Music lesson problems?

[rebeccalizzie]

Okay, this is driving me INSANE. DD plays the violin. She's reasonably talented and has been playing for about 3 years. Getting her to practice is like pulling teeth. I asked her 4 times tonight before I finally gave up. She LOVES playing, or I guess she loves recitals and being able to tell people she plays. I've asked her if we can quit lessons 100 times, she gets very upset. She wants to be a "professional violinist". I cannot seem to get through to her that professional violinists are not people who refuse to practice. I explain that her teacher (who is in music school) practices hours a day. her teacher has tried the same arguments--she won't get better, she ends up playing the same songs for months because she doesn't progress, everything we can think of.

The latest effort involved me explaining that Dad and I work hard and sacrifice our time and a lot of money to get her there. That's our part of the bargain, and her part is to practice. I doubt this is going to work either, nothing else does. In her mind, I guess, she's entitled to whatever the heck she wants without any effort at all on her part.

The thing is, this is very expensive, it's hard for us to pay for right now, and I'm feeling like it's a total waste that she doesn't appreciate in the slightest. She has gotten most of the way through one book in TWO DAMN YEARS. It has taken this *very* musically talented 10 year old child two years to get not quite through one book that they use with beginning 4 year olds!

i'm at the end of my rope. The only thing I can think of to do is to tell her if she skips practice twice in one week she'll miss a lesson. Miss 3 lessons and she misses the quarterly recital. This is all I've come up with. I'm ashamed to say I've threatened to make her quit, but I have, and I know full well I won't do that so it was an empty threat anyway.

Help? Please? I'm trying to be GD, and I know none of this probably is anywhere near GD, but I just cannot afford to keep paying out for something she could care less about.

I just want to cry...

[sovereignqueen]

I remember my mom putting up a sign in my room that said "you don't have to practice everyday, just on the days you eat"
I also remember practice charts -- we had to practice so many minuits a day (10 or 15 I think) and we recorded it on a cart (it was for our teacher)
and I remember having to practice double the ammount of the weekly lesson, so if I had a 30 minuit lesson I had to practice 60 minuits that week or I didn't get to go (untill I was doing prepaid lessons, but by that time I was in HS and paying for them myself, which evolved from "since you're not practicing but want lessons you pay for them, but I was old enough to babysit )
Good Luck. Is there a youth symphony in your area she could join? If she was in an orchestra she would learn that if you don't learn your part when you're supposed to if affects everyone.

[rebeccalizzie]

Yup, there is a youth symphony at her music school that she wants to join, but she isn't good enough yet. Which I thought would be something to inspire her!

Sigh...I just don't know what to do. I'm going to talk to her teacher, but I don't know if she'll have any ideas either. I pay for lessons quarterly, so "punishing" her by making her skip lessons won't help me much. I'm still mulling over that one though.

[Earth Angel]

Hi! I'm so sorry you and your Dd are having so much trouble getting something to happen that she does say she enjoys. I can give you advice from your Dd's angel, but my boys are too young yet to be in situations like this, so from a parenting angle, I'm not much help

When I was 6 I began playing piano, and, in 4th grade...so 9 yo, about your Dd's age, I began also playing the flute. My mom harped on me CONSTANTLY to practice, and I was practicing 2 instruments! It bugged me to no end. As a child I probably should have taken more responsibility for practicing, but with my mom's constant "reminders" I wasn't given the opportunity to make the decision for myself to either practice or, suffer the consequences (which would have been both of my teacher's dissapointment, and eventually refusing me as a student due to my lack of interest/committment). The harping created a place where practice for me was a form of drudgery, not a way to get better at an instrument I loved to play. It was counterproductive. As hard as it is, I would let it alone. It is her choice to practice or not....And, in my opinion, it is her teacher's place to create the consequences. If she isn't working through the material at a satisfactory speed, then, maybe she is discontinued as a student until she is ready to make more of a committment. I'm sure there are other children that would like to take lessons from this person, your daughter is taking up their space....and the teacher might need to let her know that. I really think that is why my mom ended up in power struggles with me. Yes, she paid for the lessons, and bought the music etc....but the musical relationship was between myself and my teachers....not myself and my mom or dad. So...it was my teachers and I that needed to work out the practicing business. I'm not sure that it will help....but at least it would also be the teacher discontinuing to provide lessons instead of you if she continued to not practice!

I was never at the place of such limited progress as your daughter....my teachers would DEFINATELY have stopped providing lessons for me if I had only worked through 1, beginner book in 2 years. And because of this, I think the teacher, again, is responsible for setting these limits...not you and your husband.....as much as it is understandable that you'd want to...it is you money, time etc afterall!

I respect the fact too that it is so frustrating to watch a child waste a talent such as this.....My father is a church organist, a concert organist, a piano teacher and also plays piano for a few local choirs. He was taught by my grandmother.....can you imagine! He HATED it. All he wanted to do was play with his friends...but then gram would call him in to practice or for a lesson. To this day I think there is a rift between them because of this...but....he also ended up wanting to go to college for music and make a profession out of it. It was my gram as his teacher that enforced all of this though that worked....not gram his mom.

