Prepping the Body for Optimal Pregnancy Conditions - Page 3

[Dolphin]

Subbing - amazing thread. You ladies never cease to amaze me

[trini]

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[Momtezuma Tuatara]

Originally Posted by JaneS

I don't think I said this very well. Animal studies have shown that inadequte A, and that was the only variable in feed that was withheld, leads to cleft palate, deafness and problems with eye development.

Perhaps I've got so jaundiced about all studies that I tend to look at everything with a salt bag in my left hand. The first automatic question I ask with any study is "what have they NOT thought about." Just because a study says only one thing is relevant, doesn't make it right. It could be that they didn't look properly at other things, so that's why I take a broader sweep at things...

But I think your point re: balance is very well taken. I just happen to think that the way natural Vitamin A is currently viewed as being toxic is completely ridiculous. The research does not back it at all. It's wrong that many women are now so afraid of Vitamin A. I mean the cod liver oil that I wanted to take during pg was 1500-3000 IU/tsp and my OB just about had a cow.

The ones we have here, three tiny capsules equals 15,000 IU's, so we're talking different doses.

You've also hit something else on the head:

Instead the current solution in the states is bioengineered (and patentable!) omega 3's from fungus and microalgae. They are now being added to prenatals. The same DHA's in baby formula that is causing explosive diarrhea btw.

If women don't eat butter and eggs and liver, because they are politically incorrect foods, and stay away from fish b/c of the mercury issue, they won't get near the 15-30,000IU that you mentioned? (Since beta carotene is even less well absorbed than is thought). And also the butter and eggs and liver won't contain anywhere near the high amount of vitamin A that they could have if the animals have been correctly pasture fed.

The PC brigade. I can't believe how many mothers out there think that a good diet consists of chips, coca-cola, white bread and margarine.

When people use their common sense and go back to basic, and forget the PC brigade, and look at what worked in the past, perhaps they might get near the 15 - 30,000 Vitamin A baseline.

I also find that the PC brigade aren't changeable, or usually able to listen until their house of cards crashes around them. And I really hate being part of a rear-guard action, IYKWIM.

It feels like such a waste of time when I'm pretty well over the hill in terms of energy.

I'm confused about this statement... I agree with you. But how is Price showing that problems are irreversible?

He doesn't. But I feel he infers it...

I was attracted to his book and "Nourishing Traditions" because it is a way to conquer the nutritional deficiencies that one has with food and not supplements. One chapter in his book about The X Factor is all about preventing cavities, reversing tooth decay, and enhancing mineral absorption in people with serious problems.

(I posted in Dental about "Curing Cavities with Nutrition" that describes what the X Factor is and how it is the one nutrient that is present in native diets and mostly missing from modern day diets. It's a fat soluble nutrient, similar to A & D and present in butterfat of cows fed green grass (all mammals' milks with proper diet), fish eggs, organ meats and shellfish.)

When we were looking at whether or not to do functional orthodontistry on David (we didn't need to in the end.. the problem resolved as he grew) the orthodontist asked me an interesting question.

It was "Do you eat Butter or Margarine?"

I frowned at him and said "Only an idiot eats margarine."

He smiled and said "if you are not an idiot, you can halve the quote."

I asked "Why?"

He said this. "If you eat butter, the walls of the cells are much stronger, and there is less mineral leaching. Therefore, as we screw the plates open, and open up the jaw sinuses, the new bone deposits faster."

Made sense to me.

But I wondered what he would have said if I'd said Margarine. Perhaps nothing. Money for jam.

[crunchy_mama]

Thanks ladies for the thread. We are planning to ttc in a few months and am trying to improve my eating here. I have got to find a source for raw dairy!

[Katana]

Thanks for the specific CLO link, JaneS, I did miss it somehow, in my first pass.

Originally posted by Momtezuma Tuatara
Usually, people who have vitamin A deficiencies have other deficiencies as well, and one of the most common hand in hand with vitamin A is folic acid, which is responsible for the accurate "photocopying" of DNA.

I don't think its quite accurate to pin everything on Vitamin A, in pregnancy. Yes, in infection, because its role is so specific there.

But in pregnancy, there is a whole lot more going on than in infection. Take anaemia for instance. Why do they give pregnant women iron? That is plain stupid. It's far more likely to be folic acid deficiency, inadequate Vitamin C intake, because without vitamin C, you can't absorb iron, and imbalances in other minerals. With pregnant women, the last thing I consider is iron. The first thing I look at is her gut flora, then other minerals, and sources of B vitamins. Usually I don't have to look further.

