Addressing the Special Needs of Gifted Children, #9 - Page 5

[annettemarie]

So, I'm curious to know what other mamas of school-aged kids are doing this summer, if anything.

Michael is going through a Harry Potter phase (well, we all are ) so we have Hogwarts Summer School. I've written about it on my LJ here, but we do different "subjects":
Transfiguration: Cleaning
Herbology: Outside/gardening
Muggle Studies: Summer Bridge workbook and journal writing
Potions: Cooking
Charms: Art and Music
Magical Games and Sports: Um...games and/or sports
Defense Against the Dark Arts: Devotions
Common Room: Either "writer's workshop" (Michael is really into writing) or an exercise video/something fun

I'm trying to teach Michael some more traditional ways of doing math. His school uses Everyday Math and he has a really hard time with it. It's very spatial--lots of grids and pictures--and he really does better with just "plain math".

Katie Grace is doing ballet and Michael is taking a Narnia fantasy art class. We're trying to get him some OT this summer and also have him signed up for some library programs.

[Karry]

Annettemarie your Hogwarts Summer School sounds like lots of fun. I have two school aged kids, and they were both in summer school. My oldest took three different classes, one was arts/crafts, one was reading and one was math. It was mainly fun stuff. My middle dc took two classes, one was getting reading for kindergarten and the other one was cooking up a story. They would read a story and then make a snack that went with the story.

Summer school just ended this past Thursday. I don't have much planned for the rest of the summer except for a vacation. We'll probably just read books and go to the science center. I also plan on putting Lucas into gymnastics again. Kacey wants to play basketball. I'm going to look into starting those activities once we get back from our vacation. School starts in the middle of August, so we only have 6 weeks of summer left. :

[ChristaN]

Originally Posted by Karry

School starts in the middle of August, so we only have 6 weeks of summer left. :

Same here -- the kids will be back to school August 17th. I agree that the Hogwarts school sounds really fun! My dds would love that and what a great way to get them to help around the house.

We have some small family get-togethers planned in the next week and I am trying to make up my mind as to whether we splurge and spend $ we really shouldn't for the kids and me to go to the Mensa World Gathering in FL this August. We are thinking about going just for two days or so. They have a neat Kids Trek program and I could go to some interesting conference sessions. It is the week before school starts, so would be a nice end of summer thing.

[oldcrunchymom]

Harry Potter School! That's awesome. I wonder if Hollis would go for that or if he would just think I was cracked. He LOVES Harry Potter.

What my kids are doing this summer:

We continue our "regular" academics through the summer, but regular means only an hour or so a day max. Hollis will be doing a "try five sports" camp through the Y in August for a week. This is the first time he's wanted to do something like that so it's pretty cool. He even showed the paper to his dad all excited about it. He is definitely starting to break out of that shell and become more social! I'm so happy he wants to PLAY with other kids and I hope he has a good time and doesn't get overwhelmed, as it's 6 hours per day. I'm putting four contact numbers (his dad, me, my mom) on the form just in case. The five sports are tennis, flag football, soccer, lacrosse, and golf. Sounds like a great mix for him. He loves all kinds of sports.

Nan is continuing her gymnastics through the summer, once a week for two hours. She's also doing ballet camp for two weeks and performing arts camp for one week in July, and cheer camp and dance camp for a week each in August. Yes, I am totally broke, but it's worth it to keep her occupied and exercising. She's been, um, a tad on the tetchy side ever since her dance ended at the end of May. I wish her studio continued dance through the summer, because then I wouldn't have to pay for all these "camps." Next summer we are going to skip the (overpriced and not her main interest) performing arts camp so that she can attend all three weeks of the ballet camp instead. But I'd already put down a deposit on the performing arts camp before I found out about the ballet one, plus the PA people snuck her in under the age limit because they really like her. So we can't really back out.

Hmm, as usual I've managed to stretch three lines of info into two paragraphs. Oops.

