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Chelating mamas? - Page 27

post #521 of 850
That is a tough situation you are dealing with! Maybe you could start with the hair test and more importantly tuning into your intuition. I believe we do have the knowledge within to guide us.

Maybe other mamas here can help more. This is all new to me.
post #522 of 850
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rayo de sol View Post
Wow, what a thread! But I am sort of extremely freaked out now after spending that last few days reading this thread. Ack! I have stumbled upon this thread in my research on how to best prepare my body for TTC for the first time.

I am in my mid-thirties and I have 9 amalgam fillings, most of them quite large.

In terms of mercury toxicity symptoms, from the list from this article (http://www.westonaprice.org/envtoxins/mercury.html ) that someone posted earlier in the thread, I have:

-periodontal disease (I've had this for a few years now, and though I try to heal it through dental hygiene and a traditional foods diet, it just gets worse and worse. )

-loose teeth (which really scare and dismay me)

-inability to make decisions (This is sooo me!!!)

-insomnia

-low self-confidence, depression, anxiety, shyness

-headaches (I get headaches ALL the time. It sucks.)

-impaired visual acuity (Does anyone else have major floaters? When I look up at the sky all I see are floaters. )

-frequent urination, night urination, loss of libido

Gee, does anyone else have so many symptoms? I feel like a freak now.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So, where do I begin? I just feel so overwhelmed and scared about this mercury problem. I thought we could start TTC within the next year, but now...?

Maybe this is a dumb question, but is it highly probable that with all my mercury fillings that my baby would have significant health problems if I don't get the fillings replaced/chelate first? I mean, is it essential that I get my amalgams out before TTC?

What's the first step I should take? Should I get a hair test first?

What supplements should I start taking while I still have all my amalgams in my mouth? (I've never been a fan of taking supplements, but it sounds like they are essential to this process?)

How do I find a mercury-removing dentist in my area? What filling material is the least toxic? (I'd hate to replace the mercury with something else toxic.) What is the proper amalgam-removing protocol?

Is anyone else absolutely terrified of going to the dentist? It's just that I've already had so many years of torture from dentists, and they have basically ruined my health (and my smile).

After the last amalgam is replaced, how long do I have to wait to TTC?

I hope I'm not asking too many questions here. I'm just so horrified, overwhelmed, and depressed by the idea of having all 9 of my fillings replaced. :
This thread can be very overwhelming. Sorry I didn't reply to you sooner. I've had family in town and just didn't have enough computer time to write a long post.
There at two things you should do first. You want to find out if you are indeed mercury toxic. Regardless of the amount of amalgam in your mouth, the important factor is how your natural detox systems work. Are they functioning well enough to remove your daily dose of mercury from your body instead of storing the metal?
So, go to directlabs.com and order the hair elements test

http://directlabs.com/testtypes.php#hair

After you get results use Cutler's counting rules to determine whether you are mercury toxic

http://onibasu.com/archives/am/28183.html

Right now you can start to educate yourself on mercury toxicity and effects on the fetus. One of the best places is IAOMT which will also give you a list of dentists in your area that follow safe protocols for removing amalgam.

www.iaomt.com

Another good place to educate yourself is Cutler's site

www.noamalgam.com

If you do find that you are toxic and choose to chelate after having the amalgams removed that I cannot suggest that you buy Cutler's book Amalgam Illness (can be purchased from him and info is on his site) enough. Chelation can be dangerous and harmful if you don't educate yourself first. I feel that just reading this thread or a few others and trying to chelate from what people have posted is not a wise decision. Various threads and groups are intended as a support, but you have to obtain a base knowledge in order to be as safe as possible.

