The Infertility Cure - Page 3

[kerikadi]

OTMama - thanks for bringing me over here. I wish I had bought this book instead of Fertility Foods which I have haven't found very helpful. It did, however, help me get back on track with lots of fruits & veggies. I didn't know wheat was a no no - I made chicken rolled in wheat germ last night and a LOT of it as I figured it would be an easy protein for me to snack on.

Now, the Fertility Foods book recommends 100ish grams of protein, how am I going to get that if I go vegan(ish)? I don't/can't/won't do soy/tofu and although I can tolerate a small amount of beans - not enough and certainly not daily. I do snack on almonds but that isn't going to get me anywhere near 100 grams.

I have cut my coffee consumption in half with only half a cup a day but I do eat two dry waffles every morning that I planned on cutting out buy eating egg whites but now it doesn't look like that is such a great idea. What does one eat for breakfast???

I have my chart in my siggy and you can see it is pretty textbook, even looks pregnant until AF shows, I am guessing that is a good thing. I have charted for years as we practice NFP/FAM and fortunately, I am very regular.

We have only been trying for a short time so I wouldn't say we are having problems with fertility but I am 37 and feel like time is short so I'd like to do whatever I can to increase my chances.

If you don't mind I'd like to list some of the things I am doing based on things I had read previous and if you could let me know if they are BAD I would appreciate that. I am drinking grapefruit juice and green tea trying to help with CM, I am avoiding fruit high on the glycemic index but am eating pineapple - especially in the second half of my cycle, I have cut out refined sugar and don't eat much dairy except the heaping tablespoon of plain yogurt I put in my smoothies at night. I have been having a smoothie at night to help with my sweet tooth that includes 1/2 banana, couple of strawberries, few pieces of pineapple, blueberries, protein powder, flax seed, greens powder, yogurt, and a bit of fish oil - I think that is everything. I also drink Emergen'C once a day and take a prenatal, omega and B6.

To your knowledge are any of the things I am doing detremental without me knowing? I will work on the wheat. Oh, and I work out regularly

Blessings to you Mamas
Keri

[OTMomma]

Keri- Glad you found this thread interesting. First of all- I think your smoothie sounds fine- nothing in it is listed as a big No No. You might even want to add raspberries to it- as she recommends those to everyone. However, I think before you go making lots of diet changes, you should try to get ahold of the book. It has a test in it that you take to determine your chinese diagnosis- and that tells you what diet changes to make. It asks questions about your menstral cycle, bleeding (as in type, color, amount), what your chart looks like and other things like if you feel tired, cold, sleep well, etc.

Astrid went vegan because she has endometriosis and its recommended specifically for that- however she can eat all the wheat she wants. I have a luteal phase defect and giving up dairy and wheat were on the list for that, but it says I DO need to eat meat every day- so no protien problem here.

Your luteal phase looks great, though the pre-O part might be a few days short- I think the book makes a big deal of Oing on day 14, but I usually O later than that myself. Not sure if that will be a real problem for you.
Hope this helps.

[kerikadi]

Thanks for the info Laura.

My cycles have been short since I started practicing NFP in 1990 and I was able to achieve pregnancy 6 times w/o really trying (all were planned but one) so I don't think the short time before O is an issue, I don't think I've ever ovulated on day 14.

I'll definitely pick up some raspberries the next time I am at the store.

I think for now I will stick to the low sugar, low fat and lots of fruits and veggies with good protein and if AF rears her ugly head again next month I'll pick up the book and take the test.

So far I don't have any of the issues you described for yourself or Astrid, of course, that doesn't mean I don't have issues that could impair my conception efforts, I just don't have the same ones you guys do

I'll work on being a good little doobie with my eating & drinking and keep praying that this is the month If it isn't I'll pick up the book and see if there is anything I should/could be doing to improve my chances.

Blessings,
Keri

[Astrid]

Laura, I had some pasta made with Kamut flour and it was really good! I don't know if this would classify as a non wheat product though but if it would be okay for you and if you miss pasta then I recommend it. I know some of the non-wheat pastas just don't hit the spot.


