Brain bleed and vax????

[aydensmama]

My son was born one week ago today. He has two types of bleeding in the brain, and presented with seizures because of the pressure. Does anyone have any information for this being a medical reason not to vax? The CDC says that it should be evaluated on a case by case basis for the DTaP, but yes to all other vax. We will be monitoring his neurological challenges over the next two years, so we do not know the extent of the damage to be able to research fully about certain problems vs vax. Please let me know you opinion. B4 we knew about this we were going to selective/delay vaxing.

[alegna]

I would say do not vax at all for several years for sure to see what the situation is.



-Angela

[wonderwahine]

I agree, regardless of what they say, i wouldn't vax until at least 3 or 4, until you get a real idea of the damage its caused already.

:

[bri276]

omg, aubrey's sister right? I'm a mod on BBB, and I know this is internet-creepy, but I have been rooting for aubrey's little nephew, your son! I'm so glad he's doing better! (she told us your MDC name but I didn't want to bother you before)

I say no vax, too risky, his little system has been through enough right now!

[Momtezuma Tuatara]

Originally Posted by aydensmama

My son was born one week ago today. He has two types of bleeding in the brain, and presented with seizures because of the pressure. Does anyone have any information for this being a medical reason not to vax? The CDC says that it should be evaluated on a case by case basis for the DTaP, but yes to all other vax. We will be monitoring his neurological challenges over the next two years, so we do not know the extent of the damage to be able to research fully about certain problems vs vax. Please let me know you opinion. B4 we knew about this we were going to selective/delay vaxing.

1) Why would CDC recommend vaccinating a baby who a) has had two brain bleeds and b) has seizures as a result?

They know that no baby with an evolving disorder should be vaccinated, least of all one that has had two brain bleeds.

This is what I recommend you to do in this order:

1) Get a full copy of his hospital files, including every single piece of paper.

Find out exactly what sort of brain bleeds your baby has had, and research them fully. Find out if your baby has a coagulation problem. Look at all his blood tests and note anything out of the normal and research them and find out what they mean. Believe me, I've seen so many files of supposedly normal babies released from hospital when they are anything but.

But paediatricians assume that because they were let out of hospital they must be okay. Don't ever assume that.

You need to have copies of everything about your pregnancy as well. Every piece of paper ever written.

You need to find out exactly what happened and why, and wait until you can see where your baby's health is going.

Alongside that, sure, you can research vaccines if you wish, AND email me and I will send you a copy of my book.

[patty_g]

No advice just hugs and this:

My friend's youngest son (of 5 kids) had seizures shortly after birth which they determined was due to a brain bleed. Today he is a healthy, normal, extremely intelligent 11 year old. They are nonvax but I was mostly saying this to let you know that it is entirely possible that you won't see any damage at all from these brain bleeds/seizures.

[LoveChild421]

Did he have the Hep. B vaccine at birth? If he did I would wonder if that somehow contributed to/ caused the brain bleeds? Anyone know if that is a possibility?

I would hold off on any vaccines until you know exactly what is going on and he is totally stable. Even then, I would be extra careful since many vaccines can have neurological effects.

[spero]

I'm also wondering about Hep B.

DEFINITELY do not allow the DTaP to be given.

http://www.909shot.com/Articles/gnsshake.htm

http://www.freeyurko.bizland.com/storyofbabyalan.html

"Indeed, vaccines like pertussis are actually used to induce encephalitis (experimental allergic encephalomyelitis) in laboratory animals.(6) This is characterized by brain swelling and hemorrhaging of an extent similar to that caused by mechanical injuries.(7,8)

whether or not in some instances, where a father has been accused of causing the death of his child from the shaken baby syndrome, the true cause of death was from a catastrophic vaccine reaction.

Three serial chest X-rays in the hospital showed persistent pulmonary infiltrates, which were again found at post-mortem examination, indicating a persistent, bilateral pneumonia, which had been present since birth. In addition, there were indications of brain damage from neonatal hypoxia and of failure to thrive, as pointed out and described by the defense witness. The baby was born prematurely. Not to be dismissed were the mother's observations that the baby's chest congestion never did clear after being taken home from the hospital.

Under these and other severely compromised conditions the baby was administered a total of 6 vaccines, including the DPT, Hib, OPV, and hepatitis B. at approximately 8 weeks of life. A serious, possibly catastrophic reaction to the vaccines would have been predictable under these circumstances. Almost certainly a medical consensus would agree that vaccinations would have been contraindicated and should not have been given.

The second mechanism would have been a vaccine-induced encephalomyelitis, of which the pertussis, hepatitis B. and Hemophilus influenza bacillus vaccines would have been prime suspects, either individually or in combination.

In a report of 18 deaths of neonates following the hepatitis B vaccine by the Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System, 1991-1998, hemorrhagic phenomena were common including 2 with cerebral hemorrhages, 4 with pulmonary bleeding, 1 with bloody diarrhea, and several with blood in upper airway passages.(40) A report in PostGraduate Medicine in 1973 on acute hemorrhagic encephalitis cites vaccines as one of the possible causes.(41)

It is of interest to point out that there are human reports which support this finding: of infants which developed increased intracranial pressure with bulging fontanelles following DPT immunizations.(72-74)

The implications of this study are enormous. At a time when myriads of our children are suffering from minimal brain dysfunction or related disorders, it is possible that unrecognized vaccine reactions may be occurring on a large scale and may be contributing to this pool of unfortunate children. As Greg Wilson commented: "studies such as Low's, which closely examine individual children, are extremely rare in the study of vaccine reactions and virtually non-existent in today's literature."

