UC questions? - Page 2

[CryPixie83]

What was your journey in deciding to UC?

Oh boy this could take a while First of all, I have never had much trust for doctors. Hospitals scare me. The thought of giving birth in the hospital has always seemed wrong to me. Hospitals are where you go if you're sick or injured, but not pregnant. People die in hospitals (at the risk of sounding New Agey; I am energy sensitive and can "feel" when people are dying, it's not a pleasant feeling, I feel it almost everytime I'm in a hospital and I cannot immagine feeling that when I'm in labor)

After the research I've done the only way you'll catch me birthing in a hospital is if something is if I had very poor health or needed a c-section for some legitimate reason. I know I have a right (my right as a woman) to birth in a positive way and I know that would never be possible for me to do in a hospital.

Homebirth has always been the only option for me, since I was at least 15 years old. That scared the crap out of my DH who was raised very mainstream, but after he educated himself he knew it was safer and more comfortable for me.

I wanted a UC with my first, but my DH wasn't ready for that yet, he needed the assurance of experienced "professionals" for his peace of mind "just in case". So we looked high and low in our midwifery-is-illegal state and finally found women who seemed to fit our needs. They were wonderful for prenatals and support and we learned a lot from them. When it actually came down to birth, they were not as I had expected them. They were hands-on, impatient, critical and insensitive. They didn't encourage me to listen to my body. They told me what to do, when to get in the tub, when to get out (and no I couldn't get back in!), when to pee (I was told if I didn't pee I would never get the baby out,so I sat on the toilet with my support people trying everything I could from running water to clitoral stimulation to get myself to pee for over an hour. I was humilated and felt so defeated and unempowered I just cried), I was told not to make noise, what position to be in (I was made to squat for over half an hour when I have never been comfortable squatting and my legs were screaming in agony), they were rude to my support people (my sister and MIL particularly), they kept telling me how they had another client in labor and as soon as I was done they'd have to leave to attend to her but she'd be fine as she'd done this before and knows what she's doing. The entire time they were there I felt like a burden. They were always trying to "move things along" even though labor was progressing steadily( this was my first and I labored actively 12 hours). I can't even count the number of times they put their fingers in my vagina : They had me try this exercise similar to tug of war (using all of my strength to pull on a fabric rope to push) which left my arms so sore I couldn't hold my 8.5lb baby for more than 5 minutes (which hurt!) for weeks. I could list so many more things I am unhappy with about the way they *managed* my dd's birth.

That said, this time around my dh knows I am capable of handling labor. The midwives are no longer welcome in my home for births and I have no desire to have my labor interfered with. So, unassisted childbirth is the answer. I want to be able to listen to my body, to let labor progress as it will without feeling like I'm a burden on someone's busy schedule. To eat, drink and pee as I will. To have no one present who will make me second guess my ability to birth.

What did/does your partner think?

He trusts me to make the right decision for myself and our baby. He's educating himself when he has questions and is otherwise leaving this in my hands.

Do you have friends that also UC and support you?

I don't know of anyone who has had a UC. My sister and at least one friend support my decision. Few others know about our plans. Most people we know probably think we'll have midwives like last time and there is no reason to tell them otherwise.

What is your biggest concern and what is the greatest benefit?

Biggest concern is that somehow CPS would get involved (which is why we tell no one of our plans) even though there is no reason for them to or that my mom will somehow show up during birth uke I try not to worry about CPS, there are enough things in life to stress about without adding to it. I just educate myself and my dh as much as possible and we remain confident that we are making the best decision for our family.

[sapphire_chan]

Originally Posted by bailey228

There have been studies done that babies born violently are more likely to commit suicide and that the meathod they choose is related to what happened at their birth so obviously the experience stays with them. I just try to minimize those effects by raising her with love and respect.

Bailey, I'm guessing those studies found that of people who committed suicide more of them had violent births. If so, I suspect that the birth dictated the method of suicide rather than the suicide itself. Raising your daughter with love and respect will minimize her chances of committing suicide, simply by helping to protect her against most of the other factors that lead to suicide.

