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Pulled my gun... - Page 8

post #141 of 314
Either you're misunderstanding me or you're being deliberately confrontational in a situation that doesn't warrant it. I practice gentle discipline in my life. But what I can't control are the actions of others. I will never stand idly by while someone threatens my kids. That just will never happen.

Out of curiosity, what would you do if someone threatened your children?
post #142 of 314
Just a thought here...I have seen so many threads go down in screaming flames once this tone is set. Right or wrong we all have our own opinions but I'll bet you a quarter this thread disappears after heating up a few more notches.
post #143 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by BusyMommy
Just a thought here...I have seen so many threads go down in screaming flames once this tone is set. Right or wrong we all have our own opinions but I'll bet you a quarter this thread disappears after heating up a few more notches.
Not gonna take you up on that one. I'm amazed it's gone this far. Lax moderators on this board, huh?

Just kidding, mods
post #144 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by osburnsa
I don't think the two are inextricably related. He didn't talk about pulling a gun on his children or his wife. You can't expect that the entire world follows your gentle approach to life. Be gentle with your loved ones and everyone else who merits it, but if someone isn't being gentle with you and your family is threatened, they don't merit anything gentle. The question, of course, is whether Moose's family was actually threatened. As to that question, I defer to his judgment since he was the one who was actually there.

I try to be as gentle as possible with my children, with my mother, with my spouse, my family, my friends, etc. But if someone threatens my family, gentleness flies right out the window. I want to be gentle, always. I just don't want to be "gently" standing over my child's grave. I don't want to "gently" leave my children without a mother.

Does that make me a brutal American? Apparently to some it does. But judge not lest you be judged.
:
ITA with this post!
post #145 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by mamajama
I think perhaps the OP was placed in the wrong forum then. It says this in the rules:

This is neither specifically a parenting topic, nor is it a topic specific to men.

How much force should be used to protect our offspring?


Sounds like a proper topic to me. but then I am a man and this IS the guys area and all.
post #146 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyMarmalade
Honestly, I'm still struggling that someone who threatened violence against another person is being praised. The stance of MDC is one of gentle discipline. Guns aren't gentle. Threatening to kill someone isn't gentle. What is it doing here?

The person following them also threatened violance.

Least in my area of washington/Seattle that is how it would be taken.

The cops even told Moose what he did was proper under the circumstances. that should say something for what to be expected when being chased/followed/harrassed around here.
post #147 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyMarmalade
If you don't want to be doing things 'gently' then don't join a forum where gentle is the way.

Judgement is a good thing. It's what keeps my children safe. If I judge something to be inappropriate I remove them from that situation. If I judge someone to be dangerous I don't let them near my child. Inherent in responsible parenting is good judgement. And I (along with this site) judge violence to be unacceptable.

As it should be.

I just hope your husband is never mugged or beaten in front of you.

That would be bad....
post #148 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by osburnsa
Either you're misunderstanding me or you're being deliberately confrontational in a situation that doesn't warrant it. I practice gentle discipline in my life. But what I can't control are the actions of others. I will never stand idly by while someone threatens my kids. That just will never happen.

Out of curiosity, what would you do if someone threatened your children?

To be honest? Protect them.


Either get them out of the situation and if that was not possible, do whatever nessesary to protect them.

Protect them.
post #149 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoshua
To be honest? Protect them.


Either get them out of the situation and if that was not possible, do whatever nessesary to protect them.

Protect them.
Exactly! That's exactly what I'm saying. You use your judgment in the given situation. You do whatever you can to protect your kids. Period.
post #150 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoshua
The person following them also threatened violance.

Least in my area of washington/Seattle that is how it would be taken.
Um, do you live in the same Seattle I do? The one where you get ticketed for jaywalking and traffic comes to a stop at every four-way because no one wants to go out of turn? The one in Washington?

Seriously, in THIRTY YEARS of living in Seattle I have never once felt in physical danger, and as a woman I would expect to feel more at risk, not less.
post #151 of 314
I think people say Seattle to mean the greater area. My brother got shot in Seattle but out in the 'burbs. He was driving and someone passed him, pulled over to the side and shot him w/a .44. No provocation except lots of crack in the shooter's system.
post #152 of 314
This thread is intrigueing to me, though I have not read all of it, and don't really belong in here being that I"m a mother and not a father...

