Do you think of yourself as a friend to dc?

[mykdsmomy]

I am wondering if this is all part of the gd spectrum or not. I remember as I was growing up my mom telling me on more than one occasion that she is NOT my friend, she is my mother. Do you all strive to be your child's "friend" or is there a distinct line between parent and child? I wanted to ask this question in this forum because I wanted to see what the gd parents think? I hope that makes sense

[captain crunchy]

Well, our daughter is only 8 months nearly, so take it for what it is worth!

I do want to be my daughter's friend. I don't mean the kind you see on Jerry Springer where I am buying her pot at 14 and taking her to clubs where she hooks up with random men type friend.

I mean more of the relationship where she feels she can talk openly to me without judgement or punishment, where she feels comfortable coming to me if she has questions about life or her body or boys (or girls) and where she knows I will not lecture her or judge or punish her for her feelings and beliefs and wants and dreams... I want her to feel safe coming to me with problems and feel secure in knowing that I will help her if she is in trouble or needs advice or help...

... on the flip side, I want her to know she is welcome to her privacy too and that I don't feel entitled to know every aspect of her life because I am her mother.

That having been said, I do think peer relationships are important, so I don't want her to feel like I have to be her best friend or even be offended if I weren't the most important person to her... I don't want a situation where she feels pressured to *be there for me* as my friend because I have always been her mother and have no other identity other than that ya know? I have seen situations where 30 year old women live with their mothers (who are still healthy and such) because they don't want their mom to be alone and as a result, are not free to pursue any kind of life for themselves... I don't want to put that on my daughter at all.

[maya44]

Nope. Friendship just does not cut it. I think I owe her ALOT more than I would owe a friend. And I think she owes me alot less than she would owe a friend.

There are characteristics that make up a fiendship that I hope to include in ther parent-child relationship, but to me the relationships are simply different.

[royaloakmi]

I am not my children's friend; I am their mother.

As they grow, I believe that part of my role is to set and help them explore age appropriate boundaries. I don't think that is part of a role of a friend.

However, I hope that our attachment will endure and develop as they age so that we continue to have an open relationship that is filled with love, free of judgement and mutally respectful. Those ARE qualities of friendship I suppose.

I hope if I do my job right (or even partially right), they will develop into human beings that are capable of making and maintaining nurturing relationships with many other people - people who can be their friends.

[allgirls]

I am their mother, their biggest advocate, the one who loves them no matter what, unconditionally even if we have totally different views, ideas, talents and nothing in common. It's a totally different relationship that includes friendship as part of the deal but encompasses so much more.

and I do not expect them to be my friend though..I have other people who take care of that need for me. But I would like to share common interests and talk about things in a friendly way.

I think that's kind of a problem with my oldest dd..she treats me like I am one of her friends and I am not. I am her mother. I find it really hard to be interested in what Fifty Cent is saying in his latest rap song. I try to get interested. I really do but I really don't like "fitty" or "G-Unit" though I love Eminem

That's what friends are..people you choose to be with because you have things in common with them. While I am iterested in my children's life I do not have a lot in common with them. I encourage them to make those relationships with their peers.

[captain crunchy]

Weird. I read through the responses and I wonder what kind of friends some of you have. My (close) friends would die for me, they listen to me, I listen to them, they help me, I help them, they are there for me to advise me, I am there to advise them when they want it. They would loan me money or the shirt off their back, and I the same. They don't judge me, or lecture me, are honest with me and support me -- but would also feel comfortable and honest enough to tell me when they disagree....oh and so much more...

So I guess I can't understand when some people say "I am not their friend!!" with such, I don't know, distain or something...as if it is so much *lesser* than a mother... there were tons of times in my life I was closer to my friends than my mother... and still am in some respects -- partly probably because my mom wa sin the "I am not your friend I am your mother" camp... which closed off a lot of communication (imo)...

[Llyra]

To me, friendship is a more limited relationship. If one of my friends backstabbed or betrayed me in some serious way, or if I and one of my friends completely stopped enjoying each other's company, I would probably drop the friendship. Friends grow apart, for instance. To me, friendship is a mutual thing, and when it's no longer mutual then it's over.

