Chelating mamas? - Page 38

[tanyalynn]

I'd tend to say, take more time to stop and think, and consider buying supps online, the quality is generally better and the prices lower.

I'll be back after dinner to write more.

[tanyalynn]

I'm going to throw in thoughts based on my experience and my understanding of the issue.

The short version is I think you should seriously consider whether your health issues (I'd say you have issues--I didn't have more than what you've written before I got pregnant, the demands of pregnancy really brought a lot to the surface) are related to mercury, and then decide what to do. You have a lot of warning signs that I think should be investigated thoroughly.

I know it's hard to put of TTC--I've done it for a couple years now, and I just turned 35, and my family history doesn't lean towards late-in-life babies (though I'm hoping that's part of our health issues, so I'll change that), but it's been so hard on the kids, so hard on DH to have me sick. And hard on DH to have the kids needing so many pills, it's not an insignificant chunk of money on supps for them. And it's such a weird thing to contemplate--even when I was sickest, I thought my HCP was nuts for suggesting my amalgams were involved. It's not socially acceptable, and it was WAY out of my comfort zone. That's hard. But kids really can have serious health conditions, things that throw your life upside down.

Originally Posted by Tkgrl88

Hi all..!!! New here although I have been reading this off & on for a while now..!

I am 23, and have 4 fillings, and have only had them for about 3 years. I have baby fever really badly and I honestly don't see myself being able to wait the year or 2 it would take to get my amalgams removed and then chelate. Every other aspect of my life is stable. Husband and I have been together 9 years, have a great marriage, own our own home (in Los Angeles..!) and I have a great career. Hubby and I have wanted kids since I was 18 and we have waited and waited and pushed the desire down until we got things in order. Now especially after just moving into our new house and of course it seems that everyone around me is either getting pregnant or pregnant or just had a baby. Now it's gotten to the point where EVERYONE asks me all the time when the little ones are coming - coworkers, family, friends, even my mom which was a shock to me because she wasn't the happiest person in the world about me getting married so young (she didn't want the same path for me that she took). Her blessing was just the icing on top of the cake. Everything is ready emotionally, financially, etc. just these darn amalgams..!! I NEVER have had any regrets in my life until this one - until now. If I could just go back and never have gotten those stupid fillings I could be pregnant right now, eating WAP, and refusing any vaccinations.

Since I am not mercury toxic as far as I know (or at least don't have any major health issues)

Are you sure, given what you wrote below? That's a lot of stuff that tends to cluster in people with metals issues. I mean--if you wrote about your high BP and type 2 diabetes, I wouldn't jump to metals, but what you've written is not inconsistent with the types of issues people like me have.

you might be asking yourself well how did I come to find out about this and why does it bother me so badly..? The answer to this is that my brother is autistic and I also have a few cousins we think have Aspergers and another cousin that is bipolar as well as his mom (my aunt). All on my mom's side. Then my dad has some mysterious ALS-type disease that runs in his family and is more slow-moving than actual ALS. I believe it could be related to mercury or at least some kind of heavy metals.

I know some of you might be thinking why not just get them out and wait the 18 months/chelate etc. Well the thing is that I don't even know if I am mercury toxic, I don't even have any symptoms other than some mild general tiredness, mental fogginess and things that run in my family such as being a perfectionist, mild anxiety & stress, possibly having ADHD, distracted easily, etc. Most of these things were around long before the amalgams although they have gotten worse since but of course life circumstances have changed greatly (long immigration process for my husband, buying a home, dealing with everyday stresses of finances & work and my husband working weird hours). I do have a tendency to be paranoid and sorta hyper-focus on things and be a little bit OCD.

All that bold stuff? It's not normal. I mean--it was hard for me to see that depression and anxiety weren't fairly normal and benign, and even when I became hypothyroid, that was really common in my family too and not shocking, they happen all over my family history, but that's just because both my parents are prone to this type of health problem.

Read Kenneth Bock's book. He links autism, adhd, allergies and asthma as different manifestations of the same underlying problems.

My kids started out with a lot of metals and weird crap from me. Just because your amalgams were put in only a few years ago, that doesn't mean that everything was ok before--and in fact, if these mood issues were present beforehand, then something was wrong already. I had some symptoms that were present since as early as I can remember, I got metals from my mom.

