Homebirthing and circumcision - Page 8

[boingo82]

Originally Posted by UmmBnB

I have several homebirthing friends who circ'ed for religious reasons. They typically have used a local mohel who will do a non-ritualistic circ in the home.

Huh? The only religion I know of that requires circ also requires the ritual for it to mean anything. The other religions tend to discourage it, if anything.

[Kathryn]

Yeah, if they honestly think they are doing it for religious reasons, they don't know their religion very well.

[Arwyn]

Do you know how many nonvaxers use a religious exemption whose nominal religion officially is neutral on vaccinations, or even pro-vax? I completely don't support circ'ing for any reason, but all they need for it to be "for religious reasons" is to feel called to do it by/for their G-d(s).

Which is different than, say, Protestants who think that it's biblically mandated that they have to circ. Please (please!) re-educate them on the falseness of that. But things don't have to be written down in holy books in order to "qualify" as "for religious reasons."

Which makes the intactivist's job of gentle persuasion much harder, to be sure (how do you argue against a religious calling?), but I think it's a really important fact to remember.

[eightyferrettoes]

Originally Posted by boingo82

Huh? The only religion I know of that requires circ also requires the ritual for it to mean anything. The other religions tend to discourage it, if anything.

Nope, Islam encourages/requires circ, depending on who you ask. Correct me if I'm mistaken. No ritual is required. From what I can understand, there are at least a couple schools of thought on the issue-- I know at least a couple of Muslim mamas here don't believe that they have a religious requirement to circ, though others disagree.

It's kind of complicated.

[LeosMama]

http://coloradonocirc.org/files/hand..._and_Islam.pdf

[Emilie]

i am trying to read this but i reaaly wish i had not circed my son....
my mw is against. i gad ds in a hospital.....
if dd had been a boy we decided not to.(duh) my friend had a terrible time with it.... she did not.(thank God)
she talked about it every day.
anyhow- my mw had 2 of her sons circed( they are in their 30".

[baybee]

(WMP, streaming) http://www.doctorsopposingcircumcisi...C/prepuce.html

(WMP, download) http://www.doctorsopposingcircumcisi...TSC_256k_D.wmv

[Victorian]

maybe one of the Jewish mothers (or Muslim) on the thread could explain to me how this (refusing to Doula/Midwife a woman who plans on circ'ing) could be a religious issue when there are people within the religion on both sides.

Not trying to cause problems, honestly curious.

V.

[crazy_eights]

A doula who is taking private clients can most likely do what she wants, but a healthcare provider who refuses a client b/c of a held religious belief is walking a line that I personally wouldn't want to have to defend in court. The fact that there are Jews and Muslims who do not circ does not change the fact that those who do it see it as a religious imperitive.

[mamaverdi]

The fact that there are Jews who eat pork does not mean that pork is no longer a forbidden food under the laws of Kashruth. Individual action does not change the law.

Likewise, the fact that there are Jews who do not circumcise their sons does not mean that it is not Jewish Law to do so. Individual action does not change the Law.

Where I can't see someone sueing a doula for her refusal...I can see her losing a lot of business if she were to be honest about why she was refusing.

I don't think I would want to defend myself in the court of my peers, in a court of law, or even just in the general public for refusing care to someone for a religious practice that would not even happen in my presence.

I wonder how midwives/doulas who refuse care for these women would advertise: No Jews, No Muslims...unless you've assimilated into the dominate culture?

mv

[annakiss]

I am closing this thread. We do not host discussions that debate religious circumcision and this has certainly long ago veered in that direction.