I truly wish I had an answer as to what is best for you to do regarding ttc or removing your amalgams. It's a gamble either way. Finding out from the hair test how many counting rules you meet (determines mercury toxicity) may be helpful as well as educating yourself on the dangers of mercury to the fetus. Cutler did say at some point that even after having amalgams removed and chelating for 1 1/2 years, the exposure to the fetus would be greater than if the amalgams had not been removed. Someone brought his quote onto this thread and I will try to go back and find it for you.
post #523 of 850
Thread Starter 
sorry double post!
post #524 of 850
I got our hair test results back. I meet no counting rules, but am still nursing, so that will affect my results. DD meets rule number #5. Her mercury level is very low (0.2). I don't know what to do. She isn't showing any symptoms of Hg tox. This is what I was worried would happen.... that the test wouldn't show anything obvious, but would meet a counting rule. Looking at her results, the mineral transport is all over the place -- it just looks funny.

My Hg level was also low (o.16). With 15 amalgams and 8crowns, wouldn't this be an awfully low number? Meaning I'm not excreting? Or worse, that I did, during pg?

I don't know what to do with my results now.
post #525 of 850
Talked with DH about it. He hasn't read the Hair Interp book, but i explained the best I could. He said what he wants to do since she is not showing symptoms is to do nothing for now and retest when she's older. I just really hate to try chelating a two year old, especially when the rule she meets is number 5. The two she "almost failed" were 3 and 4.

I wonder should I just let her self-wean and when she does, retest myself and do another test that may help me confirm it for myself? I don't see her self weaning though for at least another year, and probably longer. Can my health take that much longer? I feel like the longer I wait, the closer I am to depleting my body of nutrients and draining my adrenals to the point of getting cancer or something. My Mom got colon cancer at a fairly young age. But she will probably be our only child and I don't want to stop BFing yet.

Also, I'm not sure how I can go in for nearly $20,000 worth of dental work without some sort of confirmation. I could, but it would be a hard pill to swallow. Once she does stop nursing, are there any safer ways to get confirmation besides a challenge test? That just seems dangerous to me. Can I get results taking a much lower DMSA dose and testing urine then? Maybe the urine porphyrins test?

Editing to ask an OT question: What are the blue sayings under my username? I recognize one as Monty python, but how did it get there? Thanks!
post #526 of 850
What do you all think about having mercury amalgams removed from a 6-year-old? He has two mercury amalgams that he got at the age of three. On his urine porphyrin test, he tested borderline high for mercury. And he is having attention, behavioral, possible ASD symptoms that seem to be increasing gradually month by month. I've been thinking of getting them removed, but as I read that after a year and a half of chelation you can still be worse off than before you removed them, it seems like it would not be worth it. I'm not sure the increased exposure would be worth it when his brain is still developing, but I hate to leave them if they really might be one of the main causes of his difficulties.

OT: I too have the blue Monty Python lines. What the heck is up with that?
post #527 of 850
Thread Starter 
I'll be back later to post more, but just found Jane's old post on Cutler's advice on ttc and amalgam removal :

(2-14-2007 0635)
Found these comments by Cutler on ttc and thought it was odd that he would say leaving them alone was best?

Best, don't touch the fillings now.

Second best, 18+ months detox after filling removal before trying to
get pregnant.

Worst, drill now and get pregnant within the next year.

http://onibasu.com/archives/am/112018.html
post #528 of 850
Moneca, did you see my question about amalgam removal in a 6-year-old?
post #529 of 850
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Manonash View Post
Talked with DH about it. He hasn't read the Hair Interp book, but i explained the best I could. He said what he wants to do since she is not showing symptoms is to do nothing for now and retest when she's older. I just really hate to try chelating a two year old, especially when the rule she meets is number 5. The two she "almost failed" were 3 and 4.

I wonder should I just let her self-wean and when she does, retest myself and do another test that may help me confirm it for myself? I don't see her self weaning though for at least another year, and probably longer. Can my health take that much longer? I feel like the longer I wait, the closer I am to depleting my body of nutrients and draining my adrenals to the point of getting cancer or something. My Mom got colon cancer at a fairly young age. But she will probably be our only child and I don't want to stop BFing yet.

Also, I'm not sure how I can go in for nearly $20,000 worth of dental work without some sort of confirmation. I could, but it would be a hard pill to swallow. Once she does stop nursing, are there any safer ways to get confirmation besides a challenge test? That just seems dangerous to me. Can I get results taking a much lower DMSA dose and testing urine then? Maybe the urine porphyrins test?