I am only 23 but have accomplished ALOT and most of my life has been projects. First my wedding, then my husband's immigration process, then buying a house. I was so looking forward to having a baby because it was going to be a FUN time of my life - maybe a project but a fun and relaxing and EASY one. Then I started to learn about the amalgams and since then have been extremely discouraged and feel like it's some sort of death sentence almost. But I don't want to make the next year or so of my life about chelation, detox, etc. if they don't HAVE to be, dykwim..? I don't want to suck all of the joy out of starting a family when so many people just spontaneously get pregnant even with fillings and their children are fine and fully healthy. What if I worry and worry and detox and chelate and stress myself out and in the end it was all unnecessary + the stress harms my baby..? When I focus on something I have to put all of my energy into it and then it takes over and consumes my life. But then again what if I don't do anything and it was necessary..? What if I chose to listen to the other experts besides Cutler who say that conceiving a few months after amalgam removal is OK and my child is harmed..? What if I chose to listen to Cutler and waste 2 or so years of my life when I didn't have to..? What if I leave them in altogether and my child is ASD and it affects me as well later on down the road..?

Previously I was leaning towards getting them out and then TTC a month or so later but after finally getting my finances sorted out so that I have the funds for the removal, I have been online for 5-6 hours straight reading up again after a month or so hiatus from thinking about this crap.. and I have come to realize that the general consensus out there on this idea is that it is way too risky and dangerous.

So now I am leaning towards just leaving them in - eating WAP, refusing vaccinations, having a natural birth (which I wanted anyway), eliminating other toxins such as household cleaners, taking vitamins & supplements and then possibly having them removed and chelating after our first baby when we have more time.

And you'll chelate your child as well? If you need to chelate, I'd say your child needs it too, likely more than you do. They only get what we have to give--if it's too little zinc and magnesium and vitamin A and folate, then that's what they get, and if it's too much mercury and arsenic and weird environmental chemicals, then that's what they get.

Why would you have more time after your first baby? My son (2nd child) will be 5 before I'm healthy enough to consider TTC. That's not the gap we planned. It's hard, so hard to be sick and care for kids as well. Pregnancy and nursing is incredibly nutritionally draining--I think that's true for everyone, I see it all around me, but the effects are magnified for people with pre-existing health conditions. I felt normal before I got pregnant with DD, I never dreamed I had serious health problems brewing. I don't know why my health fell apart before it was obvious something was wrong with the kids, but it seems to be atypical, based on all the people I've written with.

But really--being sick and tired, and having to learn all this and try to mitigate the damage to your child, it makes life hard. It's hard on a marriage.

I am hoping that since I am so young, have so few fillings, and have had them in for such a short time + my husband's genes (and he is hispanic which I have read have a lower rate of autism)

General trends don't mean much, compared to his specific family history. DH is Hispanic and has rocking detox genes, they saved our daughter from EI and all sorts of heartache. But MTHFR gene variants occur in the Hispanic population, just saw an interesting study about it--early strokes are not uncommon in the Hispanic population--and then there's the diagnostic issue. With the socio-economic differences, I'm not sure that diagnosis is equal across all racial and ethnic lines in the US, so I'd take general trends with a big grain of salt.

+ the fact that maybe I am worrying about nothing in the first place since I don't have any obvious or extreme affects from my fillings = a healthy baby..??

Originally Posted by WuWei

How long have you been eating WAP? How much food folate do you consume a day? Magnesium, Vit C, selenium, B6, methyl-B12, zinc, molybdentum, sulfate, fermented vegetables, whole food probiotics, pastured poultry, 100% grass-fed beef, HVBO, fCLO, soaked grains, etc.?

If you've been doing all of that for at least a couple of years. I'd say you've probably chelated a lot of the mercury already.

With lots of respect for Pat, who knows a lot about nutritious food, I disagree with this statement. I don't see anything in the list above that chelates--meaning, draws metals from tissues. Our bodies are supposed to get sufficient nutrients every day, just to maintain current good functioning, which is hard enough with all the chemicals in our home environments and work environments and foods. Doing that, PLUS dealing with a heavy load of built-up toxins is IMO too much to ask without supplementation.

With your family history, I'd worry, however about impaired detoxification genes, specifically the MTHFR gene. It is easy enough to have that tested to see where you stand. Also, there are hair tests for heavy metals. Let me find the thread about testing for mineral status preconception. Preconception care: Mineral Deficiency Test



Pat

Originally Posted by Tkgrl88

I haven't been following any specific diet plan yet.. it's all super confusing and overwhelming to me... and it all tends to contradict itself..

