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What do you think of this trend? - Page 5

post #81 of 281
I have only one positive thing to say about the name "hooter hiders" it's easy to remember!
post #82 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenie
You cut off my sentance! I'm not talking about that. I'm obviously an awful person for feeling like nursing shouldn't be an act of defiance. Nurse your baby! I do all the time. But, don't look around at people passing by like you *want* them to say something!

All I'm saying is that this attitude gives BFing a bad name. At this point, I just want people to leave me alone when I'm feeding my child. I don't want anyone staring me down or saying nasty things to me, and I think that giving people the stare down isn't going to speak good things of Lactivists and nursing moms in general.
I know I cut off your sentence. Because it doesn't matter how you qualify "looking around" - if you are to the point of wanting to critique and shame nursing women for the expression on their face and the direction their eyes are pointing, you have gone all the way past reactionary to full-blown paranoia. Your interpretation (projection) of why the woman may be "looking about" is your problem. Women are free to participate in society without having to strike some special demure/compliant pose in order not to be harassed. That's even if what you are postulating actually happens, which we all know it doesn't. The real problem is hostile strangers staring down nursing mothers, not vice versa.
post #83 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by alegna
WHY on earth would it give breastfeeding a bad name for me to hold my head high while I nurse my child? I honestly do not understand. Maybe that's a nervous mom and that's how she feels confidant. Maybe the baby is like my dd and if you look at her she won't go to sleep- I have to pretend she's not there if I want her to go to sleep nursing.

Shame on me. I nurse my child however and whenever and wherever she needs to. And what's more, I LOOK AROUND.

Good god people. This is part of the problem.

But ya know what? No one has EVER said anything negative to me about nursing my child. Not once. I don't care if they don't notice or are too intimidated by my demeanor. I give off the feeling of no one can mess with me and no one does.

-Angela
Look. You are completely misunderstanding me. I never said put on a burqa. I never said hide your head in shame. I never said that anyone HAS to wear a cover, and I never said that everyone should hide out in the bathroom. NEVER SAID ANY OF THAT!

I am simply sudjesting the idea that you nurse discreetly. Offending people isn't a good way to help society to be more BF friendly.. I don't think that you should comprimise your child's comfort to do so, either.

All I'm saying is that in public, a person should show consideration for those around them. Just don't pull up your shirt for all the world to see. I'm not taling about a quick lift-n-lach, I'm talking about a Mom with a ZZ cup letting it all hang out. If you want to do that, it's totally your right. Of course it is, I mean, why wouldn't you want to show the world that you are making the best decision for your baby? I just don't think that it's totally appropriate to bust it out and have no respect for those around you.

I mean, the huge hairy man on the beach doesn't have to cover up. He can wear a latex speedo if he really wants.. And hey, the naked body is beautiful right? Why doesn't he have the right to bare it all? If he's comfortable with it, and his hairy plumber's crack is comfortable with it, and he's proud of all 350 of his pounds, than why should he take consideration for anyone else?

Maybe you don't like my analogy, but you know what? That's your right.
post #84 of 281

I'm with Greenie

I don't use nursing covers myself. I don't feel comfortable in them - they are just extra crap on me when I'm already super hot with a sweaty babe on my tit.

BUT - THAT'S ME!! OTHER MOMS MAY FEEL DIFFERENT, AND THAT IS THIER RIGHT!!

Noone on this planet is the same - we all have different comfort levels.
If there is a mom who prefersnursing covers FINE! Let her!

Personally if I had the large boobs of my mother I WOULD use a nursing cover since without specialized nursing clothing almost the entire boob would be exposed when nursing. For some ladies thats reality. If they nurse sans cover, more power to 'em. If they nurse with a cover THATS COOL TOO.

As I stated I don;t use a nursing cover - but neither is my boob exposed. I don't go to great extents to make myself "modest" or whatever word you choose while NIP but if I look down and seethat the side of my boob is poking out or the top is exposed up to my neck - well I'll coiver it.
WHY? - Because I'm feeding my kid not stripping down. If my kid was not attached to my boob I wouldn;t be showing that much. While I'm nursing my kid I will allow for a but more exposure - but not past MY OWN COMFORT LIMIT.