Editing to ask an OT question: What are the blue sayings under my username? I recognize one as Monty python, but how did it get there? Thanks!
If it were me I wouldn't chelate a child if they weren't showing any symptoms. I only went down this road because I had a child that vomited multiple times a day and wasn't gaining weight. Life was not fun in the least.

I wish I had an answer for you on whether or not to wean. Sometimes it is just weighing your health needs against continued nursing. You may just have to go with what seems more urgent.

I did use a porphyrin test on Sierra and the results were what I expected. I wish I had done one on myself before I started ALA (which can give a false negative). This is another type of confirmation that you can try before paying out thousands of dollars.
post #530 of 850
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by harmonymama View Post
What do you all think about having mercury amalgams removed from a 6-year-old? He has two mercury amalgams that he got at the age of three. On his urine porphyrin test, he tested borderline high for mercury. And he is having attention, behavioral, possible ASD symptoms that seem to be increasing gradually month by month. I've been thinking of getting them removed, but as I read that after a year and a half of chelation you can still be worse off than before you removed them, it seems like it would not be worth it. I'm not sure the increased exposure would be worth it when his brain is still developing, but I hate to leave them if they really might be one of the main causes of his difficulties.

OT: I too have the blue Monty Python lines. What the heck is up with that?
I haven't read anything at all on removing amalgams on younger children. The only thing I can tell you is that when I had my amalgams removed (7 medium to small in size) my symptomology got a bit worse about 3 months after removal. Things never got a lot worse. I didn't notice improvements after starting on DMSA. After being on ALA for about two months I began noticing several symptoms improving.

Since there are tons of parents of autistic children on the yahoo autism NCD group they might be able to answer your questions much better than I can.
post #531 of 850
Quote:
Originally Posted by moneca View Post
This thread can be very overwhelming.
Thank you so much, moneca, and everyone else for your support because I am truly freaking out about this whole mercury thing. (My symptoms almost seem worse because I'm paying so much attention to them.)

So, I just tried to order the hair elements test from Direct Labs, and after I had put in my name, address, and credit card # : I got this message:

Quote:
Due to Department of Health policies in the states of New York, New Jersey, and Rhode Island, we are unable to offer our services in these states. We are presently working on a waiver and hopefully you may again have access to our services. Please keep checking back with us.

Thank You,

Jeannie Bell
Now what do I do?
post #532 of 850
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rayo de sol View Post
Thank you so much, moneca, and everyone else for your support because I am truly freaking out about this whole mercury thing. (My symptoms almost seem worse because I'm paying so much attention to them.)

So, I just tried to order the hair elements test from Direct Labs, and after I had put in my name, address, and credit card # : I got this message:



Now what do I do?
I had that problem too when I lived in NY. Do you have a close friend in a different state who could help you? You could order the test in their name to their address and then they would have to mail you the kit. You could put your sample in and mail it in from your location. They could then send you the results they receive in their name.
This is the only way I could think for you to get around this.
post #533 of 850
Quote:
DD meets rule number #5. Her mercury level is very low (0.2). I don't know what to do. She isn't showing any symptoms of Hg tox. This is what I was worried would happen.... that the test wouldn't show anything obvious, but would meet a counting rule. Looking at her results, the mineral transport is all over the place -- it just looks funny.
I am chelating a child with no symptoms, at least no real symptoms. My daughter. And although I haven't done the hair test for her, I doubt she is mercury toxic (based on symptoms, I'm sure my son is). I have several reasons, and since we haven't done any testing, it's only based on what I'm seeing in my own health and in what I feel about the kids' health, so it's completely subjective.

I can look at my health and see so many mistakes I have made and so much stuff that's messed up. I think I have been storing toxins for years--the last few days, I've been smelling like cigarette smoke again (I did back when I was drinking lemon juice in the morning as well), and I've never smoked and very, very rarely went smoky places--my parents smoked, but my dad stopped when I was 14 and my mom moved all her smoking outside. And I smell like cigarette smoke---my husband even noticed it a few days ago, it was so strong.

