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Parenting and Rage - Page 39

post #761 of 1766
Quote:
Originally Posted by majikfaerie View Post
Well, after my last rough day, I've been feeling so good... someone complimented me today on how patient I am with DD and how well I'm dealing with her
Good news, majikfaerie! What do you account for feeling so good?

To everyone else who has posted -- it's such a relief to read that we're not alone and to try to learn to improve together.
post #762 of 1766
Quote:
Originally Posted by Emese'sMom View Post
Good news, majikfaerie! What do you account for feeling so good?
I dont know... well, I used to have really serious issues with rage, I think a lot to do with growing up in a home with abusive, raging parents
I also suffered with chronic depression, and sometimes... well, it got pretty bad. I used to hit myself until I saw stars, smash stuff, scream a fit. There were a few times when DH had to take my DD away for a little while, she just triggered so much stuff, mostly to do with my parents.

anyway, I've mentioned it on this thread before, AAAAAGES ago, that I found out that I have a strong reaction to cocoa; when I eat chocolate, all of my depression and rage is multiplied by about a billion. When I avoid chocolate, I'm just a regular person again. I still have moments of anger and rage, but its not the main driving force in my life.

So, I guess last week I just had a bad patch.

I guess, aside from the chocolate, which helped a lot with the physical imbalances in my body, I've done a lot of therapy, and ReBirthing, and vipassana meditation. they've all helped a lot.

I also just realised, (since amydawnsmommy mentioned), Its been a really LONG time since I really had any time without DD. probably since february. and in the last 2 weeks, DH is away, and we live alone in a small one room cottage in the woods, 12km from a town.
So its been really intense one-on-one time with DD.

But, otoh, since DH is away, there is a lot less stress in my life (things have been extremely tense between us lately), which makes up for the lack of help with DD, wood cutting, housework, etc.

Anyway, since we've just moved out into the bush - we live on 24 acres on the edge of a rainforest I feel much better; I spend time in the fresh air and greenery every day.
post #763 of 1766
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abi's Mom View Post
I couldn't read this whole thread. I read the first page and just got too sad, because I see myself in here. I hate that I get angry at my toddler. I have been too rough and so frustrated when she keeps pointing and only communicating incoherent grunts and I don't know what she wants, I ask through an entire list, and just get NO! and she hits me and kicks me and won't let me put a diaper or panties on her and my mom says, well, you just need to spank her and I say, no, and then I end up yelling at Abigail instead, or pushing her away after she has hit, kicked smacked me one too many times because I said, no, you can't have any candy. Sigh.
I also have huge issues with my daughter hitting me. She does it when she gets frustrated because I'm trying to get her up in the morning etc. I can take it sometimes, but sometimes I get mad and yell at her. How to handle this? She's 4 next week - I feel like she's getting too old to hit me.
post #764 of 1766
i am feeling so frustrated and ragful towards my 4 yr old (turned 4 last month). Since school ended (she goes to headstrt - where she also resieves services for PT and special ED to help her with behaviors) and i am seriously starting to wonder if she has some issue/s rather then just being a testy 4 yr old PITB. The other night i found myself screaming at her (again),spanking her and carrying her upstairs to her room for bed (she she bowled over her brother, like he was a bowling pin or somehting). I calmed down (sort of) to help get her ready for bed... but i was angry for hours after it. It's a on going issue - her and her baby brother (and he's no help - now that he is biting back when she hurts him - but that totally reminds me of her at this age too, she would bite her older sister - only for no reason).

I hate that i scream, yell and occosioannl spank the kids... it's NOT how i want to parent. I don't want them to have the same "bad" example of partening... but i've been so outta it lately and inconsistent since the death of my mother (which was only 3 weeks ago). DH doesnt help - he always resorts to spanking/hitting no matter what (or he staying in front of his computer and just yells (into the computer i might add) at the kids). *sighs*
post #765 of 1766
I believe that hitting, like any behavior, is a message about underlying needs which are unmet. I believe that by labeling and judging them as "violence" or "unacceptable" creates the adversarial relationship. Instead, methods of redirecting, as a partner working to meet the underlying needs, toward mutually agreeable solutions, eliminates the need to label and judge the behavior. Even in parents who hit their children, isn't it unmet needs which default one toward *making* someone comply? I find that when I expect others to meet my needs, I am frustrated when they don't. It has been more effective for me to learn to ASK for help with what I need from other autonomous adults! Learning to do this without thinking myself "supposed to be able to be SuperMom" has been a journey!

