Cloth & EC - happy together

[ShannonCC]

I was going to respond on the other thread but thought I'd put up a new one instead.

I'm sorry to see some moms are not happy about the EC threads. I guess I can only speak for myself when I say that I hope none of my long, overly enthusiastic posts have insulted any cloth moms. That was not my intention at all (and I'm 100% positive the other ECers would say the same!).

We're just so excited about EC. It's so fun, it's neat, it's something we want to share with the world and get other moms to convert! I know a lot of CD moms feel the exact same way about cloth! And sometimes it's hard to talk about the benefits of cloth without saying something about the downside of disposables. Just do a search on disposables or sposies and you'll see lots of comments about odors, cancer, sterility, the environment, etc. And yet no one is trying to attack disposable using moms. They're just enthusiastic moms trying to promote cloth.

It's the same way with EC. We don't want to offend anyone, we just want everyone to know how wonderful we think EC is!

And do keep in mind most EC moms are also CD moms I think I've met a handful who use sposies, but most of the rest either use (or at one time used) cloth backup. Just ask me about my stunning Liz Cloth dipes I got this week

I am very thankful there is an EC community here and I hope that never changes. It's because of MDC that I am ECing with my son. It's because of CD moms on Momsonline that I switched from sposies to cloth with my dd in the first place!

Keep sharing your passion, whatever that may be. Just remember, we can't enjoy our differences if we hide them!

[Clarity]

We've had EC threads forever, no issues. EC is great, more people should know about it. I don't really have the knack for it, but sis is doing great with it this week...and she didn't even know what EC was!

We've just had a few anti-diapering more than pro-EC in tone to a few things. I meant, for the most part, here in diapering (at least with the hyenas), you're preaching to the choir. Even if we don't EC, we know about it, and we think it's cool. I think the EC threads are fantastic. We just have a few newer posters about it...and like the recently converted, they can be a little heavy-handed. But I appreciate the patience when we have visiting diapering moms who ask "what's EC", "why would you do that" like every other day...

[HeatherSanders]

I'm new to EC . . . 2 weeks new. I'm very excited simply because it is amazing to me that it actually works. If I have come across 'heavy-handed,' it certainly has never been my intent.

I express my joys in cheerleader fashion . . . from fuzbabies to my Punkin-Butt Wooly Wonder from Pamela . . . to my baby's bum!

I do think the two are not separate entities in and of themselves. Okay, this week I have been singing songs in my head and the title of this thread has me singing . . .

. . . so happy together!

[BowenTherapist]

hmmmm

hmmm, i think that i might have been one of the offending posters...
there was one post i replyed to and i wasn't in a very tactful mood that day. Sorry about that, but it really does gross me out to let a baby knowingly sit in their own waste and i am entitled to my opinion.
like i said sorry bout that and great point Shannon

[Monda]

but it really does gross me out to let a baby knowingly sit in their own waste and i am entitled to my opinion.

You certainly are entitled to your opinion. I just hope you don't express it at the expence of others. I have not read any threads that have offended me...(but I don't really read the EC threads) What I love about this board is that the enthusiasim leads people to educate themselves about what is best for their kiddo. However, if we alienate them by being, condecending or outright rude...we may turn them off rather than letting them "catch the fire".

I know I have said some negative things about sposies...I will remember to watch how I word those things from now on, that way...if a sposie using Mom is reading, I am sure not to alienate her, but instead, to get her interested and hopfully pass on the cloth bug to her!

[JesseMomme]

Oh- I thought the Cd'ers and the EC'ers were getting along pretty harmoniously here, but point taken

[Clarity]

yeah, well, we were : Hopefully everyone will be back to normal soon.

[USAmma]

When we EC'd it made me disgusted too, about babies sitting in their own waste. But as I have learned over and over, the minute I judge, I am taught a lesson. My baby stopped EC at 12 mos. and now she's back in diapers full time at 26 mos. I used to think parents were lazy for not potty training their children earlier than most train these days. I was disgusted with the thought of a 3 or 4 year old in diapers. Until my little stong willed toddler taught me yet another lesson on this topic. At least she's in cloth, not sposies.

But no, I was not offended in the least. It just seems so obvious to an ECer that ECing is the least messy thing to do, but it also takes a LOT of time. My dd would pee like 2x an hour so I had to drop things all day long to take her. Still better than wiping poop off her bum but it does take a certain amount of dedication that many here don't have time or energy for.

Sorry I'm rambling, I'll quit now. ;-)

Darshani

[HeatherSanders]

Originally posted by USAmma
My dd would pee like 2x an hour so I had to drop things all day long to take her. Darshani

Okay, I got curious about this and sort of kept track today with how many times we 'pee' or 'poop' Kenny. Well, he gets to smackin' on me about every 2 hours. He pees 2x within 30 minutes after he eats. He poops about 3x a day, but sometimes when he farted, I ran him to his potty and he wasn't ready yet. So, I'll venture to say that we hold him on his potty a MINIMUM of once an hour, but probably closer to every 30 minutes on average.