[oldcrunchymom]

Originally Posted by ChristaN

We have some small family get-togethers planned in the next week and I am trying to make up my mind as to whether we splurge and spend $ we really shouldn't for the kids and me to go to the Mensa World Gathering in FL this August. We are thinking about going just for two days or so. They have a neat Kids Trek program and I could go to some interesting conference sessions. It is the week before school starts, so would be a nice end of summer thing.

Christa, I think that sounds cool and I think it would be worth the splurge. And I'm not just saying that so that someone else will share my misery in dropping hundreds of dollars on "extras" this summer.

Lisa

[oldcrunchymom]

Originally Posted by Augusta

He also often prefers to play on his own which seemed very distressing to his nursery school teachers. I tried to explain he's an only child and isn't used to being around other kids all the time. They felt he was very "egocentric".

This comment by the teachers cracks me up. Isn't being egocentric the very definition of a three year old? I don't know very many three year olds who are completely selfless and philanthropic. Seriously though, that strikes me as an odd thing to say about such a small child.

Mason sounds kind of like Hollis, who also had unusual language development. Actually, neither of my kids talked much until they were nearly 3. It's a family pattern... my mom says I hardly talked either until she put me in nursery school at age 3 (September bday so newly 3) and then I HAD to. LOL.

Karry, your kids seem similar to mine in their interests/abilities. My oldest is the academic one and my youngest is the motor skills one! It's a pattern that continues today.

Can't find who asked the question about kids being afraid of animals, but Nan was terrified of ants until age 5 or so. If one got near/on her, she would freeze and let out this unearthly high-pitched shriek. She's over it now, thank goodness, and actually enjoys watching ants. My have gone to those butterfly places with their dad and liked them. I've never been in one, though.

ETA: Just read about the bike riding stuff. Hollis didn't learn to ride a bike w/o training wheels until he was 8 or 9... can't remember but I'm thinking it was probably 9. However, one day he just decided he wanted to do it and literally within 10 minutes was riding the bike by himself, steering and everything, with NO help from me. So sometimes kids just learn stuff when they want to and that's that, LOL.

[Solange]

not playing

[Augusta]

Originally Posted by lckrause

This comment by the teachers cracks me up. Isn't being egocentric the very definition of a three year old? I don't know very many three year olds who are completely selfless and philanthropic. Seriously though, that strikes me as an odd thing to say about such a small child.

Mason sounds kind of like Hollis, who also had unusual language development. Actually, neither of my kids talked much until they were nearly 3. It's a family pattern... my mom says I hardly talked either until she put me in nursery school at age 3 (September bday so newly 3) and then I HAD to. LOL.

I know! That's what I said to them. Mason does prefer his own company most of the time but he does have a few good friends that he loves to play with. He likes even tempered children who don't do a lot of squealing or aggressive playing. He gets set off by kids who cry alot or even those who are loud when they're excited etc. If there's someone he's really interested in playing with he'll play, if not he'll play alone. He's selective. Nothing wrong with that. It was like they were constantly looking for a reason to give me to get him assessed. They couldn't understand why I wouldn't want to get him assessed and treated my like I was in denial or something.
With his language they started with "Did you notice he talks alot in the third person?". He was a few months shy of 3 yrs. I asked them if they noticed that they constantly spoke to the children in the third person. "Bring that to Lisa. Pass that to Joan". They didn't see how that was relevant. Then it was "Well, he's not speaking in the third person anymore but he's echoing a lot". Okay, and..... Then it was "He's not echoing anymore but now he's talking in storybook language ie. It's time to play outside, Mary exclaimed happily" It just went on and on. Each major issue they brought up would last a few weeks or a month and then fade away but they always had something new to replace it with.
Finally I went in for a meeting with them and told them to lay it on the line for me because I was stressed out enough by their comments that I was going to the doctor. They wouldn't come out and say anything specific but many of the "red flags" they pointed out suggested autism. Absurd! Still, when someone hints at something so serious it... I was worried! Went to the doc got a referral even though the doc thought everything seemed fine. I decided after a few months of having him home and closely observing him that I wouldn't send him to the ped specialist. I think he's a spirited child who also seems to be on the gifted side. Too tough to say to what extent because he isn't one to show off his abilities. We discover things about him in passing. Eg. he'll read something we didn't know he could read or he'll say he wants 10 of something and I'll give him 6 and he'll pipe up that he needs 4 more.
My husband and I were considered in the gifted range as far as being eligible for programs in school but I didn't have any extraordinary abilities or anything. My husband is a sharp business person and is strong in math. i don't know. Mason is far ahead in ablilities from where we both were at his age. He lags behind in stuff like dressing himself, which he just started doing recently at 3.75 yrs. He still doesn't pedal a tricycle despite being very coordinated and agile, always has been. He has an aversion to using anything that marks a page. He'll start and if his line gets wobbly or anything, that's it. He's done.
This is way too long.... Can you tell I have no one who to talk to about this stuff!