I plan on going to the health food store tonight to pick some things up and get started... what should I look for..? Should I get raw milk or organic milk..? What kinds of supplements & vitamins should I be getting if I leave my amalgams in..? Are they different ones than if I am taking them out..? I read all of those links but that just led to me having about 10 different windows open and googling everything and getting super confused... =*(

I'd slow down, order a hair test. They're not set in stone perfect, nothing is, but they're very low risk, not terribly expensive--$85 or so--and give good insight into things. If you want a general multivit, I'd go with Thorne Basic Nutrients, get one bottle w/o copper and iron, and then from the hair results, consider if copper may be ok for you (most people with mercury issues should not supplement copper). If you have a doc, you can ask for bloodwork (before you start the supp) for folate, B12, cholesterol panel with homocysteine (not sure if that's checked automatically at the same time as cholesterol).

Thorne has real folate (5-mthf). Look at your family history wrt MTHFR.

http://www.detoxpuzzle.com/mthfr.php

It's not my issue, but it is for some people. Within the last page, I mentioned things to consider for someone else, including MTHFR.

You have risk factors that merit looking into. Not everyone has this issue, my DH is an excellent example--and he's really rundown, he has lots of fatigue and only so-so digestion and various things due to the stress of the past few years, plus evil gluten (evil for him, fairly evil for me too) -- but he does not have detoxification issues.

[WuWei]

I've sent a mama here from Alternative Kids Teeth. She had an amalgam removed while nursing and has severe headaches.

Suggestions?

I've suggested No kombucha! !!! !!

Vit C, large doses, 2-4 grams several times throughout the day. Selenium, max 400mg in divided doses through out the day. Consider Zeolite, Modifilan, Bentonite Clay.

And to post to this thread.


Thanks!

Pat

[tanyalynn]

Modifilan was what I used for my headache. vitC helps the kids after rounds of ALA--mercury chelator, so extra mercury was circulating. Clay may help, I don't have experience there. May be easier to get activated charcoal. It'll sop up any supplements you take anywhere near the same time, but people use it for metals as well. I haven't tried it, and for long-term use it may not be great, since it absorbs minerals in general, but for acute stuff, may be worthwhile.

Vit C need may be really high, when I was first starting, I was taking 44 grams per day, and I've at times needed more (when chelating). Just be open to going up. I use sodium ascorbate, it's easier on the stomach.

I'd avoid the zeolite.

And long-term, consider if this is important to one's overall health situation. Most people don't get nasty, nasty headaches after amalgams are placed or removed. I think my kids' mineral status was quite impaired by my problem with my amalgams, and that can lead to dental issues.

Oh, and Pat meant to write 400 mcg (micrograms) rather than milligrams. Cause she doesn't want to kill you.

[WuWei]

Thanks, I'll post to her.

OMG, I always write mg for selenium. Hope I haven't killed anyone.


Pat

[Tkgrl88]

Does one look for high levels or low levels on a hair test..? How long do the results take to get back and how can I intrepret them..?

Hmm I didn't know that about copper.. what does the copper do..?

Oh and also does anyone know if it is safe to take selenium while the mercury is still in..?? I know that it's good for after they are out..

[tanyalynn]

Originally Posted by Tkgrl88

Does one look for high levels or low levels on a hair test..? How long do the results take to get back and how can I intrepret them..?

Look at page 30 of this thread, 2nd post down, it describes ordering the correct hair test. Results in less than 2 weeks after you send it off, make sure to send the release so you can get results online.

It's not a straightforward interpretation, but that's discussed on page 30--my hair test, before DD was born but before I knew what to look for, had levels of mercury too low to detect. Wasn't circulating or being excreted, I was just storing it away.

Hmm I didn't know that about copper.. what does the copper do..?

Oh and also does anyone know if it is safe to take selenium while the mercury is still in..?? I know that it's good for after they are out..

Copper and zinc are antagonistic. Zinc's critical for some of the detox stuff to get mercury and other metals out, and when you add in it being low in peoples' diets in general, well, people with heavy metal issues are usually really low. So you don't want to consume more copper than you need to, you want to maximize zinc absorption. Excess copper is also a possibility, it's an essential nutrient but in excess (and the difference between "necessary" and "toxic" isn't huge) it can cause problems on its own, and those problems are very similar to what mercury can do. But it's easier to treat for, if it is elevated.