I'm curious to know, for those of you who disagree with the OP, what would YOU have done in the same situation, bearing in mind that the OP did not know where the police station was, and considering all the same circumstances as his?
post #153 of 314
All though we would love a place full of peace and kind words that is not the case. We live in a very violent society so it has become Us VS Them imo. The reality is people are carrying guns, many of them illegally, many of them are criminals and could careless about you or your family. That is life, today just about anywhere. Do you think because you live in a "nice"area crime doesn't effect you? The you are naive. I personally do not own or carry a gun nor does my husband however I would NEVER in a million years take that right away from anyone. The right to get food for their family, their right to protect their family and their right to bare arms. No one is advocating violence here, what I see are families who want the rights their forefathers gave them and have the ability to protect and provide for their families.

Another thing, someone had made a crack about the US Military not protecting us, and that its some kind of joke that we think they do. I was totally offended by that comment and I am surprised more were not. Brothers, fathers, sisters, sons, daughters, and mothers are dying over in Iraq everyday serving their country, regardless what this war is or is not about you should respect those men and women. And you ask the families of people who came out of the concentration camps how they felt when they heard the Americans got them out of those horrible places and you tell those people at the WTC how the men and women in uniform weren't there for them, and you tell the people at the pentagon the same thing. Tell my baby brother who is leaving his new baby, his toddler and his wife behind this fall to put his life on the line that he isn't here to protect you and your rights.

I think dad could have handled this in another way, but do I think he is a bad person or dad for doing what he did no. Do I think he would do it differently next time, you betcha
post #154 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by gabysmom617
I'm curious to know, for those of you who disagree with the OP, what would YOU have done in the same situation, bearing in mind that the OP did not know where the police station was, and considering all the same circumstances as his?
As many others have pointed out, I would perhaps attempt something along the lines of driving my car to a well-lit public place. Dialing 911 on my cell phone would be a good choice, as I'm about 1,000,000 times more likely to be packing one of those as opposed to a gun. I know this wasn't your question, but what I would most certainly NOT do is park my car on a dead end street near to my residence and then step out of my vehicle.
post #155 of 314
Please don't misinterpret my tone and please don't assume that I'm a naive pacifist who has never been in a dangerous situation - both my husband and myself have been in deadly situations and the use of a gun wasn't something which even crossed my mind. Legally we both would have been fully within our rights to use a gun, but it's not something we would ever consider.

Obviously we both survived, and the guy is in jail again (thankfully). We only had one child at the time of the worst incident and he was in my arms. We're fortunate a non family member was with us at the time so she took the child and ran. We didn't stand idly by, but we also didn't assume we needed to solve a violent situation with more violence. It was one of the most frightening couple of hours of my life, and I'm thankful my little one is too young to remember what happened. I don't want to go into details, but if you're thinking along the lines of a stranger breaking into our home during the daytime, holding a knife to my throat, threatening to rape me with that knife then stab my eyes out ... while attempting to get his 'friend' to kill my husband - then you'd be on the right track. It was a totally unprovoked act, he doesn't even remember it because of the drugs he was mixing.