My relationship with my family is not conditional like that. They are my family for the rest of my life, and no matter what passes between us they will always be my family.

And as unconditional as my relationship to my family is, my relationship to my own child is ten times as unconditional.

That to me is the essential difference.

Also, I know there are plenty of times where I will have to go against my daughter's wishes, do something that is good for her but that she will not necessarily like or welcome. I wouldn't do that to a friend-- it's not my job to shape my friends' characters or teach my friends how to function in civilized society. In other words, it's not my job to discipline my friends. It is my job to discipline my child.

That's another big difference.

Also, my friends may be my friends for the rest of my life. But my relationship with my child will change so much-- parenting is a long process of gradually letting go.

I would hope that when my daughter is an independent adult, we will have a relationship very like friendship. But not while she's still a child.

[Jish]

My mother was always much more of a friend to me. In my dysfunctional family, there was almost a reversal of rolls with me as much more of the parenting roll than my mother. I found it really hard to take her seriously as a parent when she wanted to go from friend to parent. It was alright when I was a kid, I guess, but I would have preferred a less dysfunctional family dynamic.

When my mom got married (My dh and I were engaged at the time and in our mid 20's) she decided that she wanted to fill the mothering roll again. It has caused a huge rift in our relationship that has taken more than 10 years to begin to heal and we have a long way to go.

I personally hope that my children will see me as a friend and a parent. I believe that it is my job to guide them as they grow into adults, and that may sometimes mean that I will be much more of a parent, but at the same time I want them to know that I am always there for them no matter what they need or the choices they make. Love should be unconditional in a parent/child relationship.

[maya44]

Originally Posted by Llyra

To me, friendship is a more limited relationship. If one of my friends backstabbed or betrayed me in some serious way, or if I and one of my friends completely stopped enjoying each other's company, I would probably drop the friendship. Friends grow apart, for instance. To me, friendship is a mutual thing, and when it's no longer mutual then it's over.

My relationship with my family is not conditional like that. They are my family for the rest of my life, and no matter what passes between us they will always be my family.

And as unconditional as my relationship to my family is, my relationship to my own child is ten times as unconditional.

That to me is the essential difference.

Also, I know there are plenty of times where I will have to go against my daughter's wishes, do something that is good for her but that she will not necessarily like or welcome. I wouldn't do that to a friend-- it's not my job to shape my friends' characters or teach my friends how to function in civilized society. In other words, it's not my job to discipline my friends. It is my job to discipline my child.

That's another big difference.

Also, my friends may be my friends for the rest of my life. But my relationship with my child will change so much-- parenting is a long process of gradually letting go.

I would hope that when my daughter is an independent adult, we will have a relationship very like friendship. But not while she's still a child.

WONDERFULLY, WONDERFULLY, WONDERFULLY PUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


This is why those of us who do not think the parent-child relationship) is a "friendship" do not consider it so.

CaptainCrunch said her friends would die for her. I am willing to die for my children but I never would want them to do the same.

Of course your friends should support you and listen to you, but if they stop you may choose to move on. My children, when they are children, do not have the job of doing these things. And even if they did, I would not love them any less if they failed in these tasks.

I do not disdain the idea of "friendship" its just that with my children it is a totally and completely inadequate concept for what our my duties as well as my feelings for them.

[Piglet68]

:

[johub]

I also do not intend to be my child's friend. Being a Mother is so much more, although it incorporates all of the good qualities of a friend it is so much above and beyond what a friend is.

[captain crunchy]

I don't understand why it has to be an either/or situation...either I am her mother or her friend -- is there no room for both?

I strive to be both to our daughter...if I am *just* her friend, then there are some issues such as the pp's pointed out... but being *only* her mother seems to create a dynamic of inequality to me...a trump card if you will. I don't want to pull that trump card... the whole... "because I said so.. I am your mother!"