(If I have inadvertentally phrased that in a way that makes it seem as though I blame the survivors for a loved-one's suicide, please let me know how I can fix it.)

[Godiva]

Originally Posted by sapphire_chan

Bailey, I'm guessing those studies found that of people who committed suicide more of them had violent births. If so, I suspect that the birth dictated the method of suicide rather than the suicide itself. Raising your daughter with love and respect will minimize her chances of committing suicide, simply by helping to protect her against most of the other factors that lead to suicide.

(If I have inadvertentally phrased that in a way that makes it seem as though I blame the survivors for a loved-one's suicide, please let me know how I can fix it.)

Right, of people who have commited suicide, the majority had violent births, and the way they ended their lives correlated i.e someone born with oxygen asphyixiation (sp?) used a rope, c section used a knife... I wasn't entirely saying that because she was born violently that she is likely to commit suicide (obviously not true as many births are violent) but rather if a violent birth can effect the way they killed themselves then it is something that stays with you.

[sapphire_chan]

That makes sense, sorry for miss reading your post.

I want to read more stories of how people came to UC!

[2bluefish]

For me it all roots back to a spritual belief - a belief that I am the product of an intelligent creator. Birthing at home without an unreasonable amount of emergency protocol in place is an demonstration of my faith that my body is of good design and that when allowed to work of it's own accord it will work well.

Sometimes unforeseen dynamics affect the process and may create a dangerous situation - so I take what I consider "reasonable" precautions - nutrition, good health, education, study of herbology, I have a doppler, I can seek outside help if needed.

I have felt instinctively that UC is correct for me from the time I learned about. DH was not comfortable with it last time. I had a hands off midwife who had had UCs herself. However, after dh saw how the experience affected me - in the moment and long term - he understood that I need to be free to do whatever makes me feel safe. He is as proud as can be of our previous homebirth and has a healthy confidence in our ability to bring this next child into the world safely.

Bottom line, my actions have a spiritual base, and when I loose sight of that, danger, complication and confusion are not far behind - attended or not.

[Kathryn]

Might answer the question, but I'll lurk to see how the thread goes for a bit first.

[doula mary]

WOW, Thank you all for trusting me with your stories! You are brave and wise women. It seems a common theme was a "traumatic" first birth, whether in the hospital or at home with a MW...which surprised me.

fourlttlebirds, your eloquence was moving...I hope you have written your birth stories down. Lovely, I especially liked " I also felt for the first time the incredible feeling of being completely inside birth"

Tana, very solid and practical points that very much made sense to me, thanks for your honesty...I LIKE it when women THINK about their birth.

Sapphire Chan...thanks for the understanding...

Bailey, rather shocked that your birth occurred in a urban hospital...wanted you to know, that many women feel "sad" about how their baby came into the world..and at some point, you accept..that it's OK to feel sad...does that make sense???

Crypixie, OMG! I get the whole energy hospital thing..I don't care for hospitals myself too much. ( But apparently we are extremely lucky to have one here that is very pro-natural birth/birth center) compared with the other...where natural labor and birth..involves 4-5 nurses..because they have never SEEN a undedicated labor??!! YIKES!

But one would assume a homebirth MW would be kind and gentle...I was SHOCKED at your story, I cant imagine a (home) MW behaving like this?!

Very interesting information, and I appreciate you all in giving me another chance. I was very moved by your stories and I understand "why" a woman would choose a UC more tonight...than when I woke up this morning..Thank YOU!
Mary

[CryPixie83]

Originally Posted by doula mary

Crypixie, OMG!
But one would assume a homebirth MW would be kind and gentle...I was SHOCKED at your story, I cant imagine a (home) MW behaving like this?!

They were gentle and kind until the birth That really threw me for a loop. I think it may also have been partly because I hadn't paid my full balance by that point and they felt they weren't going to be compensated for their work :

At least their apprentice was still sweet and gentle (a UCer herself) Actually I think hearing her talk about her UC helped DH see it as a possibility.