Sandy

[Augusta]

My attempt at quoting didn't work out. Hmm.. what did I do wrong?

[ChristaN]

To fix your quote, change the "QUOTE] " at the end to "[/QUOTE]."

[loraxc]

"Did you notice he talks alot in the third person?". He was a few months shy of 3 yrs. I asked them if they noticed that they constantly spoke to the children in the third person. "Bring that to Lisa. Pass that to Joan". They didn't see how that was relevant. Then it was "Well, he's not speaking in the third person anymore but he's echoing a lot". Okay, and..... Then it was "He's not echoing anymore but now he's talking in storybook language ie. It's time to play outside, Mary exclaimed happily" It just went on and on.

I am so interested in this, as my DD has gone through (is going through) all these verbal stages as well, and we have been somewhat concerned about it. She actually was screened for autism by EI, and they said no way, no how, although they did notice the language peculiarities. I'm semi-convinced that this is how some kids learn language ("gestalt" learners) and that it is particularly common in gifted kids.

So, has Mason grown out of these patterns yet? I have to admit that we are having to try hard not to be annoyed by DD's I/you switching, especially since she sometimes gets it right and sometimes wrong; it makes it hard to understand what she wants. An interesting note: DD also gets other pronouns backwards, such as switching she/her and they/them, and sometimes uses "he's" or "she's" instead of his or hers. To me this shows that it isn't about "not having a theory of mind" or the stuff they use to explain autistic pronoun reversal, but about some other pronoun/grammar issue.

[EXOLAX]

Originally Posted by Solange

Oh I am right there with you on this one...



ACK! Slap me too! I just did this myself with ds the other day....no lie.....had him use him arms instead of pump and presto! worked like a charm......ohhh it is the little things in life..eh?
I have a soon-to-be 2y/o dd and she is nothing like her brother whom I speak of. Her enviroment was a lot different though for her first two years of life compared to her brother's(long story). She has had no vax'ing at all. She is waaay ahead of him physically like you speak of, but shows no *signs* of giftedness like her brother has. Yet.....that is...lol....


loraxc
Where do you live!!!!
Can we please come play!!!!

ROFL! What is it with these kids? Our youngest is nothing like her older sister either. Our eldest seems to have a natural tendency toward empathy, where her sister doesn't. I think at this young age some kids may show prominent signs of brightness and others may not come through until they are older. Our youngest is also very bright, but willfull where her sister is a "rules follower". It makes for interesting parenting.

We'd love to have you come and play! Are you anywhere near Ohio? Is anyone here?

[eilonwy]

You know, BooBah figured out how to pump with her arms almost instinctively, it was as though she was remembering how to swing rather than learning. BeanBean, at 3.5, still hasn't figured it out. Moreover, he has no interest in it, whatsoever, and is content to be pushed on a swing (if he wants to be on it at all). I haven't let BooBah near a bike yet, mostly because she's too short for any bike I've ever seen, but I know that wouldn't stop her and I'm worried she'd hurt herself badly. If anyone's ever seen a bicycle that would comfortably fit a child with an 11" inseam (at most), let me know!