THANK GOODNESS I didn't add that up before we started or I might have been discouraged! :LOL Then again, maybe not.

Thank you for this thread though - I do believe that the two coincide on many levels.

[ShannonCC]

Well, I am NOT judging anyone, but babies sitting in their own waste has *always* disgusted me. Not cuz I'm an ECer, but I think that's why I took to it. When I had dd in sposies I would change them as soon as I knew she peed, lol! Yes, I know a huge waste of money to throw away a faintly piddled sposie, but it grossed me out. When she got to be a toddler and fought changes I let her stay in wet dipes rather than deal with the stress and I thought it was gross (I would wrestle her over poops tho!).

I am fully expecting ds to be back in dipes someday. I know a lot of EC kids in the West (where it's not common) go on strikes. Also, we started pretty late in EC terms, so I'm not sure how much it's really working. But if he goes back in dipes, I will do my best to change him ASAP. So I'm not judging myself either, lol!

I am not phobic about pee and poop or anything. I've been peed on by my kids (the ECed one and the non ) and I've been pooped on too. I've been vomited on and spit up on. It doesn't bother me and I just wash it off (honestly, I don't even bother washing off baby pee!). But for whatever reason, the idea of sitting in it *does*. So that's just me.

I guess that's also why EC hasn't added any time to our day. I was always changing him anyway, lol!

[mrzmeg]

Whoops, I think I was one of the offending posters too. I said something a while back on a thread about CD 'hyenas' driving WAHM sales...sorry, guys, you know I love y'all

I do agree with BowenTherapist and Shannon, though. I would never let my baby sit in excrement, but I try not to judge those that do. It does bother me that it would be considered abuse to let an elderly person at a nursing home sit for hours in pee and poop, but we do it to babies all the time...but that's a discussion for another thread.

I think that moms that CD are certainly making a much better decision than DD-using moms. I usually use CDs as a back up. I do think it is important to change diapers often, but I don't think that using diapers is bad in of itself.

[Ahleemah]

Shannon rocks

.. and took the words out of my mouth.

THANK YOU! My fingers thank you....

but I'm sorry, I can't change my opinion: I think EC is what we are naturally meant to do. <---- MY opinion, thankyouverymuch

I find that even stating that as my opinion can be viewed by others as judgmental... what can I do?

BUT just like I think childbirth without drugs and breastfeeding and babywearing are all natural things that we were meant to do, I know lots of moms can't do those things either. <shrug> No worries... chacun son gout, as the French say... to each his own.

And, I think it's important for moms to have an opportunity to re-examine their practice of how long they go between changes.... the number one thing new EC moms will say is "wow, I can't believe they were actually peeing so much... I had no idea! I'm changing WAY more diapers now...." That speaks volumes to me.

Blessings!

Ahleemah - so tired of including all the disclaimers.. can't we just assume that people are not being mean but just having their own opinions!!!

[Clarity]

So if it's just us, and EC'er with their own opinions, how come things have been pretty contented until recently? What has changed? I mean, we've had ongoing EC threads in the diapering forum for a looooooong time, though it's fewer longer threads so they do sometimes get buried, Given the difficulty searching for EC (too short, have to use Elimination Communication which isn't spelled out in all threads...) some threads get missed, Perhaps we can request they be made sticky so they don't get buried. EC'ers should be here, without a doubt.

[mrzmeg]

I think the main difference is that there are a lot more EC'ers here now than there were a month or two ago. At first, it seemed like there were only five or six of us...but our numbers have really grown!

[USAmma]

EC'ers should be here, without a doubt.

I agree!!
I think it's such a neat concept, and was glad I did it with dd while it lasted. It really made me in tune with her, and I read lots of books to her on her potty so there was bonding time, and okay, I never lost the thrill of an infant using the potty. lol!

Darshani

[fullofgrace]

Originally posted by Clarity
So if it's just us, and EC'er with their own opinions, how come things have been pretty contented until recently? What has changed? I mean, we've had ongoing EC threads in the diapering forum for a looooooong time, though it's fewer longer threads so they do sometimes get buried, Given the difficulty searching for EC (too short, have to use Elimination Communication which isn't spelled out in all threads...) some threads get missed, Perhaps we can request they be made sticky so they don't get buried. EC'ers should be here, without a doubt.

For me what seems to have changed is that there are now more and more posts in the EC discussions where an unfair assumption is being made about diapering moms that we are awful and 'let our children sit in waste', etc. THAT is the change for me. I found posts about EC very interesting and informative up until that point.

Yes, I do need a super absorbant cloth diaper because my dd pees a river everytime she goes - one pee and she needs changing (and I change her LOTS!). Yes, my 3.5 yo still wears cloth diapers and is not toilet trained and likely won't be soon. WHY? She's a special needs child. But up until recent assumptions about diapering mamas, I never felt the need to put the 'disclaimer' that my child has high-functioning Autism in my posts to perhaps prevent being labeled a terrible mama who 'lets her child sit in waste'.