As many negatives as there was with my MW attended homebirth, I know it could have been so much worse had I traveled the two blocks to the hospital my old OB works in (she fired me ) and I know I probably would have ended up with a c-section because there is no way my body would progress in a place so unfamiliar with so many strangers and so many possibilities, so I am thankful for my experience.

[doula mary]

CryPixie,

It would throw me for a loop too, having ~anyone~ be nice then change their tune at birth time...but epecially a birth attendant.....someone you trusted to be kind.

To me, it sounds like she had lost her ability to be "wonderous" at the whole process....perhaps she needs to retire?

Mary

[djinneyah]

hmmm...

when i went to the hospital to birth my son, the nurses quelled my instincts. i wanted to walk, they strapped me to a monitor. after being "monitored" for a couple hours, they decided my ctx were becoming "ineffective" and wanted to start pit. i had to *fight* to get them to let me up and walk around to get labor back on track and not start the pit. when i came back from walking an hour later, i was fully dilated (imagine that!). they put me on my back (not where i wanted to be), had me hold my legs up by my ears, and "taught" me how to push. they had me doing purple-pushing for about 15 minutes before ds started crowning. the doc hadn't arrived yet, so they told me to *stop* pushing. my body at that point was pushing on its own. the nurse then *yelled* at me to stop pushing, that *i* was doing the pushing, not my body. as i was arguing with her about the physiologic process of natural birth, my body pushed my son out onto the bed. nobody caught him. the nurses rushed around for a minute, trying to decide what to do. they came over and clamped the cord (i told her we wanted to wait till the cord was done pulsing, and that she could do any resuscitation necessary with ds on my stomach; she insisted that the cord was done pulsing and that they needed to take him to the almighty warmer instead : ).

the doc came in 5 min. later to stitch up my 2nd degree tear. the nurse that had been yelling at me and insisting that i do things her way left shortly after cleaning up.

had i been left to my own devices, i would have been moving during my entire labor, and i would have been kneeling/squatting to push.

was it just a matter of having a couple crappy nurses on duty when i arrived? no.

had i stayed home...i wouldn't have had an IV, as per hospital policy. i wouldn't have been strapped to the bed to be monitored as per hospital policy. i wouldn't have had AROM to "get things going a little better." i wouldn't have been thrown into a lithotomy position to push, as per policy, and therefore, probably wouldn't have torn.

bottom line, hospitals inhibit instincts, and i no longer trust them to know what's best for me. it's not just a matter of staying home with a midwife, though. i don't want to feel watched or monitored. i don't want a midwife waiting in the wings for *something* to happen. i want to be free to follow my instincts, and i would feel inhibited by having a midwife present, like i'm supposed to be performing for her. this is how i feel around *any* type of medical professional, a midwife would be no different in my eyes.

my husband, family, and friends are supportive of my decision

[sapphire_chan]

Djinneyah, I am astounded at how well your body coped with that situation. It's like your body took a look at the situation and instead of shutting down, as happens with a lot of people, it just decided to work faster so it didn't have to deal with that nonsense. I'm wondering if maybe your future births will be slower just because you won't be putting out those stress hormones.

[djinneyah]

Originally Posted by sapphire_chan

Djinneyah, I am astounded at how well your body coped with that situation. It's like your body took a look at the situation and instead of shutting down, as happens with a lot of people, it just decided to work faster so it didn't have to deal with that nonsense. I'm wondering if maybe your future births will be slower just because you won't be putting out those stress hormones.

i've been wondering how this next one will go, as well. can't wait to find out! should be any day now

[paxye]

What was your journey in deciding to UC?

This will be a bit long...