It is as if there has been a silent ban on studies which might reveal adverse side effects from the vaccines, and in the revealing raise questions as to whether or not, among some of the present vaccines, harmful effects may outweigh the benefits.

It is not quite true that there have no other similar studies since that of Low. There is a report from Japan in which 116 immunizations were given to 61 children with a history of febrile seizures or epilepsy, who had not had a seizure for one year. It was found that "epileptic spikes (among the children) reappeared after 10 and increased among 10 out of 73 vaccine (administrations) given for DTP or DT or BCG vaccines."(90)

[excitedtobeamom]

Did he by any chance have low platelets? If so PM me and I might have some info for you. I personally would definately delay all vaccinations until 2 and reevaluate then depending on how he has progressed and what else you have learned about his condition. So much can change in the first two years of life you might as well not add vaccinations to compound the problems.

[aydensmama]

Momtezuma Tuatara:
1. I have no idea why they would be recomended, but I read on medical reason not vaccinate on their website so I could know what to expect, my gut reaction is no, no, no! This page of responses gives me plenty of reasons as to why not.
2. I will be getting copies of everything. He is still there. I had a completely normal pregnancy, no shots, interventions, etc. Birth was ok, epidural was administered, and baby was face presentation for a little while, but I turned to my side and he turned and decended within 30 minutes. He was born in three pushes and a perfect round head. Apgar of 8 and 9. I am having problems with why. As far as my research goes, this is very rare in full term, healthy baby with atraumatic briths. He has been tested for all protein and coagulate problems, and they all came back as normal. He was also tested for hemophelia (sp?). I will continue researching!

Thank you to all the moms who responded with hugs or advice!!! This page has helped me with my gut feeling of why I should not vaccinate this little guy at all. If I were to find out why this happened to my perfectly normal babe, then I may reavaluate, but probably not!

PS skellbelle, thanks for the qoutes!!!!

[aydensmama]

Also, no Hep B vaccine was given, he was with me and my husband in our room from birth to first seizure. He was given vit K though.

[excitedtobeamom]

Did he have low platelets at all?

[aydensmama]

what test shows low platlets, I will ask at the hospital tommorrow.

[excitedtobeamom]

The CBC I believe will show it. My DD had an uneventful pregnancy and then a condition that could have caused brain bleeds and seizures.

[QueenOfThePride]

Low platelets is also called throbocytopenia, which is how it may be listed in the medical records.

[Momtezuma Tuatara]

Aydensmama, Two things.

I was on the Yurko case, and their baby should never have been given any vaccines in the first place. Yet another case where a baby that wasn't normal was assumed to be normal and shot up as per routine. Unlike you, the pregnancy was also fraught with issues, and the baby was in NICU for a week after birth with serious problems that were never fully investigated. While skelle's quotes are very pertinent, in that the vaccines can do this to normal babies as well, I just wanted to clarify that.

Okay, starting today, here is what I want you to do. When you go in next, ask for a print out of all his tests since birth. Don't accept no for an answer. Don't be intimidated if they say "Oh, you won't understand what they mean!" and if they say that, give a small suppressed smile with a twinkle in the eye, raise one eye-brow and say "Really? I'll have them please even if you take me for a stupid. "

That comment is straight intimidation tactics and don't be put off, if they throw it out there.

Until you see his whole files and look at all the tests, you won't know for sure what the story is. One of the things I have found in USA cases I've done, is that often the doctors don't seem to understand that an abnormal finding isn't something to brush off. Often they are brushed off, and the docs say "That doesn't matter" when probably what they really means is "I don't know what that means so I will ignore it." The best way to find out, is if you see a test result.

If you see anything that has an H or an L or is outside the normal range and has either * or ** or *** next to it, then you can do one of two things. You could scan the page in an e-mail it to me, or you could go back into hospital with a copy of those tests, bail up the paediatrician and ask ever so sweetly, "Can you please explain to me why this test is out of normal range and what happened inside him to make it that way."

There are several tests I want you to specifically look for. (But I want you to get every single one, regardless) They are:

On the bacterial tests, any tests positive for gram negative bacteria. From what you've said, that would be doubtful, but lets eliminate certain things first.

All coagulation tests, in particular

Fibrin Split Product = I expect this to be high.

INR and APPT. Also Prothrombin time:

http://www.frca.co.uk/article.aspx?articleid=100101

I would like to see the whole chemistry profile, as I don't believe they will be normal.

I'd also like to see the hematology.

If you really want, then I'm happy to review all the files and tests, but to do that I'd need all the clinical notes, nurses notes, absolutely everthing. Given that I live a long way away from you, it won't be cheap to send me the file, which I'd imagine will be at least half an inch thick already....

But I will do whatever I can to help you find out if there is a reason, and how best to make an informed choice.

[mamaverdi]

Face presentation can cause brain bleeds. Brain bleeds can lead to seizure activity. It could be as simple as that. But MT is a world of information and help. I would do what she is suggesting.

Children with even questionable neurological status should never be vax'ed IMNSHO.

mv

[Momtezuma Tuatara]

My first son was face presentation and it didn't cause bleeding. But I can see how that could happen, particularly if the baby was "manhandled"...

[mamaverdi]

Also though it depends on the particularly angle of the neck, yk?

I'm not saying "face presentation causes bleeding"; I'm saying it can.

mv

[aydensmama]

Thank you so much. They will have his whole file availiable at discharge. You are right, it is actually more like an inch thick. I will be taking you up on the offer for helping us. My husband is going to scan the file onto a disk, can we send that over. We will probably have all of this in the next couple of weeks.

Thanks again everyone, I have somewhere to start as of now!