When I learned to recognize my own needs as valid, instead of thinking I could parent in a nuclear family alone, I found that the expectations I held for myself were unnatural and not heroic. I learned that I *could* ask for help and meet our families needs, without feeling like a "failure". The concepts of "independence" and "autonomy" as in Do It Yourself didn't serve our family. I chose new beliefs of interconnectedness and created and nurtured relationships with other adults to support our family. But, the first step was getting beyond the belief that to be "SuperMom" was the goal.



Pat
post #766 of 1766
Ugh, I just totally lost it with my son (age 5). He got out of bed and came to my room, opening the squeaky door and talking very loudly just SECONDS after I had finally gotten the baby to sleep. I am so tired and burnt out -- I've been alone with my three kids (all 5 and under) for a week now. Thank God hubby is coming home tomorrow night.

Because he's the oldest, DS gets the brunt of my anger because I expect too much from him. I KNOW this, but that doesn't change my expectations. I worry every single day about what affect I'm having on his self-esteem. He is a smart, sensitive little guy, and I feel like I'm "ruining" him about half the time.

This thread helps me. It's good to know I'm not the only one who loses it. Hopefully one day I'll have something useful to add here.
post #767 of 1766
I've been having a bad couple of days too;
I've just had really REALLY low patience/ tolerance levels.
I just totally diverted from my usual explaining to DD why something needs to be done and waiting for her to do it to flat out telling her to do it. and of course she doesnt. so I get frustrated.
she doesnt get it. she wont do anything without an explanation, and she's used to getting one. I almost never tell her to do anything, I explain why, and then ask her. but I'm low on energy. I just want her to do stuff.
I lost my temper with her about 1000 times in the last 2 days. I've just been so frustrated and depressed.
We went with some friends to a drum circle and then to camp at the beach. I dearly wanted to dance at the drumming, but DD wouldnt let me; she was so clingy, and wouldnt play with the other kids, even though they were asking her to (she gets very shy if there's more than one or 2 kids). So I just pretended that what I really wanted to do was play with her, and that I always go to parties and dont dance. but inside I was feeling frustrated and fuming.

so then we were at the beach, and in the morning I sooooo wanted to do some yoga. I havent done any since DH left, (2 weeks) and the other mamas were doing yoga on the beach while the kids were collecting shells/ building sandcastles. only DD would not get off me for one second, and refused to let me do yoga. she wouldnt play with the other kids, and insisted that I had to play with her.

My back was aching and I really wanted to do yoga. I really wanted to lie in the sun. To read my book, to have even one minute of SPACE!!! I just felt sooooo frustrated.

I started getting so angry and frustrated... I lost my temper, I went off to sit in my car and fume. I was feeling so depressed, started getting into suicidal thoughts, started thinking that I can never cope as a single mother, and I need to stay with an abusive DH whom I dont love just because I can't do it.
(it gets worse from here, but I wont go on...)

anyway, after a LOOOOONG day of me being in a constant fuming RAGE... I started bleeding.
suddenly, everything made sense. I wasnt depressed or suicidal, I was hormonal!
and I felt instantly better
I'm starting to see a pattern; last month, also the day after full moon, I had been dangerously depressed and raging for a couple of days and then started bleeding.

I've never had a regular cycle (anything between 30-60 days, usually around 45 days), but I'm starting to see a pattern.
post #768 of 1766
Quote:
Originally Posted by lawyermom View Post
I also have huge issues with my daughter hitting me. She does it when she gets frustrated because I'm trying to get her up in the morning etc. I can take it sometimes, but sometimes I get mad and yell at her. How to handle this? She's 4 next week - I feel like she's getting too old to hit me.
My son used to do that too. Then I got vigilant about giving him a time out EVERY time he hit me. I know that seems a little harsh (especially because he hit a LOT), but after a few days (it may have been a week or so, I can't remember) he stopped hitting almost entirely. It was like a miracle cure or something. LOL. The key is to do it every single time and not ever ignore it.

I do the time outs a minute for every year old he is. So at that time he got three minutes every time he hit. I told him "This time out is because you hit. Hitting is not loving, and I know you don't want to hurt me. Are you feeling frustrated or angry? *nods* Then tell me how you feel next time instead of hitting." Now I usually hear from him, "I am FRUSterated, Mommy!!" But I have to respond quickly (acknowledging the feeling) or else he will sometimes revert back to the old behaviour.

He does get upset at school sometimes too, and sometimes shuts down and won't talk to me until the evening because most other children his age don't know how to acknowledge feelings and some of the boys there hit him. It really pisses me off when that happens!!!!!!! But, until I can homeschool, that's the way it has to be I guess. I remember having these feelings when I went to school as well, and I don't want him to have those same bad experiences. Anyone have advice?