I wanted homebirths with a midwife with the first two but it wasn't legal so I had to go with a birthing center.
The midwifes were great (well most of them). However, the midwifes that were with me during my whole pregnancy were on vacation when I went into labour 2 weeks "late". Long labour, posterior baby that wouldn't engage, back labour the whole time, transfer to the hospital after 38 hours, midwife was supposed to stay with me at the hospital but said she was too tired though she, the docs, the nurses, my mom, my grandma talked me into an epi before she left (while dh was out of the room) and then they put a catheter in, was told that I was dehydrated but wouldn't allow me to drink, hooked me up to IV but didn't listen to me when I told them to do it in my hand because my viens are too fragile... sticked me about 7-8 times before listening to me and getting it on the first time in my hand. Given pitocin.
I was told that I would have to have a C/S and that there was no way around it. I had about 3-4 specialists come and see me... baby was to big, my pelvis was too small, I would never be able to give birth vaginally, every 30 min I felt raped by vaginal exams, they wouldn't even talk to me they would just tell me to open my legs, I tried to refuse the monitoring but they pressured me into it, at one point they lost DS's heartbeat and a team rushed in and instert an internal monitor... turns out the other one had just slipped...
After about 7 hours (about 3 pm) I was completely dialated but was told that they didn't want me to push because I would be having a C/S anyways (ds was still not engaged but it was the bag of water that had made me dialate.)
Though I am glad that they didn't start making me push I Had an anxiety attack because of the contant C/S talk, was given oxygen. When a doc came to do a vag exam he told me that he would break my water, I said no, he said "ooops"....
At 6 pm there was a shift change, a new doc came in and again talked about C/S asking what my fears were etc... saying it was just a little cut and then gave me until 8 pm to progress if not they would be going against my will and would take legal action... About 7:30 I said that I had pressure but the doc didn't believe me and checked and ds was still not engaged, they upped my epi. At about 7:55 the doc came in with a team to try to convince me (hospital psych etc) she went to check me and was surpised that ds's head was already out... she delivered him with only one gloved hand. I missed out on the birth completely. Two hours later I walked out of the hospital feeling totally violated, lied to and loathing my birth experience. I also lost feeling in one of my bigs toes and part of my foot because of the epi....(btw... ds was just under 8 pounds)

The second time around I moved out of Montreal while I was pregnant. I travelled an hour each way to go see the midwifes. My Dh doesn't have a licence and we don't know anyone around here so I was in many ways preparing for a UC if I coudn't get to the birthing center. I would not feel comfy to drive in labour. However, my water broke before contrax started while DH was at work (in Montreal also) and gave enough time for a friend of mine to pick him up come get me and drive back to MTL... Nursing DS kickstart labour but again he was posterior, back labour again, stalled at 3 cm again, threatened with a transfer started to lose myself completely, it bothered me that I was being so observed and that the midwifes would come in the room when I was having a contraction and I just wanted to be alone...
A new midwife arrived and did help quite a bit, she gave me back my confidence, she asked me what I wanted and told me to not listen to anyone but to listen to my body and myslef... she did give me a few suggestions but then had to leave (she wasn't my midwife and had other clients to get to) I listen to her suggestions and my labour started up again slightly.
I was tired though and my body wanted to rest, the other midwifes said not to and that it would stall my labour even more and really started to put me down...
I didn't listen to them and retreated inside myself and knew I had to relax. The midwifes were upset with me and talked about transfer again... I turned over, got comfy and started to relax... I fell asleep between contractions waking slightly when a contrax hit and when the midwifes would come check the Heartbeat...
The midwife that had came before came back to see how I was and when I turned over to talk to her I felt ds turn inside me, engage and my body took over at that second. I had slept through transition. Within a few minutes ds's head was out and he was blue with the cord tight around his neck 3 times (tight enough that he had bruises for days) they cut the cord even though I asked them not to. He was having trouble breathing and gave him oxygen (if they would have left the cord intact they wouldn't have had to) They wouldn't let me nurse him right away even though he was looking for the breast because he wasn't "pink" enough. The placenta came out and I started to hemorage, (if they would have let me nurse him, I don't think that it would have happened either.
Though I did get the feeling of empowerment that I missed out of with my first I still felt that my power had been taken from me, I wasn't in charge, It was still not my birth.

This time, I did call to get an appointment to see a mw (even though I would have prepared for a UC) but they no longer take patients outside of MTL, another birth center equally far also no longer takes patients outside of their region. An OB is not an option so my only other option was a UP... I am now very happy about it....

What did/does your partner think?

