Paying for things at public schools - Page 9

[lauren]

Please remember to post respectfully and to follow the UA in all posts. Thank you!

[chefpaige1]

I was surprised at how much I was spending on school pictures! Each child has them taken twice during the school year, and once during each soccer season. That's 4X per year each child! The cheapest package is $15. I've bought them when I couldn't really afford to because I didn't want my child to be the only one missed when they are being passed out at school/soccer.

And I've given up on the fundraisers. I'll give them each a $5 bill to use as a donation, I don't want overpriced wrapping paper or whatever.

I wanted to comment on the locker fees. I think this is just an excuse to make a buck. I own a dance studio. Every other children's activity that I've ever seen (gymnastics, kindermusik, dance classes, etc) charges a yearly registration fee. Everyone justifies it by saying that it helps pay insurance. Well, being a studio owner who pays insurance, I can tell you that the registration fee is bs. They all use it as a way to get free money. Don't pay it? You won't be allowed into the class. I refuse to nickle and dime my students for ridiculous fees that I don't want to pay as a mom.

[MsElle07]

Originally Posted by aniT

I am sorry, I meant misrepresented. And the fact I am referring to is the power being on intermittedly in your school. While it is a fact that this is true, you left out the part where this was due to STATE WIDE rolling black outs that affected homes, businesses, and schools without discrimination throughout the state.

I did not misrepresent this fact. I stated quite clearly that this was the case. I am saying that the school did not have any backup generators whatsoever, as neighboring districts did, and as schools across the country did.

And unlike you suggest, they lasted for hours, and school was never dismissed.

[writermommy]

Originally Posted by lilyka

. they say things like "Crayola markers! Not Rose Art! "

.

I have to admit that I thought asking for crayola crayons was stupid until yesterday. We went to Friendly's for dinner and the girls were given little packs of Rose Art crayons to color with. By the end of the meal, more than half had broken. They really are bad. We use Crayola at home and we've never had this problem with breaking crayons so I know it wasn't the girls. WHen I taught K, we did the communal supplies thing and I would just put new crayons in the baskets as needed. At the time, I thought the kids were breaking the crayons, but maybe they weren't.

[LizD]

Yeah, I'm really all for consistency and quality in supplies. It makes a difference, especially when the children are small- even an unconscious difference. But my experience is with private Waldorf schools, where it isn't an issue because the school provides all the same crayons, pencils, books to write in, etc.

[lilyka]

Originally Posted by hellyaellen

btw, po-dunk=rural,usually lower income; might be a southern thing

the first time I heard this is when my friend had her baby. They called him "po-dunk". cause he was so small i always thought it was just the funniest cutest nick name. Its always refered to just smal little towns with nothing exciting going on.

[kittywitty]

Originally Posted by mamato2boys

Yikes! That's some very negative stereotyping you're engaging in. IMO it's pretty common that high school students with cars are simply that, nothing more. :

I agree. I know many of my friends who had cars in high school were responsible for getting to work after school, or picking up their siblings. Very few people did these things, and they were often the ones that dropped out as soon as they could at 16 anyways.

[kittywitty]

Originally Posted by MsElle07

Have you asked at each and every school you've seen if they have a backup generator? Do you look in the boiler rooms to confirm? We have them at every school in the district I teach in now, and as I mentioned, at a neighboring CA district.

Also, so what if you've never seen them? Is it right for children to sit in the dark? What point are you trying to make?

All of the schools that I have worked at or attended, including very low funded podunk schools had back up generators. And yes, I do know for a fact. They were explained to us after drills, during training, and during the rare power outage from tornadoes and bad thunderstorms.

I just can't believe that there are schools that don't have them when even the crappy schools I've been to had them! They were old schools, so is it mainly new schools that aren't using them?

[kittywitty]

Originally Posted by Kaitnbugsmom

Rural- sort of {college town, in the center of a 'diamond' of other college towns of various sizes... High school enrollement last year for the city school was 702, average daily attendance was 669.. {browsing the lunch menus for the week on the school corp's site, so I checked the 'about us' tab}

lower-income- Compared to California probably. According to our city homepage, the average during the last census was $123,000/year

southern- I.wish. west central Indiana

Close to home.

I just moved from East Central IL. Hiya neighbor!

[aniT]

Originally Posted by dnw826

I just can't believe that there are schools that don't have them when even the crappy schools I've been to had them! They were old schools, so is it mainly new schools that aren't using them?

None of the schools I went to as a kid or that my kids have gone to have had them. I have been there during power outages. You can't even call because the phone systems are down. It might just be a locational thing. There really is no need to have them. As I have said before if it is out for so long the kids are sent home and there are plenty of windows in the classrooms so they are not sitting in the dark.

