either leave it alone or submit a revised letter. As long as they have the one you sent in their files, it is open to challenge.

If they send you a letter of rejection, please do not re-submit anything until you come back here.

Hope all goes well.

[Sherra]

I find it really ironic how colleges claim to be so full of "free speech" and the like. When I went to college, I didn't find it very "free" as an outbreak occurred and they literally forced us to show our vax records or BE VAXED. Colleges make me sick in their double standard that they like to portray.

[libba]

I don't think it is the college itself but the fact that she is applying to nursing school! They cannot let unvaxed folks around those with compromised immune systems and pregnant mothers. Say you got rubella and did not know it ( most contagious before rash) - if you were in OB you just exposed a lot of pregnant women. Rubella in early PG can lead to blindness and many birth defects. Most hospitals are not will ing to take on that sort of legal risk. In nursing school you will be doing clinicals in hospitals and therefore have to comply with their standards. That is my best explanation.

[Plummeting]

Originally Posted by libba

I don't think it is the college itself but the fact that she is applying to nursing school! They cannot let unvaxed folks around those with compromised immune systems and pregnant mothers. Say you got rubella and did not know it ( most contagious before rash) - if you were in OB you just exposed a lot of pregnant women. Rubella in early PG can lead to blindness and many birth defects. Most hospitals are not will ing to take on that sort of legal risk. In nursing school you will be doing clinicals in hospitals and therefore have to comply with their standards. That is my best explanation.

Were you aware that over 75% of OBs refuse to vaccinate themselves for rubella? Apparently not, so now you know. If the OBs won't even vaccinate themselves for it (because it is known to cause severe arthritis), then why the heck do the nurses have to do it?

It isn't "unvaxed folks" who shouldn't be around pregnant mothers and those with compromised immune systems. It is SICK folks who shouldn't be around those people. There is a big difference and it's totally buying into the BS to think that isn't true. Do you think every person a pregnant woman comes into contact with has immunity to rubella? Should she then insulate herself in her house, for fear of catching it? Even vaccinating doesn't produce immunity in everyone, but the hospitals don't check titres for the vaccinated. There are several people who post here who are "persistent nonresponders" to the rubella vaccine. They've been vaxed more than once, but never developed antibodies. If the hospitals were really so concerned, they would check titres on all nurses every few years and revaccinate those who no longer had protective levels or fire everyone who was a nonresponder. But they don't. If it's illegal to fire/refuse to hire people who don't respond to the vax, it should be illegal to do it to those who won't vaccinate to begin with.

[tayndrewsmama]

Originally Posted by libba

I don't think it is the college itself but the fact that she is applying to nursing school! They cannot let unvaxed folks around those with compromised immune systems and pregnant mothers. Say you got rubella and did not know it ( most contagious before rash) - if you were in OB you just exposed a lot of pregnant women. Rubella in early PG can lead to blindness and many birth defects. Most hospitals are not will ing to take on that sort of legal risk. In nursing school you will be doing clinicals in hospitals and therefore have to comply with their standards. That is my best explanation.

This is all under the assumption that the vax works in the first place.