I strongly feel that I "shared" a ton of junk with my daughter, and I don't feel at all confident that she can, on her own, keep up with normal, daily detoxification and chip away at all that. I am doing better on the quality of food we eat and the chemicals in our environment, but I just don't think I can do good enough with that so that she can make real progress with the metals and weird chemicals she got from me. I fully believe other people are making this work--I think firefaery is doing something along these lines, and it sounds successful, but I don't think I can.

For my daughter, I think there may also be a subtle behavioral component. I think there is a thin layer of emotionalism/drama that is not her--not that she is overly sensitive/emotional compared to typical kids, it's too subtle for that, but I think there's something there that's not quite _her_. That's just a gut call on my part, and I'm not sure anyone but me will see it even if I'm right.

As for meeting the counting rules--I think meeting even one shows messed up mineral transport, and that makes sense with low mercury--having high mercury and meeting a counting rule would be strange, it seems. For my son, I don't know if he could heal on his own--mercury messes up how the body uses minerals, which are needed for growth and healing--even without much new mercury (it's there in daily life, I am hoping at very low levels), I don't know if his body could get rid of enough to heal itself. I guess, again, it comes down to confidence. I don't have confidence that he could get enough mercury out on his own to allow his body to normalize itself, mineral-wise.

I know you said that you didn't fail any of the counting rules, but you were close and nursing, and your daughter did fail. Unless you can identify an environmental source (or sources) that would introduce the mercury, then I think the logical conclusion is that she got it from you--and you shouldn't have that much unless your body is storing it instead of excreting it.

I have to assume that I had years between when my fillings were put in, in my early teens or pre-teens (I don’t remember exactly how old I was) and age 30 when my health went so abruptly downhill. I feel like it was a ticking time bomb all those years—I don’t know when I tipped over from mercury exposure to mercury toxicity, but I have to assume it took years to build up enough that my body couldn’t compensate anymore. This is also a significant reason for me to put in all the effort I am with the kids.

My guess, knowing that I am at the beginning of this and don't have much experience yet, is that it's easier to chelate a kid with few symptoms than with lots. For us, we aren't going into this with gut damage or lots of scary and difficult behaviors. Yes, I expect my son to have some symptoms when I chelate him, but head-banging and the like are pretty mild, all things considered. Moving the mercury out will definitely be a stress on their bodies, but we’re starting from a much better baseline than many, so it seems like it has to be easier (and every night, I ask God to let me be right about this). I know there's a lot I don't know, and there will definitely be surprises along the way, but I feel I have to do this to help get the kids to where they should be--I think I started them behind the 8-ball, health-wise.

On another topic--I got the rest of my fillings out yesterday. But today I smell like smoke again--it's so weird. But it was sort of neat—I think Dr. Sefcik (my dentist in Austin) really felt good about taking my amalgams out. I think it was a high point in her day, and it was just such a great day—even sitting in that chair for two and a half hours with my mouth being poked, prodded and stretched. Best day I’ve had in years, and I think it felt good for Dr. Sefcik and Connie to be the ones to make it so.

Anyway, I don’t mean to be negative or make things more difficult. This is where I’m coming from, for my family, but everyone really does have different situations and will come up with different solutions.
post #534 of 850
Thread Starter 
I wanted to share the cheapest price I've found for NCD if you order a 3 or 4 pack :

http://healthemagic.com/zeolite.html
post #535 of 850
Harmonymama-There's also a mercury autism yahoo group that may be helpful. My son is still on just the basic vitamins/minerals that seem sort of standard for supporting detox, and just this week I realized that, sometime between Aug07 and this week, he's stopped banging his head when we get gluten. He did it in August, and it was a really small amount, some hummus that was made in a small shop where they also bake bread. But this week (yes, I am embarrassed to share this) he ate some of our dog's food, a couple times since I'm not sure how often he snuck some before I figured it out, and nothing, no reaction. The point I was round-about making is that you may have good results just with vitamin/mineral supps and be able to wait for those teeth to fall out on their own (though I have no idea when that happens).
post #536 of 850
Hey, if anyone's still reading this thread, I am confused and could use some thoughts/advice/input. I just sent my daughter's hair off for the Hair Elements Test from DDI--I was really just interested in the toxic stuff, to see if something like lead might be there, because the plan, to date, has just been ALA. But I was curious what the essential elements would say, but didn't think much of it.