Selenium's an important mineral, it's a trace mineral, you don't want to overdo it, but it's vital for good health. If you're low now, address it now, IMO.

[linguistmama]

We sent our hair tests on a Saturday last month and got them back the following Thursday online so pretty quick. I kept checking every day in my online account since I never got an email saying they were ready. The paper copy came in the mail about 2 weeks later.

[Tkgrl88]

So I went to Whole Foods & Wal-Mart tonight and hubby & I got a juicer, tons of fresh fruits and veggies and a few other things....

I had read on one of those fertility links about the superfoods so I got 2 of them but now I am wondering I jumped the gun too much or if it is even a smart idea to take those things with amalgams in. I got the royal jelly and the maca powder for hubby & me. The energy boosts from maca sound promising as well. However I don't know if either of these have a negative affect on mercury. If it turns out they do I'll just have hubby take the maca and I'll give away the royal jelly..

I also got (separate) little bottles of zinc & selenium.. Do you think it's safe to go ahead and take those tonight with my pre-natal..? It sounds like it is but I just want to be 100% sure.. Thanks.. !! I checked and my pre-natal has no copper.

We also got another cast-iron pan to replace our last non-stick pan, some regular light bulbs to replace the few CFL bulbs we have around here, and glass food storage containers to throw out the plastic tupperware we were using.. Going to throw away the last of the 409 as well - we have been using vinegar for a while.

Thank god my hubby is so receptive to pretty much everything and doesn't just write it off as some crazy conspiracy theory.. though he balks a little bit at the pans because they are more of a hassle he has gotten into his cast-iron pan for his daily grilled chicken.. and whenever I tell him about a new thing he doesn't even seem surprised anymore haha.. just like "how is this legal..?" I told him today about the mercury in the lightbulbs and he spent 5 minutes in the aisle checking all of the lightbulbs to make SURE it had none in it.. :

[Tkgrl88]

I am still struggling with my decision to TTC or wait. I won't be doing chelation at this point - maybe later on in my life - but I can wait up to 1 year after amalgam removal if it will help .. is this enough time to wait if not chelating..?

Is it a possibility that if my levels are normal I wouldn't need to get the amalgams removed just yet/postpone TTC..?

If so, where is the best place to get a hair test from are they all trustworthy..? And do you have to go to a lab or do you just send a hair sample in the mail..?

[Toolip]

From what I understand, you want to order Direct Lab Services, the test is the Hair Elements test (NOT the Toxic Hair Exposure Profile).

[tanyalynn]

Originally Posted by Tkgrl88

I am still struggling with my decision to TTC or wait. I won't be doing chelation at this point - maybe later on in my life - but I can wait up to 1 year after amalgam removal if it will help .. is this enough time to wait if not chelating..?

Best guess, and it is a guess since this is a tricky topic, is that about a year after you remove all your amalgams, your circulating metal levels will be about the same as before you got your amalgams out (they would've been higher in the interim). So your child wouldn't get EXTRA mercury at that point, but if you have a high bioburden due to accumulating for decades, that will still be passed on.

Is it a possibility that if my levels are normal I wouldn't need to get the amalgams removed just yet/postpone TTC..?

There's a vast gulf between people who accumulate mercury and get sick, and those who don't. You were right above--many people have amalgams and get pregnant and their kids are healthy and do not have high levels of metals and weird chemicals.

But then there are those like me who do, and our kids do. The biggest thing you need to figure out now is which camp you fall into, and then your choices will become clearer.

If so, where is the best place to get a hair test from are they all trustworthy..? And do you have to go to a lab or do you just send a hair sample in the mail..?

Did you go to page 30 of this thread, like I mentioned above? The 2nd post down describes the company to order from and the exact name of the test. It's written out clearly.

[kasey11]

Hi chelating mamas,

I want to start out first by saying a big thanks to all you ladies for posting your experiences and sharing your info. Right now I'm a bit overwhelmed with reading posts after posts and am starting to get mixed up (doesn't
help with my brain fog). So I'm hoping someone can help me sort it out.