I fell off the wagon when I started spotting last week and I ate 2 sugary cookies. Bad me

[OTMomma]

Thanks for the tip Astrid. You are right that some of the alternative pastas are, strange. I am not doing great at the sugar- it turns out it has been the hardest one for me. But I know I'm at least eating less than I was, and that has to count for something. Managing to not do dairy and wheat has been a HUGE step. And I"m worried how I'll keep it up while we travel and eat out a lot. I guess I'll just do my best- and figure that even if I get a little wheat and cheese, its still better than living off pizza and pasta with alfredo sauce.
Are you still mostly vegan?

[Astrid]

You are right that when you are travelling it is a lot harder to stick to the diet! When I was away, I had some eggs for breakfast because I needed something that would keep me full for a long time and I'm a bit tired of oatmeal. I still put parm cheese on my caesar salad but I am eating way less cheese then I was before so I allow myself this.

I try to keep lots of fresh fruit in the house for when I am craving something sweet. Honestly, the sugary cookies I had weren't all that good - almost too sweet (Peak Freans with creamy fillings) so I think our body adjusts to eating less sugar and we crave it less.

If you can find a wheat-less pizza dough then you could still have pizza. Pile it up with yummy topping and I bet you wont even miss the cheese I have vegan friends who eat cheeseless pizza. I'll keep my eye open for a recipe.

[Dena]

OK, I checked TIC out of the library and took the tests (twice, just to be sure ) Can I join you all?

Looks like I have Kidney Yin and Spleen Qi deficiencies, which is pretty much what my acupuncturist diagnosed before our last IVF. Up until this week, I would have diagnosed with Heart Deficiency as well - maybe the energy healing is working!!

As I was fortunate enough to have my acupuncturist's diagnosis already, we had been following many of the dietary suggestions, although I have lapsed considerably on sugar, caffiene, cheese, and white bread. Sigh, time to give up coffee again. :

Dinner ideas for us this week include salmon (used a sour cream/dill sauce, but not much...), sesame soba noodles with green beans, chicken parmasan (again, a little cheese), spinach patties (bound with lentils and some whole wheat bread crumbs), and maybe a meatloaf.

I will say that despite eating some cheese and salads, both of which are apparently no nos for me, I conceived dd back in 03. Yes, it was through IVF, but we likely would have needed that anyway due to severe male factor (dh tried acupuncture with very little success), so I think there is a little wiggle room in these diets. Hope so, anyway...

[Arwyn]

There's absolutely wiggle room - my only gripe about TIC so far (and many, many other fertility books) is the emphasis on how many things can go wrong when TTC, and how everything needs to be just so for it to work.

Which is true. But.

It DOES work! A lot! In less than ideal circumstances! I have a basic trust in our bodies to get pregnant, all we need is to stop interfering and let them do their thing (situation is obviously a little bit different for situations like major male factor, or other physical barriers on either side). For many of us, foods like wheat and dairy are interfering, though, so the more we can cut back and stop actively messing up our bodies, the better. It doesn't need to be perfect, it just needs to be good enough.

I for one have not had much luck with the dairy/wheat reduction yet, but for one thing my aunt has been here, which makes things harder, and for another I'm the type who changes diet slowly. But I stick to the changes I implement that way rather better than if I try for a radical alteration, so I feel pretty good about it.

[Dena]

Yes, Arwyn, I have for a long time been a little annoyed with the "everything must be perfect, my way or the highway" approaches that many of these books take. TIC, though, pleased me because she overall suggests a wholesome diet, and nothing that she suggests is actually harmful. Also, she does allow room for the necessity for ART. If I had listened to all the doctors (including one endocrinologist who told us our chances of concieving on our own were better than through IVF!) that tried to steer us away from ART, dd would not be here!

