My son had 12.5 micrograms of thermerisol...how much is allowed by FDA for babies?

[nikolette]

I am SOOOOOOOOOO angry right now. My 11 mo old is showing red flags for autism and his pedi office just got back with me with the amts of thermerisol he got in his vax's (after I requested all thermerisol free) and in his flu shot alone he got 12.5 micrograms. That doesnt include the trace amounts in the Pediarix's he got also. But I'm looking for a link that shows what is "acceptable" to CDC or FDA or some goverment and I'm not finding the amount. Can anyone point me in the right direction? I am never vaccinating again!

Nik

And Thank you.........

[Tofu the Geek]

It is the EPA that sets these limits. For mercury it appears to be

0.1 µg/kg body weight/day as an exposure without recognized adverse effects

They call this a "reference dose". You can find more info here http://www.epa.gov/mercury/exposure.htm

[nikolette]

Ok, I'm an idot, but how many micrograms are in a kg? Or rather how would that translate 12.5 micrograms = what percentage of a kg? I'm horrible in math AND science....

Thanks again.

Nik

[Tofu the Geek]

Hi Nik,

You're NOT an idiot. You're asking questions which is SMART. Calculations can be confusing, especially when you are in a worried state!

How many pounds (or kg) did your DS weigh at the time of the vaccines? We'll take that weight, convert it to kg and then we'll multiply that by 0.1 to find out how many micrograms exposure was "safe" for his body weight (I use the term "safe" loosely. The EPA does not mean that their reference dose is "safe", they simply mean that their was no recognized adverse effects at that dose).

So, here's an example, let's say your son weighed 20 lbs:

20 lbs = 9.07 kg
9.07 x 0.1 = .907 micrograms/day of mercury for his body weight

In my example of your son weighing 20 lbs, the 12.5 micrograms would be approx. 13-14 times higher than the EPA's reference dose for his weight. No matter what your son weighed when he got the vaccines, 12.5 micrograms is likely MUCH higher than what is deemed acceptable by the EPA for daily mercury exposure for his weight.

[midstreammama]

I just did some math, and if I did it right, you would have to weigh 275lbs for this to be an "acceptable" level?!!! (according to the EPA)

Ugh, I think i'll be sick now. :Puke

[Tofu the Geek]

Originally Posted by midstreammama

I just did some math, and if I did it right, you would have to weigh 275lbs for this to be an "acceptable" level?!!! (according to the EPA)

Ugh, I think i'll be sick now. :Puke

Yup, sounds about right.

[crysmomofthree]

Originally Posted by nikolette

I am SOOOOOOOOOO angry right now. My 11 mo old is showing red flags for autism and his pedi office just got back with me with the amts of thermerisol he got in his vax's (after I requested all thermerisol free) and in his flu shot alone he got 12.5 micrograms. That doesnt include the trace amounts in the Pediarix's he got also. But I'm looking for a link that shows what is "acceptable" to CDC or FDA or some goverment and I'm not finding the amount. Can anyone point me in the right direction? I am never vaccinating again!

Nik

And Thank you.........

I would go see a naturopath and check into chelation therapy?

[nikolette]

Agghhh! I am just sick to think about what they did to my son, and what I allowed! I know I asked for thermerisol free, but it was just some nurses aid or something and I should have asked to see the insert for the drug...or, I dont know, I should have done something...but it was before I started research and before I realized how horrible vaccines are and before I saw the Dev Delays starting and,....I feel like such an idot and such a failure.

I went to the EPA site and looked under the Ethylmercury (which is what I believe is in thermerisol) but I cant find the "allowable" dose information. Does anyone know where it is on the site? Perhaps its on a table with all of the "allowable" amounts of crap that we should never be exposed to?

And if I can find it, does that mean I can sue the university who gave it to him and help pay for chelation and therapy and all the other stuff we are going to have to pay out of pocket for?

Thanks ladies for doing the calculation. I cant do math to save my life. And you were exactly right...he was 20 lbs at the time. Crap!

Nik

[Tofu the Geek]

Originally Posted by nikolette

I went to the EPA site and looked under the Ethylmercury (which is what I believe is in thermerisol) but I cant find the "allowable" dose information. Does anyone know where it is on the site? Perhaps its on a table with all of the "allowable" amounts of crap that we should never be exposed to?

If you click on the link I posted earlier, it's on that page. I cut and pasted the quote right from the page. Here is some more in depth info on the reference dose for mercury http://www.epa.gov/iris/subst/0073.htm

[alegna]

Originally Posted by nikolette

Agghhh! I am just sick to think about what they did to my son, and what I allowed! I know I asked for thermerisol free, but it was just some nurses aid or something and I should have asked to see the insert for the drug...or, I dont know, I should have done something...but it was before I started research and before I realized how horrible vaccines are and before I saw the Dev Delays starting and,....I feel like such an idot and such a failure.

You know what? Even if the inserts had said no thermerisol, it probably would have still contained some. And no, you can't sue anyone- don't you know, vaxes are safe!

-Angela

[MyLittleWonders]

Shouldn't Nicolette report her son's symptoms to VAERS? I don't have the link handy (though I should) but reading her post and knowing that there's nothing she can do in terms of suing made me think of at least reporting any adverse affects (dev. delays would count, right?).

[Unreal]

Originally Posted by alegna

You know what? Even if the inserts had said no thermerisol, it probably would have still contained some. And no, you can't sue anyone- don't you know, vaxes are safe!

-Angela

:Puke

[blessed]

Not to minimize your concern at all or lessen what you're feeling. But just to help put things into some context for you.

The reference dose is an estimated amount of exposure per day over the course of an lifetime.