Thanks for the ideas about doing yoga and stuff (to whoever mentioned that). When I'm upset, I *usually* catch myself right before I blow up at ds and tell him, "I'm feeling very angry and frustrated right now!" And he usually understands and leaves me alone for at least a few minutes. I find my exercise bike helps me get rid of frustration, but only when I'm not dealing with a fibro flare. I totally get what you mamas are talking about with the not eating thing too... That DEFINITELY makes me cranky as hell... LOL
post #769 of 1766
OK... here I am.

I have followed this thread from time to time and am amazed that there are so many of "us" and yet, I'm still embarrassed at my lack of control.

I have obviously missed a TON of posts here because I only come occasionally and I would like to know if anyone has any links/advice on this specific thing:

HOW do you "catch" and stop yourself when you are BEGINNING to get into a rage... not after the rage, not ten minutes before the rage (when you are just cranky)... but AS the rage is starting... how does one just say STOP!!! and get back in control?? I feel like if I could just do this one thing... if I could just stop myself when I'm angry and before I am enraged (yes, I know... it's milliseconds sometimes... aargh!)... then I could make some progress.

Dammit. Sometimes, I can "see" myself getting wound up.... and because I dont' know how to choose to NOT get fully wound, I then choose to get wound and go off. WTF? I just want some "real world" examples of what to do to just STOP the rage freight train from barreling through town. I get sick at my stomach when I see my kids getting totally wound up and going OFF because they see ME do it... I just want to hide. That is my biggest parenting fark up... I really don't want to pass this incapability to control myself onto them... they deserve better. This has shadowed me my entire life and I HATE IT!

Please... anyone... links? Ideas? (counting to ten doesn't work... I need somethign to just say STOOOOOOOP!!!! to myself and I haven't figured it out!)

Thank you. Really... Thank you. For letting me know I'm not alone. For letting me know that other people really fight with this demon.
post #770 of 1766
Sisyphus, It might help to change your user ID! Honestly, when you embrace that you *can* be whatever you desire, you can change the Sisyphus story.

By believing that it won't be exactly the same up hill battle forever!

Listen to your body. I had a counselor ask me to visualize where I felt the anger, watch it as it comes upon me. Where is it? What does it feel like? Heat? Tightness? Clenched teeth? Drawn fists? A huge inhalation of breath? Setting my jaw? Hands on my hips? My ears tingle. My chest feels constricted. I feel hot, etc.

Observe. That is the first step of any Scientific Method. Observe yourself. Don't get caught up in the self-talk of 'oh god here I go again, I wish I could stop myself'. Watch. And when you can start to see the signs earlier and earlier...then you can change the story.

I start to feel my chest expand, I set my jaw and I KNOW: "I need to take a break. I am the Adult. I can control myself." And I walk to the kitchen sink and run a large glass of water (and the house can be falling down around me) and I drink the water and I "infuse" it with the "switch words": "Be. Divine. Love. Together." These are connecting words which help to 'switch the energy'. And sometimes I have to take some Rescue Remedy and Breathe. Breathe. Breathe. And then I can think more clearly. But, I had to trust that I could change the story from that which happens again and again and again and again...

With our thoughts we create our world!

Listen to your body. Trust that it will show you the path to that which you desire: peace.

Pat
post #771 of 1766
Bless this and those on it. And for your words of wisdom Pat.

Erthe_mama, I could relate to these feelings of frustration where you start to have suicidal thoughts or doom/gloom future/present thoughts....I'll never be a good mother, I can't handle this, etc. Usually I find I need to do a radical switch in thinking, do some self care, and get a break from dd even if it means she doesn't like it. Even if the Eyes of AP Judgement cast themselves on me and shake their finger TSK TSK! I have to do it because it makes me a better mommy and feel more sane. We all need help, we're not supposed to do this by ourselves!

If I need some time for myself for a moment, dd eventually (after pouting and sometimes tantruming) finds something else to busy herself with. Or i let her stay near me and read/colour/join me while I do what I need to do (yoga, aerobics, etc.). Just some thoughts. Might they work for you? One thing that came to mind was could dd have joined you in the dancing? How about limits like telling her you'll dance for 15 min and then play? Brainstorming here. it is hard.
post #772 of 1766
Mamas just posting to say I've found a book that seems helpful. "Becoming the Parent You Want To Be" by Laura Davis and Janis Keyser. It has some great chapters that acknowledge the feelings parents go through, incl. some difficult ones, and when you have a difficult family legacy, and how to find your way in parenting now.