[Llyra]

Well honestly, even after everything I said in my other post, I think it boils down to one thing, and that's a thing that we have major, major ideological differences about here. We're never gonna agree, no matter how many times we hash it out in one thread after another. I'm gonna say my piece, though. Don't ask me why-- maybe I'm just a sucker for punishment.

I do not believe that I have any right to be an authority over my friend. If my friend embarked on something truly dangerous or truly morally wrong, I would of course endeavor to convince him/her to stop the course of action. Friends do that for each other. But at some point, if the friend persisted, I would have to say, "okay, fine, it's your life." Any power I have over my friend's behavior is the result of our mutual respect and regard for one another-- in the end I have no power over her behavior.

I do believe that I have the right and responsiblity to be an authority in my child's life, and if my child (while still a child) intended something dangerous or morally wrong, I would do everything in my power to stop that child. I would of course try to draw on our mutual respect and trust to influence my child, but if that didn't work, and I judged the moral or physical danger to be serious enough, I wouldn't hesitate to invoke the power of my authority as an adult and a parent. This includes, where absolutely necessary and where no other option will serve, the use of coercion or force.

Parenting to me is a hierchical relationship. A benevolent one, to be sure, and one with room for individuality and mutual respect and negotiation, but still a hierarchy. In the end, she is dependent on me, and that gives me an authority that really doesn't disturb me at all. I am not afraid that I will abuse that power, and I do not fear that my child will be emotionally damaged in any way because of my willingness to assume an authoritate position when I deem it necessary for her well-being.

Friendship is based on "liking" each other-- on mutual regard, on enjoying one another's company, etc. I do of course hope for that kind of positive connection with my child. If that's what you mean when you talk about being a friend as well as a parent, well sure. But what I mean when I say I don't want to be her friend, is that she's not always going to "like" me or like what I say or do. That doesn't bother me. It's my responsiblity to teach her what she needs to know to be a happy, successful, productive, ethical adult. It is not my responsibility to make sure she always likes me.

In other words, I may someday find myself saying "because I said so," and I have no ideological problem with that.

[captain crunchy]

I don't always like my friends. True friendship ebbs and flows. There have been times where my friends and I haven't always agreed, and times when we have been so angry with eachother that we needed a break of sorts. I have a very close friend who shares hardly any similar interests with me anymore, but we have been best friends for 15 years and she is family to me... I don't need to like the same bands she likes to be her best friend.

In as much as you don't agree with me, I feel the same and that is okay. I don't strive to be a "benevolent ruler" . Just because someone is dependent on me, doesn't give me control to decide for them what is "morally right". Loving and providing and protecting someone doesn't give someone authority. My husband supports our family financially. In a way I am very "dependent" on him financially, and even emotionally to a degree because he is my best friend and number one supporter --- he has no control over me.

It amazes me sometimes the level of control parents *think* they have over their children to stop them from doing things that are "wrong." Some day, sooner than anyone realizes, that toddler that you can control is going to become a teenager that you can't.

I would rather already have a solid 14 or so years under our belts of consensual living and a relationship that doesn't have a dynamic of control where our child (ren) know our relationship is based on mutual respect, and not force.

ETA: ... and I never understood the idea that we can "make" ethical adults by control.

[johub]

Originally Posted by captain crunchy

I don't always like my friends. True friendship ebbs and flows..

Yeah, I will always be a mom to my child. It will not ebb or flow. And my love will never subside.
Friendship isnt always like that.

And as for either/or. Well, I just think that the two relationships overlap in some ways but are not the same and there are many things about friendship that I do not wish to model in my relationships with my children, the above quote is one example.
I do always strive to keep our mother/child relationship on friendly terms, but we are more than friends.

[The4OfUs]

To me, being a mother includes *aspects* of being a friend, but it's much more than that.

Call me a bad friend , but I wouldn't die for my friends...I would throw myself in front of a bullet for my child or my husband, though.

I want to have the closeness and trust of a 'friendship' with my children, but I do not want to burden them with my own personal issues...that's not a boundary I'm comfortable crossing. Not to say that I wouldn't let them know if I was sad, or mad, or whatever, but I wouldn't feel comfortable "dumping" on them like I do my peers if I have something going on I need to work through.