And thats what it breaks down to folks - INDIVIDUALS with INDIVIDUAL COMFORT ZONES.

geesh.


and to really really stir the pot on this one:
I'm going to add that there are times and places when I think a nursing cover, a blankie, or a great nursing top are VERY appropriate. IE. places where stuff more important (shock!!) than nursing my baby is going on.
a funeral, a wedding, church/place of worship, graduation etc.



Also I have been witness to the defiant "i'll nurse however where ever" momma and it is not an attitude that gives BF or NIP a good name.
Specifically a woman who sat down cross legged on a hopscotch pad, undid her jumper,flopped out her whole ginormous boob, leaned back and let her 1 yr old have at it. She was naked from mid torso on up, and her toddler wasn't really "eating" - more liek snacking. Poppign on and off etc.
She was giving everyone the "stare down".
ugh.

I'm no prude, and I have nursed like that at home. But COME ON. It was far from necassary. That defiant look at me what ya gonna do about it attitude is the kind of lactivism I refuse to partake in.
post #85 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenie
I am simply sudjesting the idea that you nurse discreetly.
How dare you suggest how I nurse my child.

-Angela
post #86 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by wryknowlicious


and to really really stir the pot on this one:
I'm going to add that there are times and places when I think a nursing cover, a blankie, or a great nursing top are VERY appropriate. IE. places where stuff more important (shock!!) than nursing my baby is going on.
a funeral, a wedding, church/place of worship, graduation etc.
Ummmm . . . my baby really doesn't care what's going on when he gets hungry. All he wants to do is eat and all I do is feed him. No fumbling for something to make it "appropriate." And at all these events, shouldn't people be focused on the event and not on my child eating?
post #87 of 281
I'm torn about the coverups. I wouldn't use one & I think that they along with blankets, etc. make nursing more obvious and like others have said, how many people are now going to demand that everyone use one? But, and thats a big but, I'm all for anything that would make it easier for someone to nurse. Just what will the social ramifications be?
post #88 of 281
I'm of the opinion that 99% of the indiscreet NIP horror stories one reads online or in the press took place nowhere but in the writer's imagination.

And even if they weren't....SO WHAT?
post #89 of 281
To me, the point of lactivism is to get rid of the notions that there's a right way and wrong way to nurse in public. Do it how you need to do it. Do it if you want to do it. Don't do it you don't feel comfortable.
post #90 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by fek&fuzz
And calling them "hooters" makes them seem like they should be hidden. Why not call them Breast Blinders, or Nummy No-sees, Discrete Double D's...
They are also sold (exact same product, same compay - you choose the label) as Bebe Au Lait.
post #91 of 281
I used one with my 3rd and I think it actually caused a hindrance in my BFing success. I always HAD to be covered, and even though it was easier to use than a blanket, it was still stressful getting it out and on while I had a hungry baby to feed. Now I am so FREE, and nursing is so much more relaxing and wonderful!!
But . . even though I don't like what it does for the "NIP CAUSE" (the whole thing about it HAVING to be discreet). . . I figure that if it is the one thing that'll make a mom NIP, then it's a good thing!!
post #92 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenie

I am simply sudjesting the idea that you nurse discreetly.
What? What is the meaning of the verb "to sudjest"?

Quote:
All I'm saying is that in public, a person should show consideration for those around them. Just don't pull up your shirt for all the world to see. I'm not taling about a quick lift-n-lach, I'm talking about a Mom with a ZZ cup letting it all hang out. If you want to do that, it's totally your right. Of course it is, I mean, why wouldn't you want to show the world that you are making the best decision for your baby? I just don't think that it's totally appropriate to bust it out and have no respect for those around you.
Oh gawd, not the dreaded hanging ZZ cups! The world shudders in horror! Of course if it was a tidy little silicone-enhanced D cup, no one would even think to complain.