But in terms of genetic defects (so called) which are really nutritional defects, while vitamin A is an issue, B vitamins and folic acid to me is a much greater issue, as is selenium. Without your enzyme pathways working properly, Vitamin A isn't going to do very much, because you need them going well to make best use of vitamin A.

So its never a single issue. It's always a balance issue. And if you have a perfect diet, but not enough selenium, you're going places with difficulty, because you can't absorb protein properly.

So yes, Vitamin A is important, but the bigger picture is most important.

This makes a lot of sense to me, but I do always try to find balance.

And, it made me think of something.

In my three pregnancies, I've been to them all. Mainstream obgyn, not as mainstream obgyn, "alternative" doctor, midwife, etc.

Despite being different on the mechanics of birth, and what a woman can or can't do as far as delivery, they seem to carry the same party line in terms of nutrition.

It's always been, "prenatal vitamins supply you with what you need, it's okay to eat some junk food".

With the junk food being two cups of coffee a day, down to pie, covered in whip cream. And whatever else. "A Cheeto isn't going to kill you!"

When asked if you would ever need to supplement other things, or take certain things, or whatever, it's always, is your iron okay, well then you're fine. Or, you have the healthiest diet of anyone I've ever seen.

It's upsetting, because the people that you can find that know something about minerals, and balance and what foods to eat are not usually your pregnancy and birth care providers.

And when you come to visits armed with questions and even information and answers to your own questions, they pat you on the head and tell you it's hormones.

end of ramble.

[chlobo]

Is there a test that can be done to determine if you are deficient in certain vitamins or minerals? Or are there "rules of thumb"? That is, if your hair is dull means xyz?

[JaneS]

Originally Posted by Katana

Despite being different on the mechanics of birth, and what a woman can or can't do as far as delivery, they seem to carry the same party line in terms of nutrition.

It's always been, "prenatal vitamins supply you with what you need, it's okay to eat some junk food".

With the junk food being two cups of coffee a day, down to pie, covered in whip cream. And whatever else. "A Cheeto isn't going to kill you!"

When asked if you would ever need to supplement other things, or take certain things, or whatever, it's always, is your iron okay, well then you're fine. Or, you have the healthiest diet of anyone I've ever seen.

It's upsetting, because the people that you can find that know something about minerals, and balance and what foods to eat are not usually your pregnancy and birth care providers.

This is it exactly... health is supposedly in a pill. Well obviously THAT is not working in this society!!

There is such a lack of nutrition knowledge it's scary. If y'all can just stand one more little Weston Price reference... he asked all the native people he studied why they ate the things they did, why they had special diets for mothers AND fathers about to marry, they all said, "So we can make perfect babies."

There is SUCH a disconnect in this society about nutrition and pregnancy. I mean what is talked about the most regarding food and being pg, "What cravings do you have?" And it's sure not liver and raw milk.

Even if you are taking vitamins, coffee and sugar and processed foods leech minerals out of the body and depress the immune system. And a diet of all cooked foods, no fermented or raw foods, drains the cells of body building enzymes.

And of course the good old hydrogenated fats that MT talked about in the margarine post above... the trans fats become part of your cells.

And btw, trans fats are excreted into breastmilk if eaten by the mother.

Don't even get me started again on the Kellymom/PC view, "even if you eat only junk food, your breastmilk is perfect" ridiculousness! I was SO happy to see a recent Mothering article dispelling this thought as one of the myths of bf'ing.

Ok how did I start talking about bf'ing in a pg thread?! Rants are contagious and that is a pet one of mine.

[JaneS]

Originally Posted by crunchy_mama

Thanks ladies for the thread. We are planning to ttc in a few months and am trying to improve my eating here. I have got to find a source for raw dairy!

sources around the globe: www.realmilk.org

[Momtezuma Tuatara]

Originally Posted by JaneS

And of course the good old hydrogenated fats that MT talked about in the margarine post above... the trans fats become part of your cells.

Like they know that trans fats provoke asthma, which has been proven and written up, but how many docs even know, let alone have any idea of the mechanism.


Someone mentions tests for vitamins. Many are available, but personally I think they are useless, because every person has unique needs. It's better to go by signs.

There is only one test I have found accurate, and that is the oral zinc test, but if you have enough zinc in you, the results are so unpalatable, that you'd never willingly go back for another, coz its only zinc deficient people who taste nothing. The rest end up tasting vileness reminiscent of paint stripper for about a day urgh....