I have scheduled in May an amalgam removal due to a deep cavity beneath it - advised by an IAOMT dentist. I'm currently breastfeeding my 10month old DS and also have a mouthful of amalgams and other smaller cavities that I'm holding off until weaning.

What supplements and minerals should I be taking leading up to the removal and immediately after the removal? I've read about loading up on vit c, selenium, flax oil, zinc, vit A, vit E in several posting but I'm very confused about dosages.

Also, should I dump and pump for 1 week and use formula. My DS comfort feeds and we've never bottlefed before.

I did seek a naturopath but she recommended cilantro and chlorella which I read was a big no-no during breastfeeding. She also suggested arame/wakame/nori. Is eating seaweed a safe recommendation?

Thanks!

[tanyalynn]

Originally Posted by kasey11

Hi chelating mamas,

I want to start out first by saying a big thanks to all you ladies for posting your experiences and sharing your info. Right now I'm a bit overwhelmed with reading posts after posts and am starting to get mixed up (doesn't
help with my brain fog). So I'm hoping someone can help me sort it out.

Why do you have brain fog? That seems like a big factor in determining the risks to your LO.

I have scheduled in May an amalgam removal due to a deep cavity beneath it - advised by an IAOMT dentist. I'm currently breastfeeding my 10month old DS and also have a mouthful of amalgams and other smaller cavities that I'm holding off until weaning.

Before you do much else, please check out the Curing Cavities with Nutrition sticky at the top of this forum. It's not a guarantee, but quite a few people have been able to heal cavities. For people with chronic health issues (and I'm more familiar with metals issues than other causes) I'd say supplementation should definitely play a part, in addition to good diet (not the usual definition of "good diet" -- this is a med-high/high fat diet).

What supplements and minerals should I be taking leading up to the removal and immediately after the removal? I've read about loading up on vit c, selenium, flax oil, zinc, vit A, vit E in several posting but I'm very confused about dosages.

No vitC the morning of the dental work, your anesthesia will wear off too quick, other than that, vitC dosage is very individual, I needed huge gobs, most people need less.

Whenever you do dental work, get a good multivit, I'd say Thorne Basic Nutrients, has real folate, and maybe one of the Thorne multi-minerals as well (biomins, citramins, maybe there's one other), sold lots of places online. I'd use fish oil instead of flax oil, say a good cod liver oil, or just a fish oil, instead of flax. Extra magnesium, the amount is variable, in general, keep cal and mag in a 2:1 or 1:2 range (where in there is individual, 1:1 is a decent starting point).

Also, should I dump and pump for 1 week and use formula. My DS comfort feeds and we've never bottlefed before.

IMO, no one should nurse their child right after they have amalgams placed or removed. The degree of risk depends on your health--our kids can't start out healthier than we are. The fact that you have brain fog doesn't speak well to your health (I've BTDT, not knocking you at all, brain fog was a big warning sign for me!) and IME, kids can have a lot more going on than meets the eye. Mine did.

This can have serious implications. I mean--my kids are in the typical range, not delayed, no diagnoses, and even with them, I've seen cognitive and developmental jumps or lags based on how they are doing with their metals. Sucks to see that with your kid, even when it doesn't cross over into the delayed category. It's hard to make these decisions when you can't think clearly. BTDT, no fun!

I don't know how long you wouldn't want to nurse--I'm not sure anyone knows. Best guess, at least 3 days? Search this thread (Thread Tools should have a Search function) for the mentions I've made of vitamin C flushes, and the online Perque document. That has helped reduced circulating metals in me, I did it the night (or the night after, hard to remember now) I got my amalgams out. It's not perfect, but it should help. I used modifilan to stop the headache I got after I got my amalgams out (iaomt protocol dentist). Those are safe while breastfeeding, I did them regularly to my benefit and I think my son's benefit as well, before I got my amalgams out and after (I weaned my son to get my amalgams out--hard decision).

I did seek a naturopath but she recommended cilantro and chlorella which I read was a big no-no during breastfeeding. She also suggested arame/wakame/nori. Is eating seaweed a safe recommendation?

Thanks!

I've read different things about seaweeds in general (issues with bromide, so the iodine/iodide doesn't help that much), some folks don't do well with iodine supplementation, and for some people, it seems to mobilize metals. It's not the thing I'd recommend; at this point, I take an iodine/iodide supp, but I wouldn't consider it helpful for immediately after amalgam removal.