UP... no prob... UC... was a bit surprised and nervous but feeling better about it each day...

Do you have friends that also UC and support you?

No, no one has even really heard of choosing to have a UC, but those who know support me but have questions but in a good way. I am very careful though about who I am friends with anyways so for them the idea is not too far fetched but makes sense...

What is your biggest concern and what is the greatest benefit?

Death of course, the same concern that I would have anywhere. Benifits? Giving birth unhindered without any intervention. Finally owning the birth experience. Not getting bad advice or being threatened when things don't go fast enough and not feeling like a burdun or feeling observed. and the greatest Benefit is that I truly believe that my child will be safer with an unhindered birth.

[2bluefish]

Originally Posted by paxye

then gave me until 8 pm to progress if not they would be going against my will and would take legal action....

My goodness, so glad you are ok. Just sickening, I guess it pays to know a good lawyer in this day and age...

[Godiva]

Originally Posted by paxye

then gave me until 8 pm to progress if not they would be going against my will and would take legal action...

Yes, this is something else that is HUGE for me in wanting a UC, the fact that they can LEGALLY do something to YOUR body against your will. I am an anarchist and so this goes against all of my beliefs. It is completely Owrellian that the government has more control of your body in the hospital than you do. (many of the things done to me I had refused but they did anyways as "standard procedure", if I sued them for malpractice, I would have never won because that's just what hospitals are supposed to do.)

I'm so sorry they threatened you with this.

[doula mary]

Thank you for your replies.

Those of you that had hospital births, did you have any set ideas or ideals coming into your PG regarding how you wished to birth? If so, did you share these with your care providers? Or, did you birth..then realize what was important to you when it came to birthing?

It seems that those of you that had "first baby" at the hospital, ...had events that you did not anticipate and interventions that were traumatizing. Did you expect these?

Mary

[Godiva]

Yes, I knew that everything that happened to me was going to happen (well except for nurses grabbing my face and yelling at me for being scared, that was an interesting one, oh and that they didn't even ask me if I wanted drugs, just stuck them in the IV I *had* to have.) if I went to the hospital. I had spent hours apon hours researching birth before my dd was born. I knew with every intervention I was getting closer to a section. (the lady who was about to cut me up was standing there as dd was born, interstingly enough, she cried, I didn't, I was just glad it was over) That is what gives me guilt, I KNEW better.

[doula mary]

I feel like I'm on another planet...when hearing about your horrible birth stories..in hospitals.. and with MW's. The "majority" of births I attend, are hospital/home with a MW. Mom is prepared, we have discussed..wishes, desires, needs, and wants...98% of the time it goes as planned. Throw in the occasional nasty birth with a nasty Dr...( like what some of you have experienced) Most are 'hands-off", I know a oxymoron for you ladies ...Many are birthed in the water and many are "caught" by mom or dad.

Did you discuss your wants/needs with your OB? Did you have a birthplan? Did you have a doula?

Mary

[sapphire_chan]

Keeping in mind of course the 2nd camp of UCing as defined in the motivations thread. This is more a question for 1st camp UCers, I believe.

[BirthFree]

I had my first baby in the hospital (a transport) but part of the transport was due to the MW (and the trauma of my second birth was due to her as well... which is partly why she is not my MW again). We had discussed a birth plan but she was not honest with my dillation (long story) when it had come down to me needing drugs or major encouragement - I think honestly she was tired and wanted to go home. What was important to me kind of got pushed aside - my support people at that time had NO idea what they were doing (I didn't drink or eat anything for more than 18 hours... I was in labor land).

Second time the MW said she would be my doula but I'm sorry... it's just not possible. Really. I mean she was (should be!) focused on the clinical stuff and at the end when I was scared and needed emotional help she was busy (as she would be) so I don't support that statement anymore of someone doing both.

This time... I have a doula. 'Nuf said.

The first baby I transfered my care at 30w b/c I'd discussed my birth plan with my OB and *wow* was he NOT going to do what I really wanted... best choice I made by far -
Have I told you all this already? Sorry to repeat if I have.
~Julie