My puppy's diet....

[lisabc311]

We have decided to feed our puppy (11 week old standard poodle puppy) a combination of dry puppy food and meat/rice/veggies prepared by me.

Here is what I have been feeding him....

-The puppy food is a brand called "Maximum" that we get at Walmart. It states that it has no by-products or artificial additives.

-boiled ground beef, rice, small amount of veggies (peas/carrots), some ground flax seeds, olive oil or canola oil, cod liver oil, peanut butter, eggs
(obviously, I am not feeding all of the above at the same time- just some examples of what I might feed).

Thoughts? Critiques? Anything I am missing here?

Thanks, I look forward to your feedback.

[shannon0218]

Any reason you're doing that rather than just feeding raw?? It would be cheaper and higher quality than dry food you're feeding now?
Also, no need to cook the beef and no real need for grain.

[Sailor]

Might as well skip the boiling part and just feed the beef raw. I'd also skip the grains. They don't really need it; I personally just see it as a filler. Process the vegetables first - don't feed them whole. Otherwise, your pup won't get much out of it.

[lisabc311]

I'm not sure how I feel about feeding him raw meat. I know, I know, a lot of people here do it. But I can't get past the idea of potentially making the dog sick.

[EdlynsMom]

It wont make him sick, i promise!! I worried about the same thing, but dogs have different tolerances than we do. Think about wolves, noone cooks their food for them, right? At first he may have some runny poops, but they will go away as his gut changes, and he will progress to small, VERY easy to clean up poops.
Only thing to watch for is how he handles bones, if hes a gulper, you want to watch that he doesnt hurt himself that way. There are others here that know more about pups and raw that can help there...

[MamaAllNatural]

With my older dog I made her homemade food full time much the way you're doing. She loved it. It became very burdonsome though and I ended up giving up and putting her on kibble and the occasional canned. I really regret it now though b/c at 2.5 she won't eat raw and her teeth are not as clean and healthy as they could be and she smells like dogs that eat kibble, where you pet them and your hand smells. Well, I bathe her a lot and have incorporated much more water and canned into her meals she smells a lot better than she used to.

With our new pup though I'm so glad I learned about feeding him raw. I'm not doing it full time at this point but I hope to soon. It really is much better for them and I fed it to him starting at only six weeks old and he'd never had it. He didn't get sick at all and he knew just what to do. His coat is so healthy and shiny. He doesn't stink at all. I'm so glad to know that his body and his teeth will be in the best of shape because of it.

I agree w/Shannon that it's cheaper to feed raw than homemade food. And it is SO much easier. You just throw it down and they take care of the rest. I also have been looking around and finding it cheaper and cheaper and so I'm able to do more and more raw (as opposed to kibble w/water & canned). Whole Foods has range raised chicken backs and necks (frozen) for only 99 cents per lb. Safeway has the quarters for only 89 cents per lb. I called a meat retailer around here who has stuff pretty cheap too, including a dog food one that has a little bit of everything.

I wish I had started my older girl on raw. I'm glad I'm incorporating more and more raw into my pups diet and I hope to have him on it 100% eventually. Just my 2 cents.

[lisabc311]

So could someone explain what raw food you feed your dog?

I've obviously never done this before, so I would need detail.

[EdlynsMom]

chicken necks, backs wings, leg quarters are favorites.
some people feed pork, but some dogs have tummy issues with that.
beef shanks are good for chewing on
ground beef/chicken/turkey
eggs, shell included
yogurt

This is an awesome information site about feeding raw...
http://www.njboxers.com/faqs.htm#switch

[shannon0218]

My raw diet is super simple.
Each dog gets a chicken leg quarter (80 lbs and 100 lbs...the dogs, not the 1/4's) and a half cup of a veggie mash that I keep frozen and thaw out a weeks worth at a time.
Once a week they fast and one other day a week they just get the veggie mash (but they get 2 cups each that day).
I keep a bag of Innova EVO on hand for the days I forgot to thaw meat or just don't feel like it (seldom, we've had the same 16 lb bag of EVO for 2 mos now)
My veggie mash is pretty simple, basically whatever veggies are going bad in my fridge and I usually add a bag of spinach and some beets, 2 large tubs of yogurt, 2 lbs of regular ground beef, 2 lbs of chicken hearts and livers 1 dozen eggs, shell and all. pulverise it all in the food processor.
This gives me enough mash for about 6 weeks for the 2 dogs.