[JaneS]

Excellent site for info on mercury in fish and recommended safe fish for pg women and children:

http://www.ewg.org/reports/BrainFood/pr.html

[gardenmommy]

I have only one other thing to add (as if I could ever improve on this!). Make sure you drink plenty of good quality water. Not the chlorinated flouridated stuff that comes out of most taps. Really good filtered water. There is lots of debate about what that means; we have a good source of reverse osmosis with something else (it's late and I'm tired, forgive my vagueness). We have a well, but living next to so many farms, I won't drink it, as I'm concerned about chemical runoff. Just make sure that what you are drinking and bathing in is clean.

[crunchy_mama]

Thanks for the fish site (and the milk site too btw). I was surprised to read that they recommended farmed catfish. Catfish is plentiful around here and dh had been planning on taking a fishing trip to stock up the freezer. I guess it would also depend on the river that you catch the fish from as well. I wonder if testing the water is adequate? I am making a trip to St Louis here next week and hope to pick up some wild salmon, if it isn't too darn expensive.

[JaneS]

Speaking of fluoride, non organic tea contains it.

Also any bottled soda, rice/nut milk, and juice that is reconstituted with water usually uses fluoridated water.

[JaneS]

The Brewer Diet:
http://www.blueribbonbaby.org/ifyoua...utrition.shtml

Also the salt should be sea salt.
Regular sodium choloride commercial salt is stripped of minerals and is thought to cause hypertension b/c it does not combine correctly with the blood.

[momto l&a]

Originally Posted by JaneS

Speaking of fluoride, non organic tea contains it.

Being the leaves get the fluoride from air polution even organic tea will have it.

The best way as I understand it to avoid as much as possible is to drink high quality tea made from the smaller leaves. The smaller the leaves the less old they are thus the less time thet have had to collect fluoride.


If a person wants some yummy salt try the Redmond RealSalt. Its all natural sea salt from ancient sea bed, containing 50+ trace minerals We love the taste of it, kind sweet but salty.

[JaneS]

Fluoride's in the air too? I thought it was the water used.
We are definately going the way of the dinosaurs.

[Katana]

Originally posted by momto l&a
If a person wants some yummy salt try the Redmond RealSalt. Its all natural sea salt from ancient sea bed, containing 50+ trace minerals my We love the taste of it, kind sweet but salty. my

We love this stuff.

Originally posted by JaneS
Fluoride's in the air too? I thought it was the water used.
We are definately going the way of the dinosaurs.

My FIL is a dentist. His favorite subject to discuss is flouride. Yes, it is in the water, air, it's everywhere. He thinks a good side benefit to pollution is that the flouride is spread more widely, able to reach more people. He insists this is a good thing. We'd all have brown teeth and brittle bones without it. And most likely, four out of five dentists would agree.

On a fish related note, I've been told that I would like the taste of catfish, properly prepared. Whole Foods sells something called either free range cat fish or wild catfish, but it is so expensive. I have a relative who buys it from them and insists it's worth the price.

[mama_nomad]

I've been lurking...I have nothing to add (I am so glad JaneS is here!) but I wanted to reiterate that DAD should be on this diet too!! He's "providing the material" so-to-speak (during conception anyway!) and it seems silly to spend all this energy on yourself if you are getting "junk sperm"....I know WAP has written about how tribal cultures prepare for conception, both parties eating certain cleansing foods at least 6 months before concieving.

and to whoever mentioned getting exercise with toddler, I would be nowhere with out my super-duper double jogging strolleri don't actually jog with it but I do hoof it up some major hills. (is there a "huff and puff" smilie?)

[JaneS]

Originally Posted by Katana

He thinks a good side benefit to pollution is that the flouride is spread more widely, able to reach more people. He insists this is a good thing. We'd all have brown teeth and brittle bones without it.

OMG that is just so... absurd. Well he's been subject to propaganda too I guess. Give him 'Nutrition and Physical Degeneration' for his birthday and watch his head spin

Originally Posted by Katana

On a fish related note, I've been told that I would like the taste of catfish, properly prepared. Whole Foods sells something called either free range cat fish or wild catfish, but it is so expensive. I have a relative who buys it from them and insists it's worth the price.

Wild from where though is the question.

EWG specifically says farm raised trout and catfish. I know all Massachusetts fresh waters, even though some have a lot of fish, are toxic and it's not safe to eat any of it. There's a website somewhere that rates your local waters.

Just thinking my mom grew up clamming and crabbing on Cape Cod. Pretty scary how much we've done to the environment in a generation.

[crunchy_mama]

Hey Jane do you know who has the website who rates the waters?

That is a good point about making sure dh is on the diet as well. This is one of the big reasons I am looking to secure raw milk, dh drinks a boatload of milk.

I did call a lady with a goat farm. She actually said she was going to send me the list of all the goat farmers in MO and northern Arkansas. So, hopefully I am going to find a local source.