So if your baby was 10kg (about 22lbs), his reference dose for safe exposure as defined by the EPA would be an average of 1 microgram per day, or an annual exposure of 365 micrograms and a lifetime exposure well in excess of 30,000 micrograms.

By way of comparison, before thimersol was removed from vaccines in the late '90s babys were receiving about 240 micrograms by their first 18 months of life due to vaccines alone. Many older vaccines contained 50 micrograms apiece.

Another major source of mercury exposure is environmental from fish consumption. Also amalgam dental fillings, which leach about 3 micrograms per day - every day for the rest of our lives - of mercury into our bodies. This ends up providing a measurable source of mercury exposure to infants who are breastfeeding from moms with amalgam fillings.

I'm not trying to make any arguments about the safety or lack of from the dose or the manner it was received in your son. That's a whole different, very complex set of data. Just throwing some basic numbers out there since you seem to be looking for some reference points to start out from.

[LongIsland]

Originally Posted by blessed

By way of comparison, before thimersol was removed from vaccines in the late '90s

Thimerosal was not removed from vaccines in the "late '90s."

[LongIsland]

Originally Posted by blessed

Not to minimize your concern at all or lessen what you're feeling. But just to help put things into some context for you.

The reference dose is an estimated amount of exposure per day over the course of an lifetime.

Right. So, if a child receives 12.5 micrograms in one day . . . what sort of "context" are you "helping to put things into?"

My son received 12.5 micrograms in one day at one week of age, then at 8 weeks received 36.5 micrograms in one day and received an additional 36.5 micrograms (in one day) every two months until he was six months old. The last dose of full strength thimerosal-containing vaccine was administered at 17 months.

"Over the course of a lifetime" means absolutely nothing when a child is receiving 12.5 micrograms of mercury in one day.

[blessed]

Originally Posted by LongIsland

Thimerosal was not removed from vaccines in the "late '90s."

This was my understanding (for example, see below article). I know that my own child has never received a multi-dose vaccination. But perhaps there's more to it? There's always more to learn, so please, feel free to expand on your statement if you've an interest in doing so. This has been my understanding of how vaccines have been handled here in the US.

Expert Opin Drug Saf. 2006 Jan;5(1):17-29.

When science is not enough - a risk/benefit profile of thiomersal-containing vaccines.

Clements CJ, McIntyre PB.
Centre for International Health, The Macfarlane Burnet Institute for Medical Research and Public Health Ltd, GPO Box 2284, Commercial Road, Melbourne, VIC 3004, Australia. [e-mail]

Without a preservative, such as thiomersal (known as thimerosal in the US), multi-dose liquid presentations of vaccine are vulnerable to bacteriological contamination that can result in death or serious illness of the recipient. Concerns about levels of mercury exposure from thiomersal-containing vaccines were first raised in the US during 1999 in the context of Hepatitis B vaccine for newborns. Since then, a large body of evidence from animal and epidemiological studies has accumulated on the safety of thiomersal. Ironically, these data have become largely irrelevant in wealthy countries, where mono-dose, thiomersal-free vaccines have been introduced as a precautionary measure in almost all childhood vaccines, in part related to residual public scepticism. In poor countries, multi-dose vials remain important for vaccine delivery.

[MyLittleWonders]

But, even if you take the "average" exposure rate, so to speak, and even if one thought that it is okay to inject/ingest mercury into one's system on a daily rate, because heck, the EPA says it's safe ... do you (blessed in particular) really think it's okay to overload a 20 lb baby's system with 12.5 mg of mercury in ONE DAY? Do you really think it is okay to treat a baby's system the same as a 275 lb adult's system? And really, would you want to expose your child to the daily "safe" dose of mercury each day just to prove that it's really okay?

To me, there is no "context" in which to look at a 20lb baby (or practially any other child or adult) being injected with 12.5 mg of mercury in one day.

[Tofu the Geek]

Originally Posted by blessed

Not to minimize your concern at all or lessen what you're feeling. But just to help put things into some context for you.

The reference dose is an estimated amount of exposure per day over the course of an lifetime.

So if your baby was 10kg (about 22lbs), his reference dose for safe exposure as defined by the EPA would be an average of 1 microgram per day, or an annual exposure of 365 micrograms and a lifetime exposure well in excess of 30,000 micrograms.

Sure, but a large sum on one day could greatly help to put you over your "yearly" dose. You'll likely still get exposure from other sources so why load yourself up if it's not necessary?

Originally Posted by blessed

By way of comparison, before thimersol was removed from vaccines in the late '90s babys were receiving about 240 micrograms by their first 18 months of life due to vaccines alone.

If they removed mercury from vaccines in the late 90's, why is it that her son received 12.5 micrograms of mercury from one vaccine in the last 11 months?

[LongIsland]

I bumped up a thimerosal "misconception" thread - you'll know which one it is.

[sunshinestarr]

Originally Posted by blessed

By way of comparison, before thimersol was removed from vaccines in the late '90s babys were receiving about 240 micrograms by their first 18 months of life due to vaccines alone. Many older vaccines contained 50 micrograms apiece.

Another major source of mercury exposure is environmental from fish consumption. Also amalgam dental fillings, which leach about 3 micrograms per day - every day for the rest of our lives - of mercury into our bodies. This ends up providing a measurable source of mercury exposure to infants who are breastfeeding from moms with amalgam fillings.

Doesn't this HORRIFY anyone??? Mercury is a poison - why do you think so many of these people have so many health problems today? Don't you think there's any correlation at all? Altheizemers? (sp?) Athsma? Just because it's been done for so long doesn't make it safe.

The mercury in fish is also very scary.. And I've had my amalgams removed for this very reason.. (Dear Parents.. They didn't know..) I'm just saying, just because it's in other things, doesn't make it all right, or harmless.