I disagree that the person following Moose threatened violence. He created fear, definitely! And it was absolutely inappropriate. But he didn't threaten violence. I also disagree that you do 'whatever you can' to protect your children. You have the right to take legal measures to protect them. As we all know, our mama/papa bear instinct kicks in if they're in danger, and I'll be the first to admit that if someone raped or kidnapped my child I'd want to be doing very illegal things to them. But that doesn't mean I'd follow through, and it doesn't mean I'd break the law if I perceived someone to be threatening them. There's a big gap between a perceived threat and a deadly situation. And I think that's something which contributes to the violence in American culture - too many people react with violence when they've misinterpreted someone's intentions. Jumping the gun only gets you into trouble and sets a bad example for your children. Having the mindset that you'll use a gun if you're threatened adds to the expectation of violence the rest of the world has from "gun totin'" Americans. Isn't the point of MDC to expore ways (as someone said earlier) to work at a grass roots level ... gentleness, peace, living differently than the rest of society for the greater good???
post #156 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinas3muskateers
Another thing, someone had made a crack about the US Military not protecting us, and that its some kind of joke that we think they do. I was totally offended by that comment and I am surprised more were not. Brothers, fathers, sisters, sons, daughters, and mothers are dying over in Iraq everyday serving their country, regardless what this war is or is not about you should respect those men and women.
A person can believe that the United States' military presence in Iraq is doing nothing to protect the citizens of the United States without automatically disrespecting the people who are doing their assigned jobs there.
post #157 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by gabysmom617
I'm curious to know, for those of you who disagree with the OP, what would YOU have done in the same situation, bearing in mind that the OP did not know where the police station was, and considering all the same circumstances as his?
I absolutely disagree with the OP, and I can tell you what I HAVE done in this type of situation. About 8 years ago I was followed home (on foot) by a strange man who I'm sure had every intention to hurt me. When I realized I was being followed I put my keys in my hand and stuck them out from between my fingers. I picked up my pace - luckily I was taller than this man and had a bigger gait and walked not to my house, but instead to a local pool hall around the corner. (I was being followed on my own block) Finding a public place, with adequate lighting, and walking in and asking for help assured that I was safe. As soon as the man following me saw that we were once again in "public", he walked away. And another person walked me home. I called the police once I was there, and was told there was nothing they could do since I had not been attacked or verbally threatened.

Women are taught all the time to be on guard for strangers and to know their surroundings. Why do we not tell our boys and men to do the same? I knew my neighborhood, and knew that there was not a nearby police station, but knew exactly where I could find other people and safety. The OP, for whatever reason, did not know where his local police station was - but did nothing else to try and protect himself from his stalkers. Guns buy false security, and the OP (IMO) is foolish to rely on bullets to do his protecting and not his brain.
post #158 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinas3muskateers
Another thing, someone had made a crack about the US Military not protecting us, and that its some kind of joke that we think they do. I was totally offended by that comment and I am surprised more were not. Brothers, fathers, sisters, sons, daughters, and mothers are dying over in Iraq everyday serving their country, regardless what this war is or is not about you should respect those men and women. And you ask the families of people who came out of the concentration camps how they felt when they heard the Americans got them out of those horrible places and you tell those people at the WTC how the men and women in uniform weren't there for them, and you tell the people at the pentagon the same thing. Tell my baby brother who is leaving his new baby, his toddler and his wife behind this fall to put his life on the line that he isn't here to protect you and your rights.
Why don't you ask my Dh, who worked at WTC on 9/11, if he thinks he needs all this "protecting". Don't invoke 9/11 because you think it backs up your arguments. You just wind up offending people who actually have some tangible connection. That's my soapbox.
post #159 of 314
The bottom line, for me, is that this is a violent country. It doesn't get less violent by using guns to solve problems. I expect better than that from my four-year-old.
post #160 of 314
A few months ago, I was driving home and much like the OP, I did something that a driver behind me did not like. Probably something silly like driving the speed limit.

He rode my tail for miles -- up on me, back away, up on me, back away. He finally got into the lane next to me, but paced me. I reached the street I needed to turn down to go home, and he suddenly shot across two lanes of traffic to get in behind me.

At that point, I ABSOLUTELY felt like I was being threatened. I don't care he hadn't spoken to me, or was "just" tailgating me. He was threatening me.

I called my husband who was at my BIL. I told him I was being followed and needed him to meet me outside. I then pulled into my brother-in-law's parking lot (he lives in the same neighborhood, but two cul-de-sacs over.) The guy followed me into the parking lot.

My husband, my brother-in-law, and his roommate all came rushing out of the house as I pulled into a parking space. (my BIL had a baseball bat). The guy took one look at these three furious men and high tailed it out of there.

My point is -- I was terrified. That man had NO reason to follow me unless it was on his mind to harrass or harm me. I was afraid and I didn't even have a child I was trying to protect. If I hadn't been able to call on my protective male relatives, who knows what would have happened.

So, that said, I cannot fault Moose for what he did to protect his child.
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