Also the schools I have gone to and my kids have gone too do not have halls. The classrooms open to the outside. (Well some of my schools did have halls but also had back doors in each classroom that opened to the outside.) So there is really no need to light up hallways when the kids would be exiting through the other door anyway.

The school's I went to were probably built in the 60's (maybe 50's). (which my dd attended for 3rd grade and they still didn't have generators.) I would say the majority of schools they attended were built in the mid 80's however.

It is possible that the school my oldest DD will be attending this year has one. I don't know. But it is a two story building that opens halls with no outside access for the classrooms. I also think it is a kinda old building. But this is in Oregon and not California where I was orginally saying I have never seen a school with generators.

[Kaitnbugsmom]

Originally Posted by aniT

$123,000 a year is considered lower income?



People sure have a lot of misconceptions about California. Very few people I know make even half of that amount.

Dh and I got to talking about the financial stuff last night {we're half-heartedly house hunting. We can't move yet, and we would really rather spend a couple years in an RV before we settle in somewhere} We decided that's the sick thing about this place. The university is included in the census. Professors make around 90K & up, which skews things. The biggest non-university employers {Subaru subsidiaries & suppliers, and a union shop that does Ford and GM} pay between 8.50/hr-22.50/hr {team lead at the union shop, maintence at the Subaru shops} So while the census says that, in reality it's probably closer to 20K-28K. {on his income alone, since I'm a self-employed WAHM and my income is harder to 'average', we clear about 16K after taxes from his civilian employer and another 1K from the military}

WRT school pictures. they do the twice a year thing here too, and you have to be there for and buy a package in the fall pics to be in the yearbook {still don't get the whole yearbook in Kindy thing, but I digress} $13 apiece this go round. Spring pics will be another $15 each.. egads.

[BlueIrises]

Elementary School Teacher barging in...

I think if many of you that are complaining about the tissues, baby wipes and handsoap ever worked in an elementary classroom for a week or even a day you would have a very different outlook on the need for both products in a classroom.

It is one thing to clean up you own child's poop, urine, boogies, vomit and blood but to clean up after 24 little ones that are of no relation to you is not only gross but also very unsanitary. And I love children and I am very hands-on...I am constantly patting, high-fiving, hugging and physically showing my students praise for their great work/accomplishments but I am the one they come to when they are bleeding and crying. Am I to turn away a crying child b/c I have no tissues to keep their boogies at bay...no way...I'll give them the hug they need but then I want a tissue to clean my shirt up with. When a bloody nose comes my way, I don't jump on a chair and scream for them to go the nurse, I get them the tissues and baby wipes they need and comfort them...exposing myself to who knows what, something or maybe nothing. Against my wishes, I was mandated to get the Hep-B vaccine in order to teach b/c of the high risk of coming in contact of blood in the classroom. I nervously spent the beginning of this PG worried about the constant exposure to Fifths disease and the fear of losing the PG which took so much effort to conceive. Having baby wipes, tissues and soap helps keep everyone healthy. Is it the best thing for the environment, no...but is it good for the learning environment, absolutely. A healthy child, leads to a healthy classroom and a healthy classroom leads to a healthy teacher. I tell my students this every year when we do our hygeine lesson every Sept. Keeping your hands clean keeps the supplies clean and this keeps your neighbors clean. If you don't want to miss out on school and don't want a substitute, then everyone has to wash their hands. It keeps us all healthy.

I have been teaching for 8 years. I've taught in the poorest inner-city schools of NYC and I now teach in a very nice middle class suburban school.
I have taught Pre-K, 1st, 4th and 5th grades. I've had children pee on my lap, vomit on my shoes, sneeze boogies on me, get their blood on me, and much more. Not all classrooms have sinks or bathrooms. It is illegal to leave the classroom unattended to clean up these little messes. And the teacher isn't the only one exposed...there are the other children in the class who are exposed too.

"My dd has to bring in a box of klenex personally i think that is so silly i mean why cant they use toilet paper just like i did when i had to blow my nose."

This quote is absolutley ridiculous! Have you ever seen a child with allergies or a cold sneeze...fluid are flying out everywhere, much of which they try to catch in their hands...You want them to leave the classroom, which means using their snot filled hands to turn the door know, push open the bathroom door with those same hands to go get some toilet paper? Now every person who uses those doors is exposed to those germs. YUCK! Not to mention the amount of time children would be distracted from the constant outflow to the BR. Having tissues and baby wipes in the classroom allows the child to clean themselves up while still being able to hear all that is going on in the class. It keeps all attention on the classwork and not the opening/closing of the door.