It is not "disrespectful" to look a way other people don't like. I feel like gagging when I see a boy in those "man capri" pants and a Taz the Tazmanian Devil t-shirt, yet, are they being disrespectful to me? No, they're just wearing the clothes they want to wear.

Oh wait...they're MEN! They're allowed to be unsightly because they don't police and nitpick the crap out of each other the way women do! Well, unless of course...

Quote:
I mean, the huge hairy man on the beach doesn't have to cover up. He can wear a latex speedo if he really wants.. And hey, the naked body is beautiful right? Why doesn't he have the right to bare it all? If he's comfortable with it, and his hairy plumber's crack is comfortable with it, and he's proud of all 350 of his pounds, than why should he take consideration for anyone else?

Maybe you don't like my analogy, but you know what? That's your right.
No, I don't like your analogy, because one, yes hairy men who you find unattractive DO indeed have a right to exist with or without your aesthetic approval. Two, what on earth does the existence of men you find visually unappealling have to do with...let's get back on track here...MY CHILD EATING LUNCH???? Answer...

NOTHING!!!
post #93 of 281
Look. Everyone who is attacking discression is not understanding me. I mean 'You' in the "whoever is reading this' way.. Not the 'specificially YOU' way. You can nurse your kid anywhere, any way. I don't really give a crap how you nurse your baby. You can do it on a plane, in a train, on a boat, crossing a moat. You can do it in a box, with a fox, in a house, or with a mouse. Makes no difference to me.

As much as anyone might not like to hear it, just because it is your legal right to do something doesn't mean that you should. You have to understand, there are more than one cause that I am involved in, and with all of them there is this huge paralell.

There are those who are thinking about joining the cause. Still on the fence. Then there are the ones who are more 'middle of the stream' and then there are the 'extremists'. For example, I used to post on a peta board. Because I started eating eggs again during my pregnancy, I "might have well as stopped being vegetarian". That's the kind of response I got. Nevermind the fact that I bought organic, family farmed eggs... I was still ousted by the 'fundamentalist' vegans, and they pushed me away. It also turned off a lot of people new to vegetarianism and turned them away.

I've noticed much the same thing happening here. Don't be so extreme in your beleif that you turn against those on your same side. Just because I think that a nursing mother shouldn't sit topless and nurse their baby in public (which I know is a rarity) doesn't mean that I think you should hide your head in the sand.

There are times where I don't use a cover, and there are times that I do. There are times that I need to have that to keep Elias focused on his task at hand or he'll sit and pop on and off for 45 minutes. I don't want everyone seeing my breasts, and I'm sure no one wants to see them either...

I'm not going to argue anymore. This is my opinion, and thinking that these incidents are a figment of someone's imagination is false. I've seen moms letting way too much hang out. I get uncomfortable with someone I don't know exposing their breast to me. Whether you feel like the breast is a sexual organ or not, 99.9% of America does. There is nothing that anyone can do about it.

Acting like this only tears Lactivists further apart, and alienates moms who don't feel comfortable nursing without a cover. I don't think that showing common courtesy to those around you and being modest in your nursing is a bad thing at all.. I wouldn't pull up my shirt and flash my breasts EVER, so why would I do it just because my child has to eat? I want to feed him and be done as soon as possible when I'm in public. It's not something that I personally want to draw out. That's just me, though.

So, in conclusion, I'm not going to argue anymore. This is my opinion. I like to be discreet, I don't want everyone seeing me. I have a lot of people giving me support for my decision, and that's good enough for me.

Love and peace, and lots of support to all!
post #94 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenie
Look. You are completely misunderstanding me. I never said put on a burqa. I never said hide your head in shame. I never said that anyone HAS to wear a cover, and I never said that everyone should hide out in the bathroom. NEVER SAID ANY OF THAT!

I am simply sudjesting the idea that you nurse discreetly. Offending people isn't a good way to help society to be more BF friendly.. I don't think that you should comprimise your child's comfort to do so, either.