[Augusta]

loraxc....

Mason is going to be 4yrs at the end of August and he's outgrown these little language quirks. The third person stuff he used mostly if he was labelling a feeling ie. Mason is so sad. He wouldn't say "Mason wants a drink of water." He would use "I" for that. He did do some I/you switching and he used some words like "should" quite a bit for a while. He might ask "Should you play with me?". If he wanted me to play with him or "Should I please have a cookie". He got he and she mixed up for a while.... big deal. I think we forget how old they are sometimes. I was telling his nursery school "He's only been alive for 3 years! Isn't it okay that he's still a bit socially awkward and hasn't yet mastered the english language?"

I think these EI people get a bit carried away with the "autism assessments" too. I know its a very common these days and I know early intervention is important but does every kid with a quirk or a bit of a language thing or trouble sharing toys at nursery school have to be screened? I had a headache yesterday and I suppose I may have a brain tumor... but probably not. I had to take a step back last March before I took him out of nursery school ( I wish I had never put him it ) and assess the situation myself. It made me realize that I'd spent 6 months worrying, going to bed with a lump in my stomach, wondering if my kid had some disorder that I was too blind to see. I wasted those wonderful months full of fear and doubt. It makes me mad, at them, at myself. Deep breath....

Anyway, I agree with you about the "theory of mind". There's a difference between not having a theory of mind and being new to using a language. We have to remember that these little people are just learning this language. There are bound to be mixups and mistakes and some of them actually become habits and take thema while to break. They need to look at these language issues and other things as a part of the total package. Eg. There was one toy that Mason would play with at nursery school. Just one. A truck (he's all about trucks). Well that turned into "plays repetitively with same toy". He wasn't sitting there spinning the wheels or anything. Mason hated going to nursery school. It was the way he coped with the transition of getting there in the morning. It was his transitional object. He has hundreds of toys at home, plays with them all, plays with them appropriately and also makes up uses for them imaginatively. But, you can't tell them that. They don't want to hear it because it clouds the picture when they've already made up their minds. He is a very introverted personality. Being around so many people, especially younger kids, crying etc is very draining to him. I would find him very quiet and wanting to be off on his own for at least an hour after I'd pick him up. Then he'd be ready to socialize with me again.

A friend of mine, who is an E.A., has a young nephew (3) who she believes should be screened for autism. She says he'll play with a crayon rolling it on the table for an hour. He'll play on his own forever, with the wheels of a car or something and not seek out his mom in the house for company or anything. He doesn't have conversations at all. He talks but it isn't 2 way. He'll walk into the house and say "Hey, how are ya?" but he'll repeat it about 30 times and not wait for an answer. He's just been trained to say it. His mom thinks nothing is wrong. That's lightyears from what Mason is like. You can ask Mason a question and he won't answer, won't answer, like he's deaf. Then raise your voice a bit louder and ask again and he'll say "Please don't yell at me mom, I'm thinking". Is there a difference?

I know these language quirks can be frustrating. Mason has always done things to the beat of his own drum. I would always say to Derek (my husband) "Why can't he just be normal for a change!". Its not so much the quirks as it is the worry that goes along with it. Is this normal? Is this okay? Should I seek some advice? The problem that I find with professionals is that they're either too quick to say "wait it out, don't be a worrywart" or "yeah, let's get out our pad and start DIAGNOSING!" I try to remember that some people are exceptional. I think my kid, and certainly the kids being written about in this forum, are exceptional. The reason exceptional people stand out so much and cause so much interest/worry/wonder is that there aren't very many of them. They aren't common, aren't seen every day. When was the last time a kid like Mason came through his nursery school? Maybe never. Maybe some of those teachers haven't seen a kid like him in their young careers. He's different so there must be something wrong with him in their eyes. I think as a mom you just have to trust your gut. That's what I'm doing..... fingers crossed!