Best things for helping with circulating metals: multi with folate (Thorne Basic Nutrients is an easy one to find, good quality), multi-mineral (Thorne's good, affordable), sublingual B-12 (hydroxycobalamin or methylcobalamin, not cyanocobalamin), the multi should have reasonable amounts of selenium. I don't supp vitE beyond my multivit.

Bowel tolerance vitC 3x/day (not until after the dental work on that day, but good to start now regardless), very helpful for me and my kids. I use sodium ascorbate, Now foods brand (Bronson is also good, Nutribiotics is good, both are more expensive and cost is a factor for me).

Chlorella and cilantro, IMO, are a bad idea regardless of whether or not you're breastfeeding. Cilantro seems to mobilize mercury from our brains--nasty mood issues can result, sometimes the onset is slow, but it could be fast, individual variation.

[tanyalynn]

I just realized that what I wrote above, from a breastfeeding standpoint, is probably confusing.

The basics: even with a good amalgam removal protocol, mom has a spike in circulating mercury--I hear it's a whole lot less with a good removal protocol, but it's non-zero. After that, to the best of my understanding, there are two separate risks.

The first risk is the immediate, short-term exposure to mercury directly due to the removal. I am not sure how long it takes for a single mercury exposure to mostly either be excreted or to settle into tissues (where it's not great for mom, but not a big issue for a nurseling). That's where the 3 days, one week type of estimates come in, but as far as I know, there's not a lot of solid data on this.

The second risk is due to a fundamental shift occurring in the body. Cutler discusses the phenomenon of, once ALL of a person's amalgams are removed, a balance shifts in their bodies, and their bodies may spontaneously start mobilize metals (and other toxins? not sure about that, but a lot of environmental chemicals are excreted with glutathione or methylation, and we store that stuff when our bodies are overloaded with metals) after their amalgams are all removed. In mercury toxic people, symptoms get better for a while, and then worse, and I know I saw strange changes in myself within several days of the removal of the last of my amalgams--I didn't get sicker, I felt good, but I saw strange symptoms. Those changes were obvious for at least a month, with no change in my supplements.

And then risks need to be weighed based on mom's health (and by extension, baby's health). My kids would've been more at risk than some other kids. They already had more mercury and other metals and enviro chemicals accumulated than they could handle, they had (subtle) health and behavioral symptoms already. Given how fast development is in infancy and early childhood, how the brain is still making new connections, it's really a time to be careful. I seem to be atypical, in that I, as the adult, appeared sicker than my kids. I still don't know why, but I'd really advocate caution.

[kasey11]

Thank you Tanyalynn for spending the time in answering my questions.

I'll try to describe what I feel is my brain fog. It feels as though things are just not as clear as they used to be. I think it started several years ago and I had always attributed it to getting older. This past year with the lack of consistent sleep while on mat leave it seems to have worsen a bit. There are times when I try to speak and I will either get the words mixed up or grasp for the correct word to use. So, I'm not sure if it's from my amalgams or age/sleep deprivation.

The only other major health issues I have are migraines (usually from change in weather pressure) and seasonal allergies. Hopefully this means I'm a good excreter, considering I have 9 amalgams.

When I get a chance I'll read through the Curing Cavities with Nutrition sticky. Both dentists I visited described my cavity as being very close to the nerve with a possibility of a root canal. Which is probably why I feel pain on the lower right when chewing. I'm not sure I have much of a choice in postponing this. Ideally I would prefer to hold it off for 6 more months but I'm concerned with what can happen if I leave it alone too long especially in the state that it's in. Do you know of any other mamas who've held off dental work which may have led to a serious infection?

I just ordered online 2 bottles of modifilan. How many capsules of the modifilan do you think I should take daily?

The other shallower cavities and remaining amalgams will be dealt with later. And then after the complete amalgam removal, chelating myself and possibly my DS.

This is the start of a long journey for me. I'm so grateful for mamas like yourself who are kind enough to help those of us in need and just starting out.

Thanks!

[linguistmama]

What are the pros and cons of me taking ALA with DMSA vs just ALA? I've never had amalgams and think my exposure is decades old. I'm trying to pair down the budget and just wondering if I really even need DMSA.

[Mommymama]

Originally Posted by linguistmama

What are the pros and cons of me taking ALA with DMSA vs just ALA? I've never had amalgams and think my exposure is decades old. I'm trying to pair down the budget and just wondering if I really even need DMSA.