All I'm saying is that in public, a person should show consideration for those around them. Just don't pull up your shirt for all the world to see. I'm not taling about a quick lift-n-lach, I'm talking about a Mom with a ZZ cup letting it all hang out. If you want to do that, it's totally your right. Of course it is, I mean, why wouldn't you want to show the world that you are making the best decision for your baby? I just don't think that it's totally appropriate to bust it out and have no respect for those around you.

I mean, the huge hairy man on the beach doesn't have to cover up. He can wear a latex speedo if he really wants.. And hey, the naked body is beautiful right? Why doesn't he have the right to bare it all? If he's comfortable with it, and his hairy plumber's crack is comfortable with it, and he's proud of all 350 of his pounds, than why should he take consideration for anyone else?

Maybe you don't like my analogy, but you know what? That's your right.
I don't like or dislike your analogy; it makes no sense is all.

And I really, really don't like the implication that its less acceptable for a woman with large breasts to "let it all hang out" or somehow more disrespectful (by your definition) than it is for a woman with small breasts. What does the size of the woman's breast have to with anything?
post #95 of 281
Quote:
I am simply sudjesting the idea that you nurse discreetly. Offending people isn't a good way to help society to be more BF friendly.. I don't think that you should comprimise your child's comfort to do so, either.
Can you clarify - are you stating that women who aren't "discreet" while NIP are also compromising their child's comfort? Or are you saying that the child's comfort is the #1 factor and trumps discretion?

My problem with "discretion" is that it is subjective. That's why I think we need to focus on the mother/child pair and what is comfortable for their dyad. There are moms who post on this very board who might have been more comfortable with a "hooter hider," but whose children are NOT OK with them - and those moms are some of the women "defiantly nursing with their full breast exposed." They're doing it that way because it's far less disruptive than battling with Babe over whether or not the breast is completely uncovered or etc. Bottom line is, baby needs fed. And if a baby doesn't give a HOOT about "discretion" or "modesty," sometimes that means that mom is put in a situation where to meet the "discretion" expectations of others around her, she either needs to *wean* or to stay at home for the duration of her bf relationship with her child. Delightful options, no??

My sister's ILs' definition of "discreet" is "in the back bedroom, with the door closed." There is a substantial % of our USA population who think that "discreet" means "Pump a bottle if you insist on bf, so we don't have to see it when you're not at home with the curtains drawn." And, there are some people who think "discreet" has a wider range of meaning. But believe me, I could NIP with absolutely nothing showing at any point to anyone, and *someone* would think I was still being indiscreet simply because I had bf outside the privacy of my home.

Greenie's description of "discreet" would probably work for most of us posting here (in terms of how we bfip, roughly anyway) -- but it won't work for all of us, and that's not something necessarily that the *mother* has chosen, but something that their child's bf behaviors have caused. And frankly, I don't think that there's anything wrong with "indiscreet" nursing. It's feeding a baby. There are breasts involved. There is nothing sexual involved. Anyone who has a problem with it - can get over it. I honestly think there's as much negative subtext involved in a woman wearing a "Hooter Hider" as there could be in a mom "unfastening her jumper and nursing topless." Truly. Either way, people are going to be offended or read something into the situation which may or may not be there.

The bottom line is - is mom comfortable? Is baby comfortable? Does this work for them? What other people think doesn't matter. There are lots of people who think that we should CIO our children, but it doesn't mean we do. There are lots of people who think eating organically or trying to live sustainably is Kooky. But we still do it. Why should it matter to me/my child(ren) that there are people out there who persist on seeing bf as sexual, and ff as the ideal? That's certainly not the sort of logic/rationality which I can bow towards. Especially since, IME, it's always been far more "discreet" for me to lift and latch, or NIP in a nursing top, than to use a blanket or etc.

My goal isn't to horrify the people around me with a "how nude will she go?" show. But if I have a child who nurses "indiscriminately" I'm not hiding at home to appease people who think that's beyond the pale for NIP.
post #96 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenie
All I'm saying is that in public, a person should show consideration for those around them.
The comfort of the people around me is not my responsibility.