Maybe her teacher can set the practicing limits too??? Practice for this amt of time and continue, but if there is no committment to practice after however many days, weeks etc, then the teacher will have to discontinue lessons until such time as she can make the committment to be fully engaged with learning this instrument and all that that requires.

I just have to say that engaging in the power struggles about practicing with your daughter is probably a losing battle. The pp said that there was a system that worked for her and her mother, but that would never have worked for my mom and I. Everyone is so different....I hope that you, your daughter and her teacher can find something that works for all of you

[Yooper]

I would let her decide if and when to practice. When and if dd becomes insterested in music, we will provide lessons for her because she enjoys it, not to groom any talent. It will be up to her to decide how to manage it and whether or not to continue.

I play the clarinet in an orchestra. I have played for 25 years. The first 5 or so, I never practiced. I did not want to and did not find a need. I progressed slowly and would probably have progressed faster had I practiced. But I probably would have quit if my parents "made" me. They never said a word. It was my business. We even had those "practice sheets" that the school sent home for parents to sign. My parents thought that was completely dumb and signed them anyway. Once I hit high school and found opportunities to play, I got more interested in practicing to be able to get into and stay in those groups. It was still sporatic based on my mood, the opportunities I was trying for, and my schedule. I am still that way, yet I am a good player. I think it is importnat for kids to enjoy the music and manage their own playing. Any attempt to "help" them parcitce more only serves to kill the fun and risks them stopping.

[CherylAnn]

I concur with Earth Angel. Her teacher believes that it is her responsibility to practice. I've provided her with a timer and she can choose to sit for 2 sets of 10 min or practice 20 minutes all at once. Sometimes, when she has a bad week of practicing I hear my naggy voice coming out, but it's because I feel embarassed. When I recognized that I was trying to "look good" through her good progress I felt really ashamed! I'm not saying you are doing this. That was just my reason for pushing her. Some weeks she practices like crazy and other weeks she barely touches the piano. I do encourage her sometimes by helping her to find a good 20 min. block but I try not to repeat myself. That's hard!

[rebeccalizzie]

Earth angel and Cheryl Ann, thank you. Definitely lots to think about, and I think you are both absolutely right that this should be between DD and her teacher. Her last teacher was terrible, which is why we switched. This one seems more focused, and DD and I both like her better. She will maybe come up with something, and then I can step out of this. It is a total power struggle, and I really completely don't want that! I'll talk to her teacher this week and see if she has any ideas. She just started with this teacher a few months ago, so they haven't totally finished figuring each other out yet.

Yooper, I understand where you are coming from, because it's the way I play! But DD insists that she wants to progress more, gets frustrated that she isn't further along, and wants to be a concert violinist. She just doesn't want to put in the work to get better, she wants it to magically happen. Truthfully, I can find her a much cheaper teacher if she wants to just dabble in the violin. We're paying for an expensive teacher at her request, because she swears she wants to become a professional. I'm not grooming anything, I'm trying to encourage her to follow her own dreams.

I play the flute and have for around 20 years, but I've always played as a hobby. I don't practice a lot, and that's okay with me because I don't much care if I get a lot better. I've explained this to DD as well--that my lack of practice has made it impossible to ever be a concert flutist (if I had wanted to, which I didn't).

Anyway, lots of food for thought, and I'm definitely going to email her teacher and see what she says.

[RBinTEX]

Substitute the word "piano" for "violin" and I would swear you were peeking in my windows. My daughter loved lessons and zipped right through the books at first, but then quit practicing. I told her she could not continue lessons without practicing (used same words you did) and she said she loooved lessons and didn't want to quit. She just started softball, so I told her we would take a "vacation" from piano lessons until softball season is over. I hope she returns with more enthusiasm for practice after the break! (Now I've got to get her to practice her swing!)

[boomingranny]

Hi,

Well I'm an ex-musician (is there such a thing) or I guess, non-practicing. I HATED practicing. Self-motivation to practice comes from the child. If they don't have it, don't force it.

My dd started with guitar lessons because she wanted to go to rock and roll camp. Life lesson #100000 - the gap between the fantasy and reality may be too much. I tried not to intervene but she was NOt interested in practicing at all. However she loves music and knows a ton of stuff. So I thought to meself - what can she do musically that will require little practice and be a lot of fun? Well...there is a great kid's chorus here in NYC. It was audition only - but the kids just need to have decent ears to get in, not little kid broadway chops. She goes once a week..she gets to sing in a chorus which is a big rush. She is learning sight-singing and the chorus demands a certain level of commitment and discipline that I think is great. She doesn't have to practice. If she decides she's serious about an instrument then maybe we can explore that option. So maybe if your dd is a big music lover you can find a way for her to enjoy being musical without all the drama...

Best of luck!