Could you bear witness?

[SJane01]

If you have never seen a circumcision preformed, could you watch it if you thought that it would better your understanding of your own viewpoint against it?

I guess the better phrased quesiton is...
If you thought that the knowlege of watching the experience would better your knowledge in fighting.. then could you watch it?

[Revamp]

I saw one performed once, not irl, only on screen.

That was bad enough frankly. I closed my eyes but I could still hear the screams for a few seconds before I switched the speakers off.

It did help strengthen my resolve.

[Yoshua]

I've watched one from nocirc.org i think.


I was on the edge of pro/anti and it was one of the deciding factors that nudged me over.


It wasnt the cutting. The screaming, or the circ itself.

It was when the Dr. put the tweezers/plyers inside the foreskin and ripped it away from the glans, the blood curdling yell at that point in time made my testicles go up inside my abdomen and then to hear the Dr. say 'that is normal, he is more scared of the restraints than anything I am doing down here' made me wanna cry....



I would watch it again if I was sitting next to someone who was on the edge. I'll watch it 100 times if it helps someone else see it the way I see it...... I'd rather not sit through one in person.... The Dr. might come out of the operation a glans smaller.

[Sijae]

I don't think I could watch one or be any more resolved in my feelings against it. I was in the nursery with my nephew when they were going to circ another little boy. They made me stand outside in the open door while they did the procedure. I stood there because it was my job to watch my nephew at that point to prevent any unwanted things happening to him. There was no way I was going to let him out of my sight with the snake doctor there.

There was no screaming and I don't know if and what anaesthesia they used, but just knowing what was going on over there made me physically sick. The doctor who did it gave off a very slimy icky feeling - he was definitely a snake. Even worse, they asked his opinion on the hips of a baby girl that was in there and in the middle of the surgery, while the baby was strapped to the board and in the middle of being cut - the doctor left him for at least 10 minutes to examine the other baby. The little boys parents did not come to him in the nursery at all.

ETA: The little boys brother and sister (maybe 10 years old?) where there outside the nursery as well and I took the opportunity to explain to them that it was unnecessary and wrong what they were doing and how horrible it was. Probably didn't make a difference but I had to say something.

Laura

[SJane01]

When I say witness -- I refer to live, in person.

For one the videos show either a perfect picture of happiness, or a perfect picture of despair.

Any gruesome images can strengthen a persons resolve. But you know your resolve is solid when you witness the not so greusome pictures of despair, and you still hold strong.

My son loves a series of books.. I'm going to paraphrase something from it..

'You must love your enemey and see them for what they are before you can judge them'

[CarolynnMarilynn]

I watched one once, and only once. I was so violently nauseous I had to sit down with my head between my knees and try to get myself together. It took about 15 minutes for me to be able to function at all. I was stunned and shocked. I really was mutilation. It did strengthen my resolve to help other parents not circumcize. The paed who did the circ told me it was a good thing I wasn't training to be a paed (I was a midwifery student) since I couldn't take it. I said that I was able to watch surgery, repair episiotomies and tears, and clean up poop, but that my stomach wasn't strong enough to watch a baby being circ'd and would never do that to my kid. That seemed to end the conversation.

[Sijae]

Originally Posted by SJane01

When I say witness -- I refer to live, in person.

For one the videos show either a perfect picture of happiness, or a perfect picture of despair.

Any gruesome images can strengthen a persons resolve. But you know your resolve is solid when you witness the not so greusome pictures of despair, and you still hold strong.

My son loves a series of books.. I'm going to paraphrase something from it..

'You must love your enemey and see them for what they are before you can judge them'

But I don't need to witness the procedure to know the results. It's one thing to oppose circ just because of the procedure - but that can be argued against. Like you said it may be that the baby wont cry, it may be that they figure out a way to make it hurt less etc.

I oppose circ due to not only the procedure but much more importantly because of the long-term and permanent detrimental effects to the body. I don't need to see the circ to know what they did and what they took away.

Laura

[LavenderMae]

No, I could not watch a baby being circumcised in person (I can't get through a video even). I would lose it, I don't think I could emotionally handle it at all. It would be like me watching a child being beaten or molested, there is just no way in hell.

[LeosMama]

I agree with Sijae, it's not just about the procedure itself, it's about the larger issue of an individual's right to his own body.

[susienjay]

I did not have an up close view of the circumcision but I was in the room for the circumcision of a 5 lb 1 oz preemie. My preemie twins were in the same room as this boy and they performed the circ in there the day he was discharged. I was probably 20 feet away from where they were performing the circ. I don't know if I could have handled seeing the raw bloody wound inflicted on this boy but I sure got to hear the commentary about it from the doctor and nurse performing it and listen to the baby's pitiful cries. I was already opposed to circumcision but it really made me very aware of the role doctors and nurses take in this awful practice.

I knew the circ was scheduled the day before it happened and I was there at the time it happened on purpose. The main reason was because the day before I had heard the nurses planning the circ for a boy in room F. There were only 2 baby boys in room F and one of them was my son. I know it was unlikely but I was worried they'd get the boys mixed up. I kind of wish I hadn't been there because it haunted me for months what was done to this boy. Even now almost 2 years later it still bothers me. Plus when the parents came to pick up their son the nurse told them the baby was a real trooper and hardly made a sound for the circ. I guess they felt a need to lie to the parents to make them feel better.