I've been reading it and alternately crying with grief/shame/fear....and feeling hopeful. Can't wait to see my midwife this week and get a counselling referral. SIGH!!!!! How are other mothers doing?
post #773 of 1766
Quote:
Originally Posted by majikfaerie View Post
I'm starting to see a pattern; last month, also the day after full moon, I had been dangerously depressed and raging for a couple of days and then started bleeding.

I've never had a regular cycle (anything between 30-60 days, usually around 45 days), but I'm starting to see a pattern.
Hey Majik,
In my circle, we call this the "waning moon blues". I find that my most down moments are when the moon is waning, usually in the days after the full moon.
I have a very irregular period as well, but I'm staring this thing called "Lunaception" which works with the amount light in your bedroom at night to get your body back in tune with the moon. So far, it looks like it will be successful, but I'm just starting out.
~Draya
post #774 of 1766
Quote:
Originally Posted by WuWei View Post
I start to feel my chest expand, I set my jaw and I KNOW: "I need to take a break. I am the Adult. I can control myself." And I walk to the kitchen sink and run a large glass of water (and the house can be falling down around me) and I drink the water and I "infuse" it with the "switch words": "Be. Divine. Love. Together." These are connecting words which help to 'switch the energy'. And sometimes I have to take some Rescue Remedy and Breathe. Breathe. Breathe. And then I can think more clearly. But, I had to trust that I could change the story from that which happens again and again and again and again...

With our thoughts we create our world!

Listen to your body. Trust that it will show you the path to that which you desire: peace.
LOVE this!!! I'm so going to try to use this next time... Thanks!! It makes so much sense.
post #775 of 1766
for me, i have had to decide to let go of the controlling thing.
yes, that means i rage, yes, my kids rage.
in the past few years, it has significantly dwindled.

sure, there are times i can perfectly observe how badly i am doing as i behave badly and i still continue.

sure, i have worked very hard to limit the kinds of words i say and particular behaviours.

sure, i still work constantly on controls i can manage depending on my energy and observing my limitations.

my biggest lesson helping with my anger has been accepting myself regardless and shutting off the edit and judgment track that would jog beside me at all times. going along with that is loving myself unconditionally and taking measures to cherish myself, measures to keep my body surviving, measures to enforce limits so that i can keep my sanity. and yes, this means changing how i parent - of course i treasure my children. but i have developed my boundaries now so that we can live harmoniously.

generally for me, declaring that i was doing something wrong and i needed to quit it only made things worse. this means yes, if you are feeling the fire, then you feel it and love it and let it consume and burn out. because it is part of you. if you must control anything, then it is the situational parameters to lessen your regrets with your family. however, be careful with regret. carrying it around tends to make me more angry and it is simply something to be let go of or practical action taken or decision made if needed. letting go means really forgiving yourself - not that things were okay, but that it is over and released.

it is okay to feel mad. it is okay for your kids to feel mad. all we can learn to completely control is how we think and our actions. when it comes to rage and very intense emotions - before we learn to control them well, we learn to let them happen the best we can. and then we should let it go after we learn any lessons from it for next time. i am an impatient and explosive person that knew nothing about kids or decent relationships when i started being a mamma. i had to decide that all my faults are my strengths too. i have also had to really think about how we are animals with instincts and how some processes cannot just be intelligently controlled - our bodies have to process and learn by doing as well, where time and practice are big factors.

do not fret about the kids, aside from them being a big catalyst for change. i was looking at photos yesterday and really seeing for the first time that they had a very happy childhood, regardless of the insanity and depressions we have gone through in the past nine years. children are very resilient. it is good for them to learn how to be real from their mamma. they have to learn how to deal with very scary and ugly parts of themselves, so we grow up fast to learn about ourselves.

i think since you realize what and where you want to stop, you are already at a huge turning point. if your question is how to defuse your feelings entirely, then i don't have an answer. have a ridiculous picture to look at? might help for the moment. i have had to learn to appreciate my passion, and that it is definitely inherent in my children. we are working to make it useful instead of having it harm us.

strong emotions are clues and cues to help us figure out things.....when we are feeling awake and reasonable enough to figure it out..... and yes, my seemingly unreasonable irritation is often used to do household chores. next time you get mad, tell yourself, i am a cool person over and over. if you really can't believe that right now, tell yourself "tea olive knows i'm a cool person and i'm going to believe it and i'm going to go in my corner and feel mad for a little while and then go about my business." this is for each and everyone of you. how do i know you are cool? you are here, aren't you???