I believe ALA alone is a possibility but only after you remove the mercury body burden with DMSA, since ALA will go into the brain to chelate mercury and DMSA won't cross the blood-brain barrier. I'm doing FDC ALA only on my child who practices sports and the sweating will remove part of the mercury body burden.

[tanyalynn]

Originally Posted by linguistmama

What are the pros and cons of me taking ALA with DMSA vs just ALA? I've never had amalgams and think my exposure is decades old. I'm trying to pair down the budget and just wondering if I really even need DMSA.

There are a few ways to go about this, ultimately it'll depend on how your body does with these, your risk tolerance, and what other supportive stuff you can do--and how your body responds to that.

As the PP said, DMSA won't go into your brain, so the risk of mood issues may be less, overall people seem to find the same dosage of DMSA to have fewer bad effects than that of ALA.

That said, I used DMSA after I got my amalgams out, added in ALA for a while (so I was using both together) and eventually I dropped it and didn't notice any downside. Not sure how much sooner I could've stopped using it.

1. You could get a smaller amount of DMSA to have on-hand just in case you feel like you need a few rounds--I've gone back to DMSA occasionally for my kids, ALA is harder on their digestion and the ALA does seem to get more metals mobilized.

2. As an adult, one thing I can do that clearly the kids can't is these vitamin C flushes....
http://www.perque.com/pdfs/Pt_Ascorbate_Slush_FIN.pdf

I use 50% Perque's vitC crystals (which aren't cheap) and 50% Now foods brand sodium ascorbate. And since it's not an everyday thing, it's works out to be pretty affordable.

I think this has helped really reduce the metals that are left circulating after stopping a round--it's helped me with mood issues, I think it's prevented that build-up problem that seems to happen sometimes. Where a person is chelating at one dose, but after 3 or 4 rounds at that dose, they notice _more_ symptoms and either stop or drop down in dosage. I've always had symptoms stay the same or get better from round to round (barring illness or some external factor like that).

3. Also, every day, 3x/day, taking vitC to bowel tolerance helps provide another route for your body to use to get rid of circulating metals. The amount I needed jumped when I started chelating, even now it's higher, but trying to find and take the right dose when I was chelating helped in 2 ways. First, I think it helped with the metals that the DMSA or ALA was dropping, helped to reduce the side effects, and second, it was a data point to decide if my dose of ALA was too high, or just right. It takes practice to get a feel for how your body does (I wrote stuff down in a notebook, my memory was pathetic--that helps to avoid missing doses of ALA too) and I could see that, over time, a particular dose of ALA required less and less extra vitC.

Does that last part make sense? Here's an example of how this worked for me: say every day, I needed 15 grams of vitC (5+5+5, so it's in 3 doses), when I wasn't chelating--just a normal day. I start a round of ALA and that number jumps to 75 grams (25+25+25, or just take a smaller amount 7-8x/day at the same time as each dose of ALA, I've done it both ways). That means that that dosage of ALA made my body want an extra 60 grams of vitC per day. When I stopped the round of ALA, I'd want to see (within just a couple days) that number go back to 15 grams. If it's more than 15, then I'd know I was left with extra metals circulating after the round.

Those vitC flushes? They _really_ helped with this, I did them 1.5 days after my last dose of either DMSA or ALA. Do them on a fairly empty stomach (no food for 6 hours, roughly--YMMV, you may want to play around with that). I skipped once, and the mood issues weren't fun. I did them before I got my amalgams out, they reduced circulating toxins then too, and I think made starting chelation easier. Read the doc all the way through.

4. Consider modifilan as well, for us, it works very well to sop up extra circulating metals. The vitC flush is cheaper, but if you ever get an acute headache/body ache type of reaction, this can be nice to have around. It works fast for acute issues (headache after I got my amalgams out, for example). I give 4/day to my kids now, 2 on an empty stomach first thing in the morning, 1 mid-afternoon, 1 at bedtime, but because of the price, I don't take it every day myself.

Anyway, I guess the point is, I think there are ways to reduce some of the stresses of the metals that ALA mobilizes, but it will depend on what you try, what you tolerate, and how your body responds to the ALA.

[tanyalynn]

kasey, I'll be back later in the day. Your situation is trickier than linguistmama's, need more time to write.