I like your "good enough" approach - I think it allows a much more relaxed attitude toward this whole thing - and stress, after all, can impact IF! I am so glad I can still eat whole wheat - though it means I will have to look into other pastas, because I really am not fond of whole wheat pasta. I think cheese will be the hardest thing for me to give up - it makes so many things so yummy. Sigh. But if I remember correctly, I was eating far less cheese when we concieved dd, so I think it is a good idea to let it go as far as possible. Anyone tried soy cheese yet? Is it any good?

[Astrid]

Soy cheese... well I imagine there are lots of different kinds and I imagine there are some good ones out there... but the kinds I have tried, I really don't like. Maybe if I had never had real cheese before it wouldn't be so bad

And I love the idea of wiggle room in the diet. I am eating way less cheese as well and almost no sugar

[OTMomma]

I agree about the wiggle room. I realized while reading the book that I concieved my dd at a time I ate WAY less dairy, I wasn't dairy free, but I also didn't have it every day like I had been lately. I probably ate a lot better in general back then. I also never thought about eating "cold" foods, and I'm not being successful at giving up eating things straight from the fridge, like salads and fruits that are cold- but some how I think that counts for less than eating tons of sugar, white bread and cheese- lol.

If anyone is curious, I think soy yogurt and soy icecream are both pretty good- too bad I'm not supposed to do soy either.

[Dena]

Yes, I am wondering about soy for me, now, too, as it is cold and damp, both of which are things to avoid in my other lists, even though the Kidney Yin list calls for tofu. Hmmm.... well soy has never been a huge part of my diet, anyway, so I guess I will just avoid using it for a substitute. I am thinking rice products in lieu of dairy may be better anway. I LOVE rice milk - not nearly as sweet as soy. I agree with Arwyn on the soy cheese, at least those I have tried. Is there rice milk cheese out there?

And Laura, I think you are right, I think that ridding our diets of the white bread and sugar (which have been proven toxic even by Western medicine - have you ever listened to Dr. Oz on Oprah?) is FAR more important than eating for energy, although, the way my acupuncturist explained it made sense, that the overall concept is to not make your body work too hard to get to its nutrition so it can channel that energy into baby-making. Thus, no rare meat, little raw foods, etc., that are harder to digest.

So I have been looking at recepies, and am wondering about spinach - she says it is a "cold" food, but is that only raw, or would that be in its cooked state as well? I have noticed the other energetically cold foods she mentions are those that are typically eaten only raw, like lettuce and cucumbers. Anyone have any input on this? I found an awesome looking vegan recipe for sweet potato gratin, except that it uses cooked spinach. Well, I may try it anyway...

[Ava0709]

Is anyone else having problems figuring out what problems you have. I have read the book three times now and have taken the diagnotistic test and I am still not sure. The only thing I come up with on the diagnostic test is a kidney yang deficiency and MAYBE liver qi stagnation. I DO have a luteal phase defect that I CANNOT seem to get rid of no matter what I try and they say that typically is from kidney yang and spleen qi but when I read that chapter I couldn't really find a specific BBT chart that fit my problems or I don't feel that the overall described symptoms fit me. I guess I am going to follow kidney yang and spleen qi since that is what it says most LPDs are from. It just seems everyone else can figure out their problems easier than me.

Also- I can't find where they say to give up wheat for LPD. It seems that everyone is doing that but I have read the book several times now and just don't see it.

[Astrid]

Ava0709, you may not have to give up wheat. I didn't. I am trying to eat less wheat to see if it is contributing to why I get so tired but it had nothing to do with ttc

I did the tests and feel like I have everything I think the only way to get a 100% accurate diagnosis would be to see a Traditional Chinese Medicine dr.

[Ava0709]

What are your thoughts on soy? I have read that it can impair infertiilty- but the book says to eat it. Is anyone else avoiding soy? Now that I can't have dairy I would really like to have soy yogurt, etc. but since I already have enough fertility issues I don't want to make it worse!

[kerikadi]

Does she recommend any specific kind of tea in the book? I am weaning myself off of coffee/teeccino (currently drink 3/4 cup a day) and onto tea and wanted to pick some up from WF today but am unsure of what to get.