then you are going to spend the next ten minutes and longer as you get better....only thinking about what you are doing at the moment and what you see or hear in the most simplified and detached language. when i started this i had to shout at myself desperately in my head "i am sitting down sitting down i am getting up ruby is drinking water reed is shouting from the other room". let's call it a being here meditation. when you get a little more familiar with it, let in the wonder and enjoyment of the nice things.

practicing how i think - quieting down the chaos of subconscious - has been crucial. weeding out negatives and judgments. laughing at myself. when i speak of negatives i am very serious - when one says: i am not going to be mad, this is still talking about being mad but battling it. it needs to be a different word entirely, and one that is doable. sure, it can be i am listless. at least it is accurate and free. and i will also say that for me, being mad is a wasted energy form of fear. i have notoriously used being angry to hide weakness this includes yelling at my kid for getting hurt accidentally. so letting go of my supposed inadequacies has been very important.

massive helpers for me in the past ten years have been: 5-htp regularly for a few months to get my body learning to make appropriate serotonin levels, sleep, having friends, getting out as an adult, having my own interests as an adult, having sex, increase in income, kids getting older, accepting my kids, appreciating and enjoying my kids, learning their limitations and how i must be their discipline that they lack. basically the way i parent now is that i am most definitely the mamma and i have total control of what they do but they really do whatever they want in the meantime. today i had a yes day. i've told y'all abt that before i believe. i've kinda talked about all this stuff before...the difference is that i can feel it now. things are good for me so short of a novel i tell what i can......

which comes first, the personal theories or the bandaid superactions? i don't know - i needed both. i can just say hang in there. it can get better if you believe it will get better. and yes, it is hard work and takes awhile and lotsa practice. it is one thing for me to know what i should do and another to actually live it. it takes vigilance to practice happiness. and the older i get, i find that most of the unhappiness is created inside of me. i just continue to learn how to deal with it. i'll be growing up until i die, and sometimes it sucks, and it is all part of the fun of life. i promise it can be a really great and enjoyable time - it just takes miles of work.

i still recommend scott noelle's daily groove emails.
xoxoxo
post #776 of 1766
Quote:
Originally Posted by tea olive View Post

do not fret about the kids, aside from them being a big catalyst for change. i was looking at photos yesterday and really seeing for the first time that they had a very happy childhood, regardless of the insanity and depressions we have gone through in the past nine years. children are very resilient. it is good for them to learn how to be real from their mamma. they have to learn how to deal with very scary and ugly parts of themselves, so we grow up fast to learn about ourselves.
Oh tea olive, your post was so, so wise. I have had rage moments, especially just after my DD was born and my DS was 2 years old. I still have them, but they are further apart.

I realize that I was being way, way too hard on myself for these moments. Yes, I was unkind to DS at some points, but I was dwelling on it so severely. I was mentally beating myself up, and I couldn't stop feeling like a horrible mother, even though 99% of the time I was a great mother.

I love how you say that it is good for children to learn how to be real from their mamas -- how to learn how to deal with the scary and ugly sides of ourselves. I think this is very true... and I have found that after I have an ugly/scary moment that it is so very important to my sanity and to my DS's feelings to hug him and hold him and explain to him that I was angry and I am sorry for yelling/being scary, and that I love him. While that doesn't excuse the action, it does make it easier for DS to understand, and it models apologizing and it helps to process those intense feelings.

It's hard, it's messy, sometimes is SO difficult to know what to do.
post #777 of 1766
Tea Olive,
thank you. the best ever description of how to take baby steps to start that I have read. it helps.
thank you.
post #778 of 1766
you are very welcome!!!!!!! - i guess it took a huge post for me to express what i could.
remember that anger and appropriateness are very different things. anger is a fire and energy that we can use to make hard changes or to help discover how we might feel better. i have to believe that it is a built in system that is supposed to work well and i have just have a giant learning curve. for so long i battled with aiming to be soft warm peaceful mamma at all times and it is just not my personality, and smothering that energy only made it leak out weird.

if you have read harry potter, it helped for me to use the mrs. weasley character as a heroine for successful happy messy real life mothering. you can absolutely feel and know the love, and yes, she gets shrill and fussy and bossy and annoying, she frets and is emotional and all over the place, and sometimes the kids are scared of her. but in a good way - she knows the limits and what her job is. and yes, she is a very powerful woman - she chooses to just pour it all on her family.

must go, child stung by bee....
post #779 of 1766
Oh... cool!! Mrs. Weasley.... Good one. I'm sooo using that... lol Thx.
post #780 of 1766
yeah, mrs weasley!

I just have that image of her in the 7th book, when she screams *** at ***
(those who've read it know what I mean). That's the kind of mother I want to be but with a more AP and GD flavour
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