I feel like I "owe" my child more than I do my friends, and also because of my core beliefs (which a PP mentioned I don't think we'll all ever agree on), I also feel more responsible for my children's well being than I do my friends.

So yeah, there will hopefully be similarities between the relationships I have with my friends and the ones I have with my children, but to me being their mother is so much more than that...some of it better, some of it worse...but in the end, much deeper and more special than any friendship could ever be.

[irinam]

If the question is "are you ONLY a friend" to your dc, then no, I am not ONLY a friend. If the question is " are you a friend to your dc among other things" then yes I consider myself their friend as well as many other things I am to them and they are to me. I would like to believe they think that too.

I also think the definition of friendship differs greatly. Some people call casual aquintences (sp?) friends. I don't. Friends also come in different shapes and sizes. I can have a 10yo friend. I can have a 70yo friend. Would our friendship be different? You bet. Similary my friendship with my kids.

With some friends we (among other things) go partying and drinking. Would I do it with my kids? No. Would I do it with a 10yo friend? No.

With some friends we ski black diamond in Taho. Would I do it with a 70yo friend? Probably not (though depends!) Would I go with my kids? DS yes. DD not yet.

So in short, I don't think being their mother excludes me from being their friend.

[JillChristina]

Originally Posted by irinam

So in short, I don't think being their mother excludes me from being their friend.

:

I know I am my dd's friend because she tells me I am. But that doesn't mean I take my role as her mother any more lightly. I'm sure our friendship will wax and wane but I'll always be her mom. Hopefully when all is said and done, I will get to be mother and friend to my children.

Jill

[Soundhunter]

I consider Emma my buddy, we spend all day every day together, so, we are buddies.

But, she is not in the same realm as my friends, for many reasons listed beautifully by others, but I'll add something.

I talk to my FRIENDS about personal problems and issues that I will not talk to Emma about. I talk to my friends about my sex life, my occasional marital struggles, money worries etc. Everyone that I know, young and old, is really discomforted when their parents discuss their own personal problems this deeply with them, which to me, illustrates another difference. I don't think children want to be considered friends by their parents, if it means leaning on their children the way they lean on their friends. I don't lean on Emma when I'm emotionally troubled, I think it would be really poor mothering to do so, for that, I go to my friends. Friends are there to be burdened on when needed, our children are not.

To me, there is a difference. Me and Emma are buddies, I am her mother, she is my daughter, we really enjoy each other's company, have lots of inside jokes and other friendly type things, but we do not lean on each other the way friends do. (maya, guess you where kinda saying this too) Emma does lean on me this way now while she is little, and our relationship is a model for her about human relationships in general can be including friendships, but once she is older, I expect that she will want to lean on her friends with things she would not want to lean on me for. Already, she is stoked when she can corner one of our family friends all to herself and have them as "her" friend, and she behaves much differently with them than with us!

Also, there is no question in my mind that family and friends are different categories of relationships. I'm basing this on the healthy, close families of multiple generations that I know (not my own). Emil and I are modelling our family on the healthy, balanced, happy families that we know, none of which are radical consensual living non coercive families, all of which are very close, loving, good people whose lifestyles and family values we have respect enough for to want to emulate as much as this works with our own personal family dynamics. And in these families we choose to model, the members do not consider their friends to be on par, or of higher value than their parents, the opposite would be true (other than a normal phase in the teenage years) I don't think being friends with children is a necessary part of having a close loving and healthy family.

[irinam]

Rachel, I totally see what you are saying, however I could not help but smile because sometimes I *do* lean on DS emotionaly, just like he leans on me and we help each other! I think not seeing me as a martyr, but as a human actually helps him open up to me when he needs a shoulder to lean on.

Yes, I would "save" some issues for other friends (like if I had a sex issue I needed to discuss, I would probably call on my best girlfriend that is similar in age to me and not onother gender, age-group friend - because that is what *I* am comfortable with), but I don't think there is anything wrong with your kids helping you emotionally.