I don't like Brazeltons take on discipline upon further reveiw..

[wonderwahine]

in his discipline book on page 7 is a little boxed question saying "can a baby be spoiled?"

I love the initial answer...its priceless!

we do not believe a baby can be spoiled before 7 or 8 months

so which is it? if I wait till 8mths will my child already be spoiled??

and this just takes the cake....

by 7 or 8mths, babies have begun to learn to regulate their states, to gather up their attention into a penetrating gaze that every parent cherishes, to soothe themselves when distressed, to settle themselves to sleep when fatiuged or overwhelmed. They will continue to struggle with these acheivements. But babies who are never allowed to soothe themselves or settle on their own - for example, infants who sleep only when put to the breast- are likely to come to depend on being soothed and settled by others.

you know, i thought thats what parenting was....soothing your child!!

and whatever happened to PARENTING your child to sleep!

I couldn't read anymore after reading this page.

[Attached Mama]

note to self - don't buy a book by Brazelton whomever he is

Thanks!

[PancakeGoddess]

Just fwiw, Brazelton is a very mixed bag. I read books by him with passages that I still think about and use after 11yrs parenting. The stuff you pasted above IS hideous, but he's one of those experts that really straddles the line, for me.

He's very sane about considering a child's developmental abilities, and I think he genuinely loves kids, unlike some authors/experts who seem to hold them in contempt.

[Dragonfly]

I hate when the word "spoiled" is used in relation to children. Food gets spoiled. Children do not. :

[wonderwahine]

out of pure curiosity i had to read more.........and pancakegoddess was right......some of his stuff is great advice, but its still a mixed bag. I guess his veiw on discipline is still much better than dobson.

I agree, i hate the word spoiled.......when someone says that about ds, i say "no, hes just loved"

[kyangel80]

I checked out a small book of his and I don't remeber everything about the book but I do remember there were some great words of advice in there. If I'm correct he is against spanking. He believes that discipline is learning. Naturally, as with every book I read, there were some things I didn't agree with. But such is life. I have yet to find one person who knows everything.

[UnschoolnMa]

Yea he seems all over the place. I guess you'd just have to take what was good and dump the rest. Of course for people just starting to look into parenting (and gentle parenting) they might not really know which is the good and which is the bad....

[sapphire_chan]

Someone told me once that he's a member here. If true, he'll hopefully learn more!

[LinzluvsGJ]

I have his touchpoints book that I got recently at a thrift sale. I haven't read it all, just skimmed over parts but was happy to see that it is anti-spanking under all circumstances, anti-CIO in what I read, and takes emotional and physical development into consideration for situations and how to handle them and what to expect out of your child at that age. It's better than some "mainstream" that I have read. There are better when it comes to GD, but when it comes to mainstream authors being accepted, I would much rather see this author in a new parent's hands than a lot of other books out there.

[pinky]

Well, I agree that there is some good stuff in Touchpoints, but there is terrible stuff too! He states strongly that a 4 month old should be able to sleep with no contact from a parent for 12 hours straight, and that it's appropriate to hold down a child trying to climb out of the crib.

And of course, co-sleeping is something that only narcissistic mothers do to meet their own needs.....

[LinzluvsGJ]

I haven't read it all yet.... guess I'll have to read it further :-/

[Jennisee]

We have an outreach program here called Baby Talk. I don't know how they get parents' names, but if you have a baby here, you will be getting their newsletters in the mail every few months. The director of the program studied under Brazelton himself, so almost everything in the newsletter is verbatim from his books. Sometimes there is information that does seem APish compared to what is mainstream here, but some of the stuff in there makes me cringe. He definitely has a "don't let that baby manipulate you" slant.

[bamamom]

dont you just love how folks portay little tiny infants plotting how they're gonna get their parents?? You would think there's a CIA of babies or somthing...

[straighthaircurly]

Originally Posted by kyangel80

Naturally, as with every book I read, there were some things I didn't agree with. But such is life. I have yet to find one person who knows everything.

I sooo agree with this. Just like I learn a lot from this site and there is a lot I don't agree with. There is no one size fits all for every parent or every child.

[TripMom]

Originally Posted by romans_mum

you know, i thought thats what parenting was....soothing your child!!

Soothing? Really?

I have touchpoints - and read it here and there 4 years ago when DS #1 was born - but generally recall liking what I read.

And I totally disagree that my primary role as parent is as "soother". In fact, I think most of parenting is about your role as teacher - and teaching self reliance and confidence. However, the appropriate time and manner for that is a totally different discussion. . . .

[wonderwahine]

when it comes to a 8mth old soothing is parenting.........an 8yr old is another story, but I still believe if they need some help to calm down even at 13, im there to help.

[TripMom]

Originally Posted by romans_mum

but I still believe if they need some help to calm down even at 13, im there to help.

I agree in some regard. However, you can't be there at 23, 33, 44, and 53 - so at some point, our role is teaching self reliance in these areas - otherwise, we end up teaching parental dependence -- and doing the child a great disservice, IMHO.

[Dragonfly]

Originally Posted by TripMom

And I totally disagree that my primary role as parent is as "soother". In fact, I think most of parenting is about your role as teacher - and teaching self reliance and confidence. However, the appropriate time and manner for that is a totally different discussion. . . .

I'm not sure I understand how you're using "teacher." If you mean it as guiding a child into his/her natural tendencies toward self-reliance and confidence, then I definitely agree. Assuming that you have to "teach" these things as opposed to assuming they're qualities that tend to develop naturally in a child who has his/her needs met (parental soothing being one of those needs, of course) and the role of the parent is to help a child make sense of them seems a little out of line with AP thinking, though. Or maybe not. I'm not so clear on what's AP or GD anymore.

About still being there for your child as an adult - barring unforeseeable tragedies, I certainly hope to still be there for my son when he's 23, 33, 43, even 53 (provided the old mind is still holding firm). I still go to my mom for input. I don't always take her advice but I always appreciate her perspective, given that she has 26 years on me. The role of elder as adviser is one that used to be expected and revered. I'm not sure why it's considered to be a negative now. Maybe we've taken the definition of co-dependence a little too far in our society.

[TripMom]

Originally Posted by romans_mum

I guess his veiw on discipline is still much better than dobson.

To even suggest that Brazelton is at all comparable to Dobson IS ridiculous - there is no comparison. SHEESH. Sorry - but I get really frustrated when I see people mischaracterize on these boards - all in the name of good mothering??

[wonderwahine]

i guess you didnt read the sentance right.........i didnt compare him to him at all......i simply said he may be off track on somethings but hes still a h*ll of a lot better than dobson....i would rather a parent get a hold of brazeltons than dobsons book. (even if they might think their baby can manipulate them).