[Augusta]

loraxc....

Mason is going to be 4yrs at the end of August and he's outgrown these little language quirks. The third person stuff he used mostly if he was labelling a feeling ie. Mason is so sad. He wouldn't say "Mason wants a drink of water." He would use "I" for that. He did do some I/you switching and he used some words like "should" quite a bit for a while. He might ask "Should you play with me?". If he wanted me to play with him or "Should I please have a cookie". He got he and she mixed up for a while.... big deal. I think we forget how old they are sometimes. I was telling his nursery school "He's only been alive for 3 years! Isn't it okay that he's still a bit socially awkward and hasn't yet mastered the english language?"

I think these EI people get a bit carried away with the "autism assessments" too. I know its a very common these days and I know early intervention is important but does every kid with a quirk or a bit of a language thing or trouble sharing toys at nursery school have to be screened? I had a headache yesterday and I suppose I may have a brain tumor... but probably not. I had to take a step back last March before I took him out of nursery school ( I wish I had never put him it ) and assess the situation myself. It made me realize that I'd spent 6 months worrying, going to bed with a lump in my stomach, wondering if my kid had some disorder that I was too blind to see. I wasted those wonderful months full of fear and doubt. It makes me mad, at them, at myself. Deep breath....

Anyway, I agree with you about the "theory of mind". There's a difference between not having a theory of mind and being new to using a language. We have to remember that these little people are just learning this language. There are bound to be mixups and mistakes and some of them actually become habits and take thema while to break. They need to look at these language issues and other things as a part of the total package. Eg. There was one toy that Mason would play with at nursery school. Just one. A truck (he's all about trucks). Well that turned into "plays repetitively with same toy". He wasn't sitting there spinning the wheels or anything. Mason hated going to nursery school. It was the way he coped with the transition of getting there in the morning. It was his transitional object. He has hundreds of toys at home, plays with them all, plays with them appropriately and also makes up uses for them imaginatively. But, you can't tell them that. They don't want to hear it because it clouds the picture when they've already made up their minds. He is a very introverted personality. Being around so many people, especially younger kids, crying etc is very draining to him. I would find him very quiet and wanting to be off on his own for at least an hour after I'd pick him up. Then he'd be ready to socialize with me again.

A friend of mine, who is an E.A., has a young nephew (3) who she believes should be screened for autism. She says he'll play with a crayon rolling it on the table for an hour. He'll play on his own forever, with the wheels of a car or something and not seek out his mom in the house for company or anything. He doesn't have conversations at all. He talks but it isn't 2 way. He'll walk into the house and say "Hey, how are ya?" but he'll repeat it about 30 times and not wait for an answer. He's just been trained to say it. His mom thinks nothing is wrong. That's lightyears from what Mason is like. You can ask Mason a question and he won't answer, won't answer, like he's deaf. Then raise your voice a bit louder and ask again and he'll say "Please don't yell at me mom, I'm thinking". Is there a difference?

I know these language quirks can be frustrating. Mason has always done things to the beat of his own drum. I would always say to Derek (my husband) "Why can't he just be normal for a change!". Its not so much the quirks as it is the worry that goes along with it. Is this normal? Is this okay? Should I seek some advice? The problem that I find with professionals is that they're either too quick to say "wait it out, don't be a worrywart" or "yeah, let's get out our pad and start DIAGNOSING!" I try to remember that some people are exceptional. I think my kid, and certainly the kids being written about in this forum, are exceptional. The reason exceptional people stand out so much and cause so much interest/worry/wonder is that there aren't very many of them. They aren't common, aren't seen every day. When was the last time a kid like Mason came through his nursery school? Maybe never. Maybe some of those teachers haven't seen a kid like him in their young careers. He's different so there must be something wrong with him. I think as a mom you just have to trust your gut. That's what I'm doing..... fingers crossed!

[Solange]

not playing

[loraxc]

Augusta, I really enjoyed your post. Thank you.