I DO think discussions about EC have their place and like I said, I found they VERY interesting! But, if they are going to critique other methods, or make assumptions about diapering mamas without facts, it is just turning me off the idea of EC or reading anymore about it. I could just not read the EC discussions, but then I would lose the chance to learn more about it and the possibility of trying it with this next baby. A tough spot to be in...

I'm not criticizing anyine with this post. PLEASE don't think so! I'm just sharing my POV as a CD addict who was avidly reading the EC threads to learn more and then got stung by what felt like a shift in tone from informational and chit chatty to assuming and critical. (I will admit that preggo hormones are likely not helping me!)

[mrzmeg]

For me what seems to have changed is that there are now more and more posts in the EC discussions where an unfair assumption is being made about diapering moms that we 'let our children sit in waste'....But, if they are going to critique other methods, or make assumptions about diapering mamas without facts, it is just turning me off the idea of EC or reading anymore about it.

Actually, I think there was only one post about this at first. It was about how long you let a baby sit in a wet diaper before changing. Some EC moms said something to the effect of thinking it was awful to let babies sit in pee/poop, and then some CD'ing moms got defensive. At that point, the discussion moved to other threads.

Mamas here criticize other parenting methods all the time. Some people rant about moms that let their babies watch tv, formula feed, or use strollers. There have been many discussions here about why disposible diapers are bad. If that kind of discussion is fine, so is a discussion among EC'ers criticizing conventional cloth diaper use. I'm sorry that people are getting upset because their parenting methods are the ones being criticized for a change, but you shouldn't criticize others if you can't handle being criticized yourself. As always, JMO.

[fullofgrace]

I feel like I need to clarify myself.

Actually, I think there was only one post about this at first.

Exactly. At first. The assumptions and critiques have begun to grow in number. That's all I was pointing out - I wasn't trying to point fingers or anything. I was simply answering some of the questions in this thread that specifically asked what we felt changed about EC threads, and that was a change I felt I saw. I replied with how reading those threads made ME feel as someone who loves CDing (as it is what works best for my family right now), but who HAD also wanted to learn more about EC to possibly try it with my next child. I truly wasn't trying to blast anyone for their opinions, I was just adding my own.

Mamas here criticize other parenting methods all the time... I'm sorry that people are getting upset because their parenting methods are the ones being criticized for a change, but you shouldn't criticize others if you can't handle being criticized yourself.

I haven't criticized others' parenting choices here at MDC, so I'm going to guess you meant the "you" in a group sense. I completely agree that ECers are absolutely entitled to their opinion! Really, I do. Like I said, I HAD been reading the EC threads with great interest. But, opinions based on facts versus opinions built on assumptions are two very different things. I simply dislike being lumped into a group of what is now being now labeled 'inattentive moms' in another EC thread based on one tidbit of info.: that someone puts a cloth diaper on their child's bum. As a special needs mom, I'm constantly exhausted because of just how attentive I have to be! :LOL Miss Sammy keeps me on my toes, that is for sure!!

I just feel it is unfair to be asked to just 'suck it up', so to speak, and not say it bothers some of us, simply because other people may or may not have been critical of others' choices in the past. We, too, are entitled to our humble opinions and wanted to say, "Hey, we don't like it!" No more, no less.

I'm personally not harboring hard feelings or anything, I was just sharing how *I* felt in response to a question.

[Oceanone]

I don't make judgements or criticisms about other parenting methods either. I used to before I had a baby though! No, as long as the baby is lovingly attended to I'm happy. Some people relish it though, it makes them feel better about themselves to establish a heirachy about who best loves/ cares for their child. That's ok, it's just needs to be put in perspective when you come across it. Diapering/ ec'ing is only one aspect of parenthood.

Having said that I find that most EC posts/ threads aren't offensive at all, though I do skip many of them, (as well as many diapering threads, I mean who can possibly keep up!) I think the whole EC concept is very cool if you have the committment to it and the time and that is the way you want to spend it. I think a nice cloth diaper changed whenever they are wet is a good alternative too. I would be very surprised if many mothers here let their child "sit around in their own waste" for long. I don't think only Ec'ers would object to that.

I like the different opinions because it does give me a chance to think about the way I do things, the way society does things and makes my world bigger. So, thanks, yet don't be so quick to judge.

[momsgotmilk4two]

Okay, I have to ask. Who has said anything about letting her kid sit in excrement? I don't think anyone on here does this or has said anything positive about it: I think all this talk about letting babies sit in "waste" and "excrement" is what is offensive to some cd'ers. When we talk about absorbancy, it's for PEE not poop. As in, I want my baby to be able to take a nap or a car ride without the clothes, bedsheets, carseat getting wet. No big ulterior motives of wanting to go for the longest time possible without changing my kids: .