[MamaAllNatural]

Chicken backs and chicken quarters. The butcher will know what you're talking about. Also, when I buy them prepackaged at stores they say that on the package. You can also ask the person who works at the meat counter to point you to them.

*ETA: I'm not on 100% raw yet w/my pup but I have started doing the occasional egg w/cottage cheese & veggies. I also give them both flax seed oil. When I have him on only raw I'll probably do the above once a week consistently.

Shannon, that is a great idea to just grind them all up together. I'm going to do that!

[MamaAllNatural]

Originally Posted by shannon0218

Each dog gets a chicken leg quarter (80 lbs and 100 lbs...the dogs, not the 1/4's)

When I first saw this I read right past it because I already know your dogs weights. I re-read it just now b/c I was thinking of how much my pup will need when he's full grown and . That would be one big dog, needing to eat a 100 # chicken quarter!

[livinzoo]

Shannon, You feed pretty much like I do. A leg quarter each. I buy a 10 lb bag of leg quarters at walmart for $4.30. I haven't been doing much veggie mash lately, guess I should get back on that.

[MamaAllNatural]

All they need is one leg quarter per day? Just once a day? Wow. Am I feeding my pup too much? I feed him one three times per day. That or a chicken back. :

[shannon0218]

puppy needs more...remember, I'm feeding old overweight lumps who's primary function is to prevent our couch cushions from flying in the air.

[thekimballs]

Hey, I'm back! Impromptu vacation, yay!

You have to be really careful when you start screwing around with kibble. I don't generally encourage adding raw meat to kibble or in fact adding ANYTHING to kibble. The reason is that when you add meat without bones to balanced kibble, you're messing with the calcium/phosphorus balance, which is the most important one to keeping your puppy growing well.

SO--feed kibble (adding some raw chicken quarters through the week is fine) OR feed good raw (WITH BONES IN). Don't add raw OR cooked plain meat to a kibble portion.

I've fed raw for seven years and to four litters and many growing dogs. NEVER had a health problem.

By the way, you ARE feeding ADULT food, right? Standard Poodles should NOT have puppy food.

[lisabc311]

Ugh. I'm so confused.

Yes, I was adding meat to his kibble.

And yes, it's puppy food.

Why can't you feed puppy food to a standard poodle puppy? The vet did not say anything about this? She just asked what brand of puppy food I was feeding him.

[shannon0218]

Well, your breeder should have councelled you on the food to be honest. I'm not sure what specifically is the problem with standards on puppy food but I don't personally believe in puppy food for any dog unless there is a problem that requires it (not that I can think of one off hand) Puppy food was invented by the dog show set of years ago so they could have 8 mos old pups competing in the ring against older dogs. Lessons were learned the hard way.

[thekimballs]

Most vets know nothing (or next to nothing) about nutrition. They're no more trained in it than doctors are trained in it--except that a doctor is allowed to say "You should see a dietician here" and vets are supposed to be founts of all animal knowledge of all kinds.

Puppy food is not necessary for any breed, really, but it can actually do harm to large breeds. It is high-calorie and high-protein, encouraging rapid growth, when your puppy needs to grow SLOWLY. If the growth of your puppy's bones outstrips his muscles and tendons, he will end up with bone and joint problems. Even minor "growing pains" are very unpleasant for a puppy.

I don't like kibble. Period. I think anything sold at Wal-Mart is extremely suspicious, and don't like Maxximum's ingredients, but it's not my place to tell you to switch. But I have done a TON of research on canine nutrition, and I would not add plain meat (muscle meat) to any kibble. There's too much phosphorus and not enough calcium. You need to add a balanced source (a meat+bone combo) to maintain the balance.

If you stay with Maxximum, switch to adult food. If you want kibble recommendations, I can give those as well. I can also help you switch to home-cooked or raw if you wish.

[lisabc311]

Well, I will return the bag of kibble that I just bought.

I knew really large breeds like Great Danes shouldn't have standard puppy food but I didn't know that standard poodles shouldn't have it.

In fact, I was actually told to keep him on it until he is a year and a half old!

Joanna, I would LOVE any info so that my puppy can be as healthy as can be. A homecooked or raw diet sounds ideal. I guess I just feel lost as to where to even start.

I also want to make sure he isn't having any nutritional deficiences. That is why I was adding the kibble to the homemade food. I was looking at it as "insurance" that he was getting all the proper nutrients.

Thanks for your help!

[lisabc311]

Joanna, I also need to see pics of your puppies! I still hold on to my dream of a Great Dane someday!