I try to remember that some people are exceptional. I think my kid, and certainly the kids being written about in this forum, are exceptional. The reason exceptional people stand out so much and cause so much interest/worry/wonder is that there aren't very many of them.

I liked this especially. You are right.

[mamaverdi]

Okay, I could NOT figure out why I wasn't getting messages anymore from the thread.

My two are Dragon Boy and Little Bear. DB is 6 going on 14. We pulled him out of the GT school when they hired a new teacher who was using an airhorn to get the attention of 12 4-6 yr olds. He's bored out of his mind at home. Most of the hsers around here are pretty fundy Christian. We're Jewish. Not such a good combo. Have searched and searched. Finally found a hs PE class that was fun...but alas, it ended in May. Local Jewish school is starting a Montessori...so we're going to try that this year and see how it goes. It will be 1st-3rd graders...so I think it will be a good fit for him. He refuses to say he can read...but says any word that I spell outloud. We're reading like crazy to him...and have already read all the LOTR books..I think (that's dh's job) and in the middle of Harry Potter. Also reading some Ralph S. Mouse and books on Volcanoes.

Little Bear is definitely very intelligent, but still not speaking at age 2. (DB was speaking at 6 months.) He has a lot of health issues that I think drag on this though. And Savannah is one of his best friends. We're trying to figure out how to work with him on learning and using more ASL.

Not really much of a GT intro...but I'm pretty tired at the moment. Dh got his tonsils out last week...and he's still being a pill.

Rynna, how did the opthamology appointment go?

mv

[eilonwy]

It went pretty well, thanks. Babies are supposed to be farsighted; Bella is significantly more farsighted than average. At this point, they're going to check on her every three months and if her eyes start to cross (that they can see) they'll put glasses on her. She seems to be following in my sister's footsteps (corrective strabismus), but she'll get corrective lenses as soon as she needs them, rather than a few months later.

This morning, I came upstairs to talk to Mike for a moment, and when I came back down, BooBah was trying to nurse Bella with her belly button. She was very upset when I told her that she could not nurse Bella, but when I suggested that she nurse a baby doll instead she said, "Ah!" and ran to get one. Super cute!

The more I read about SID and think about BooBah, the more I wonder if it's not her hearing that's the problem, but an auditory processing thing. That would explain why she doesn't seem to hear sometimes, but "Fi'wuks make me mizabuw!" and she's often the first person to know when Mike is home... I dunno. I'll bring it up after her exam and evaluation (end of the month). BooBah sees the nephrologist next week, too; since she's two years old, this should be the last of the quarterly appointments. I think we'll go to semiannual after this. Yay!

[Mamatohaleybug]

Originally Posted by annettemarie

Is it "OK" to have verbal giftedness, but not spatial? Should I try to build up the spatial reasoning skills? And how do I do that?

I haven't read the whole thread yet so sorry if I say the same things already said.

I am gifted but have a few areas (especially math-related) that I struggle with (I struggle but my scores are still above average but it really feels like a struggle for me - to the point that it stresses me out a lot). On tests I usually score very, very high in anything verbal but much more average in anything mathematical. My overall scores still land me in the genius category so my spectrum isn't as wide as your DS's. That said, I could really feel the difference and it made me doubt myself a lot. Unfortunately, I'm a perfectionist and it really impacts my life and how I think about things. I feel stupid half the time because the math doesn't come easily or naturally for me compared to everything else.

Is it possible that he has a learning disability? I would look into extra help (from you or someone else) if he has huge differences in ability and it bothers him. There are a lot of things you can do to help him. If it keeps him from functioning well or it makes him self-conscious then you might want to do some fun activities to work on this area. If not, I wouldn't worry too much.

Giftedness obviously is not something that happens across the board. Gifted people have areas where we are stronger (some to a greater extent than others) and weaker. Three of the eight children in my family growing up are gifted and we all have very different "giftedness".

Fascinating reading!