My responsibility is myself and my baby, who at times might be hungry or need comforting when I am in the company of others. My right and responsibility are to feed my child wherever, whenever and however I like.

If you have eyes, avert them. If you have legs attached to your torso, use them to walk away. Don't judge. Don't comment. Don't discriminate. Look away or walk away. Because that's your responsibility to remove yourself if something bothers you. Don't put the onus on the nursing mom.

(i'm talking about the general you, not the specific you...)
post #97 of 281
and i have to add that i am so disappointed by the mention of things like "zz" breasts. how rude, offensive and discriminatory against those nursing mamas that have large breasts. that doesn't mean me personally but one of my best friends deals with this, and my heart goes out to her and i admire her courage in this day and age.

i wish that we lived in a culture that mamas with breasts of all sizes, with babies of all ages, could freely nurse their babies whenever, whereever and however they choose without fear of reprise or discomfort. it seems from some of the comments here that us women are as much to blame to perpetuate this non-acceptance, judgmentalism and conditionalism. so sad.
post #98 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by elanorh
Can you clarify - are you stating that women who aren't "discreet" while NIP are also compromising their child's comfort? Or are you saying that the child's comfort is the #1 factor and trumps discretion?
Okay. What I mean is this:

#1 Priority - Baby's comfort
#2 Priority - Mommy's comfort
#3 Priority - Everyone Else's comfort

I do think that there is a balance that should be in place, that's all.
post #99 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidspiration
and i have to add that i am so disappointed by the mention of things like "zz" breasts. how rude, offensive and discriminatory against those nursing mamas that have large breasts. that doesn't mean me personally but one of my best friends deals with this, and my heart goes out to her and i admire her courage in this day and age.

i wish that we lived in a culture that mamas with breasts of all sizes, with babies of all ages, could freely nurse their babies whenever, whereever and however they choose without fear of reprise or discomfort. it seems from some of the comments here that us women are as much to blame to perpetuate this non-acceptance, judgmentalism and conditionalism. so sad.
I have large breasts, so I'm talking about myself here. If I had a B cup, I'd be so happy! I could nurse, probably never need a cover, and everything would be fine. That's not the case. I'm not discriminating. Women with smaller breasts don't have the problem like women with larger breasts do. That's all I was saying.
post #100 of 281
There's a mom who posts here who talks about "The mythical right to 'not be offended'" -- she even has an essay about it which she posts sometimes.

I guess that's what this comes down to for me --- NONE of us have a right to not be offended. We have a right to safety. We have all kinds of legal rights. We even have a right to tell someone who's offending us that we're offended. BUT there's no protection out there to make sure we're never offended.

I am offended by people who talk with their mouths full of food.
I am offended by people who wrap themselves up in the American flag to justify things.
I am offended by people who litter.
I am offended by people who swear and/or use derogatory language towards others, especially children/women.
I am offended by our neighbors across the street who smoke outdoors and whose cigarette butts blow into our yard.
I am offended by the fact that our (dear sweet) overweight neighbor persists in wearing tube tops, deep into the winter [and actually concerned about her financial wellbeing too - surely that's why she does so?].
I am offended by people who think bf is dirty, gross, sexual, etc.
I am offended by people who cough or sneeze (or pick their noses) and then handle produce at the grocery store.

I am offended by a lot of things. But other than advocating and discussing their behaviors with people, there is *nothing* I can do (well, I think in some places there are anti-littering laws I could invoke) ....

I think there are far more "offensive" behaviors which people engage in every day than feeding their children via breast. Some of them listed above. But there is nothing I can do about it.

I am sure there are things I do which offend people too - some reasonably (telling the same story over and over ) - some not so reasonably (singing off-key in church). The thing is, it is inconcieveable that women should have to bow all the time to all the imaginary "offenses" some could take to their behaviors - although we as women are raised to think that it's how we should live our lives, it's just not reasonable. A perfect example is this thread -- some people are just as offended by women covering up while NIP, as others are about women NOT covering up to NIP. How do you please both? You don't. You do what works for you/your family and move on.
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