TIA,
Keri

[mamimapster]

Originally Posted by OTMomma

I'm also trying to do some acupressure, soak my feet in warm water, and put a heating pad on my lower abdomin daily before O (I had cold uterus). I'm not doing the herbs, as the other herbs I've tried in the past have not always resulted in the desired response, so I'm warry of those.

Oh, and my biggest issues I'm working on are Kidney Yang Deficiency, Spleen Def. and cold uterus. I have other mild issues, but decided to focus on the worst ones.

I've been lurking and found this book in the library, I'm also Kidney Yang deficient (this was highest by far), and had more minor Speen Def and Liver def. I was a little at all of the diet rules and suggestions, especially how to eat animal products on a vegetarian/low dairy diet? I am going to eat some fish, but We keep a Kosher dairy kitchen, so even if I managed to get some Kosher organic meat, I'd not really have a place to cook it. Any one else trying to do this diet as a vegetarian? I did soak my feet last night, and We are going to stop buying white flour anything. The other HARD HARD one for me is coffee-I've cut down to half caf, but I just don't know that I can go down to 0%. I haven't had any today and the head is pounding!: I coffee.

[mamimapster]

Originally Posted by Astrid

The sad irony is I am allergic too all nuts except peanuts However, I have been tempted to give almond butter a try because it is the least "greasy" of the nuts and I remember growing up my dad would buy lots of Fruit and Nut chocolate bars and when I really wanted some chocolate I would eat them but pick out the almonds. I never had a reaction to them and some nuts, like walnuts, just the smell makes my throat start to tingle.

I feel like I am running out of things to eat though I did sprinkle a little parmesan on my caesar salad today. Cheese will be the hardest for me to give up and I don't like soy cheese

Have you tried sunflower seed butter? I havent had it in years, but we used to eat it when I was a kid and it was pretty tasty.

Oh yeah, before the book I've been Dx with short luteal phase and Uterine polyps 2X.

[lexbeach]

Hi all!

I just wanted to post and say that this book really helped me tremendously. I picked up a copy about a year after my twins were born (conceived with the help of clomid), and became totally determined to ttc #3 without clomid, following the advice in the book. I had kidney yang and spleen qi deficiencies. When we started ttc, I had already cut out caffeine, but I cut out sugar as well. It was hard at first, but after a few weeks, you really do stop craving it. I tried to eat small snacks often to keep my blood sugar consistent. I started seeing an acupuncturist who specialized in fertility and pregnancy. I don't really know which points she worked on with me. . . I went once every two weeks at first, and after a few months started going once a week. My acupuncturist also recommended that I take Ume Plum balls as a supplement. They are very alkalinizing, which is a good state to be in to get pregnant. I was also taking an herbal mix that my acupuncturist made for me. I tried to stick to the Infertility Cure diet recommendations completely for breakfast, lunch, and snacks, but didn't worry about it so much for dinner (although I stopped eating pizza and pasta).

One month after I started taking Ume Plum, and 5 months after I started ttc (and acupuncture), I got pregnant (we took two months off in the middle because I developed an ovarian cyst that my acupuncturist helped me get rid of with acupuncture and castor oil packs). It was such a great feeling to know that my body could do it without clomid (something the western doctors had said would "never be possible"). I'm now 20 weeks away from my EDD, and am just soooo glad that I picked up a copy of this book when I did.

I hope it works for all of you too!



Lex

[Dena]

Originally Posted by mamimapster

The other HARD HARD one for me is coffee-I've cut down to half caf, but I just don't know that I can go down to 0%. I haven't had any today and the head is pounding!: I coffee.

I'm right with you on that one, mama.

Before I conceived dd, I managed to wean myself from coffee by going to one cup a day of half caf, then to one cup of full decaf, and after a few weeks of that I found I didn't really want it anymore. And the best part was I didn't have any headaches...

I don't envy you trying to do this as a vegetarian. Maybe you could buy a couple of inexpensive pots for cooking some meat once or twice a week? There is Kosher organic meat out there - I know we have a small rancher near us who produces it. Best of luck to you!