[QueenOfThePride]

Originally Posted by susienjay

Plus when the parents came to pick up their son the nurse told them the baby was a real trooper and hardly made a sound for the circ. I guess they felt a need to lie to the parents to make them feel better.

I don't understand why they think they have to say that

It's like they want to keep doing more circumcisions. They must like it or something.

[MommytoB]

Actually if a doctor or nurse said it was the 'true ' way it would 'scare' parents into "no circumcision" = no profit but they get profit from "lies".

I could never 'bear a witness to a circumcision just to say oh I seen it I know the truth but as we know if parents are in denial of their son's actually missing a body part then they would be in denial of what they 'would see' just like how doctors are in 'denial' of the reasons of screams claming the boy is upset of being more confined than he is of having a part of his penis ripped off ..

[pdx.mothernurture]

I watched many circumcisions and before I 'knew better' even assisted by prepping the room and standing by to assist the doc. I could NEVER stand by and watch one today, anymore than I could bear witness to a rape and not do anything to protect the person being victimized. Watching a circumcision on video is different, because there's nothing that can be done...but standing by when a child is being violated, harmed, cut, mutilated, whatever word you want to use...no, now that I know better I couldn't do it.

Jen

[imgr8ful]

not really answering your question but my dh watched ds1's circ. ds slept through it until the bleeding didn't stop and they needed to put stitches in.

after ds2 was born and left intact, he still wasn't fully convinced circ is wrong. i showed him the nocirc video and he had a hard time watching it, had to turn the sound off. he said he was surprised that his reaction changed. he doesn't know why ds1's circ didn't bother him. maybe because he was sleeping and didn't appear to be in pain until the cutting was done...maybe because it was so deep in his mind that circ was the right thing to do, it was healthier, it was done to him, it's part of being male.

i asked him later if he had seen the video before ds1's circ, would he have changed his mind?



he said, yeah, probably.

[Quirky]

No way no how would I/could I watch one in person. Like PPs have said, a) there's no way I could let it happen and not do something to prevent it, and b) there is no way I could possibly be more opposed to circumcision than I already am.

I've never seen a person raped or tortured in real life either. And I'm 100 percent opposed to rape and torture, too.

[crissei]

Originally Posted by susienjay

I did not have an up close view of the circumcision but I was in the room for the circumcision of a 5 lb 1 oz preemie. My preemie twins were in the same room as this boy and they performed the circ in there the day he was discharged. I was probably 20 feet away from where they were performing the circ. I don't know if I could have handled seeing the raw bloody wound inflicted on this boy but I sure got to hear the commentary about it from the doctor and nurse performing it and listen to the baby's pitiful cries. I was already opposed to circumcision but it really made me very aware of the role doctors and nurses take in this awful practice.

I knew the circ was scheduled the day before it happened and I was there at the time it happened on purpose. The main reason was because the day before I had heard the nurses planning the circ for a boy in room F. There were only 2 baby boys in room F and one of them was my son. I know it was unlikely but I was worried they'd get the boys mixed up. I kind of wish I hadn't been there because it haunted me for months what was done to this boy. Even now almost 2 years later it still bothers me. Plus when the parents came to pick up their son the nurse told them the baby was a real trooper and hardly made a sound for the circ. I guess they felt a need to lie to the parents to make them feel better.

The EXACT same thing happened when my son was in the NICU. I was so irrational the whole time. My poor (rational) DH had to keep reminding that there was nothing I could do (that wouldnt land me in jail)
I dont get how preemie parents (especially) can justify doing this, after all our babes go through! As if their little bodies arent working hard enough!:

[crunchyconmomma]

Originally Posted by Revamp

I saw one performed once, not irl, only on screen.

That was bad enough frankly. I closed my eyes but I could still hear the screams for a few seconds before I switched the speakers off.

It did help strengthen my resolve.

ditto EXACTLY that. i am disturbed to even think about it. wish we could make it a part of all childbirth class curricula. nobody could do it after that. seriously.

[Sharondio]

When DH and I were at loggerheads about this decision, I finally said that he could have it done...*if* he was there when they did it. I figured if he wanted this done to his son, the least he could do was watch.

Then I sent him the video as prep. He decided that he couldn't even watch the video and that was all she wrote.

[Lizzardbits]

Originally Posted by Quirky

No way no how would I/could I watch one in person. Like PPs have said, a) there's no way I could let it happen and not do something to prevent it, and b) there is no way I could possibly be more opposed to circumcision than I already am.

I've never seen a person raped or tortured in real life either. And I'm 100 percent opposed to rape and torture, too.

Yup^^

I was "lucky" enough to see the video back in 1996 when I was pregnant with my son. I was happy that we kept a trashcan near the computer, as i became violently ill :Puke That was/is the main reason why I am opposed to circ is the stoooopidly insane amount of pain that circ causes. Now I know that it also cause pain for a lifetime.

No Way, Huh Uh, Nope, Never ever would I be able to witness one in real life, or I might have to do a Superwoman leap to save the poor baby, and then go all Lorena Bobbitt on the circ'er, but I'd have to have a dull instrument to use, and make sure that the parents aren't going to circ later before I give them back their precious babyboy.

[Karry]

Well, I have seen few in person. I used to work as a nurse on a post partum floor. One of the things we were required to do was assist the docs on circs. I ended up only working on that floor for three months.

After having my sons and keeping them intact, I wouldn't be able to witness another circ without feeling ill. If I ever go back to working as a nurse I won't work where circs are performed.