She fails 2 counting rules (of the 5 rules in Cutler's HTI book). She has 5 in the elements in the red (>=4 is a rule) and 11 in the white&green (combined) middle area (<=11 is a rule).

She's 4.5yo now, and has been on vit/min supps for almost a year now (and just a few months ago I saw subtle, but very noticeable to me, behavior improvements).

Part of me is wondering if this is still some legacy from me--getting too much toxic stuff and not enough minerals to deal with it--but maybe it doesn't matter? With so little in the way of good reserves (appropriate vit/min levels from me, I mean, to start with) the toxic stuff was too much? Because she's a fairly normal, bright 4-year old. The subtle behavior stuff I see doesn't stretch outside the bounds of normal.

I'm just
post #537 of 850
Does anyone know anything about Boyd Haley's new Oxidative Stress Relief? I got diagnosed last week and my doctor is encouraging me to try this. It's supposed to bind from the CNS and remove it without a risk of dropping it. Dosing is once a day. I know it's controversial and if it does what it says it does, it will be a miracle.
post #538 of 850
Tanya, I'm not sure what you're asking. Is it something like, "why does DD not exhibit symptoms when she meets two counting rules?" ? If so, here are my thoughts:

* It can take a while for symptoms to manifest, and at this point maybe she only has risk factors for future health problems as opposed to overt symptoms today.
* Maybe she does have some of the more 'subjective' symptoms (like brain fog, memory issues, etc.) but can't really articulate them at her young age.
* Supplementing for nearly a year is surely helping her, and it may be enough for her to keep symptoms at bay for now.

Bottom line, meeting even one counting rule indicates there is less than 1 chance in 40 that it's random, and you already know mercury is a problem for you personally.

I would just be thrilled that she's not exhibiting blatant symptoms and continue chelating with ALA Cutler style. With your loving treatment, she may never have to experience any of the health issues that you have. what a blessing! :
post #539 of 850
Duckmom, that is exactly what my question was. I guess I was too confused to ask a coherent question.

And I'm glad that those are plausible answers--they were swimming around in my head, but not very organized. And yes, as a practical matter, it's not changing our approach now, and I really, really hope she never goes through what I am.

Thanks for the clarity.
post #540 of 850
Since this thread has had a bit of a revival recently, I thought I'd given an update on us.

I am at a stall right now, and it is so frustrating! I have had 5 of my 8 amalgams replaced so far. As part of this, I've had a root canal and a porcelain onlay, maxed out my insurance for the year, and have spent over $2K out of pocket. We just can't afford any more dental work until the new fiscal year starts for insurance, so I am waiting. very. impatiently. :

It has been nearly a year since DS and I had our hair tests, and we've been supplementing for about eight months now. I am so mentally ready to chelate, but nooooo....

DH has not had a hair test, but has had no direct mercury exposure for a long time now, so he has volunteered to trial chelation with ALA. I am fairly certain he is mercury toxic (he has certainly had exposure over the years and exhibits many symptoms.) It was always our plan to have him hair tested in the future, but I was focusing on DS and myself first. DH has now completed three rounds of Cutler protocol ALA at a really low dose (less than 1/8 mg/lb) and done well. He has been on supps for almost as long as we have, so he was 'primed.'

After DH completes a few more rounds, I plan to start DS. The only reason I haven't started DS already is b/c I wanted to know firsthand what to expect with chelation.

DS, nearly 2.5 now, has had gains from supplementation alone, and is/was fairly NT to begin with. I'd like to keep it that way!

Anyone else care to update?
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