It is extremely frustrating when parents don't send in items such as tissues and soap, but their children freely use these items when necessary. Is it unfair that the budgets no longer allot enough funds to keep these supplies on hand, ABSOLUTELY. Maybe the solution is to attend your school board meetings and have your voices heard. It is disgusting how many programs and items are deleted from the itinerary each year but God forbid anyone touch the athletics department. This is b/c parents let it happen. You as parents have control over the way funds are spent...you elect the board members, that is if you vote in those elections...and as the saying goes...the squeaky wheel gets oiled first.

I am not saying that supply lists aren't long and expensive, but what parents don't send in the teacher usually picks up. When I worked in the city, we were given zero supplies. I started off every Sept spending anywhere from $500-$800 to get all the supplies my students/classroom needed. And that is just for the intial start up. Although the school I am in now orders some basic supplies, I still spend my own money to provide a great learning experience for my children. I'm still spending about $250 + prior to school starting and by the end of the school year that amount reaches close to $1000. And I am happy to do it because I love my students and I want them to have a great schoolyear.

To those that compare homeschooling to public schooling...you can't compare the costs. There are many things at home that make great substitutes for items needed in the classroom. Plus the amount of students is fewer...and again they are your own children, family boogies just aren't as icky as stranger boogies. We've all had mothers who licked their fingers and wiped the jelly off our faces, but would you do that to someone else's child...no...you would use a tissue or baby wipe.

Okay, I'm off my soap box...you can stone me now!

[BlueIrises]

Originally Posted by MsElle07

No, because other families will be bringing in the Kleenex. We easily go through 20 boxes a semester. When a kid has allergies or a cold, they can use half a box during a class period. Also, consider that several kids are often sick at once and you have several open boxes at a time.

Really, is Kleenex a big deal? Parents are begrudging bringing in Kleenex? Geez, we do have problems in education...

Well said! I find it very difficult to digest that one box of Kleenex is going to overset the family budget! I challenge the person who keeps saying her child doesn't use the community tissue box b/c she uses hankies to go in and observe the classroom during cold/allergy season. Kudos to the poster who said it is about building community!

BTW, 24 boxes of tissues doesn't last past February here in NY. When the students go home for Feb break, they usually get a letter for more tissues b/c we are out due to cold/flu season...plus not all parents sent in tissues to begin with...

Originally Posted by moondiapers

See I totally HATE that. My kid's supplies should be in HER desk. My dd went to private school last year. Everything except for the box of kleenex was HERS and kept in her desk with her name written on it. And there weren't any brand requirements. We were only asked that we buy quality and to make sure to AT LEAST have a box of crayons with 24 colors, markers with 24 colors etc. I really liked it that way because it was her stuff and if she needed to bring some of it home to finish an assignment she could. I didn't have to buy doubles of everything to have some at home too for homework.

Children's desks don't always allow for all their supplies to be kept in their own desks. Other supplies are colloected to make sure they last the entire year. I collect several items, not all, from the students on the first day of school. They are each required to bring in 25 pencils. I collect all of them. I've tried to leave them to the students but the children misplace them, lose them, chew on them, break them and come Winter vacation, no one has pencils. However, by collecting them, I take on the responsiblitly of sharpening and "providing" 40 pencils day. There are two bins and in/out...the students trade broken pencils for sharpened ones and they never have to say they don't have a pencil to use. This system has allowed me to never have to request for additional pencils to be sent in. There is no room in their desks to store the multi-pack of post-its or looseleaf paper. I collect it and keep them on a shelf for everyone's easy access. Their books and folders and pencil cases take up so much room in their desks. This totally creates an atmosphere of community...my students grow into wonderful "sharers". Sharing items and respect of other people's property are lessons that are taught. If this is addressed in the beginning of the year, you don't have issues of broken supplies or children doing w/o b/c others won't lend a helping hand.

Originally Posted by mamato2boys

Apparently my $$$ for kleenex is more impt. than the time I put into the public school??? Would my sons teacher be better off with 2 more boxes of kleenex rather than my volunteer time in the classroom? B/C I've never had one of his teachers tell me that.

How do you all suggest that I handle the ever growing list of supplies as I am apparently wrong for not bringing in kleenex and wrong for not buying name brand? I thought my compromise was a good one, we spend a bit less on supplies, I spend more time physically in the classroom helping.

The two things are not even equal. Are you saying that your volunteer time is worth a box of tissues. Instead of spending $1 on dollar store tissues or $3 on brand-name tissues, you give that "amount of time" to the classroom. This seems more like a point to prove than an economic issue. The parents who lived in shelters when I taught in NYC found a way to send in tissues when needed...IT'S A BOX OF TISSUES...let's gain some perspective here. Maybe you could look past your need to not buy tissues and think about the fact that we, teachers, are spending our own money. You are not the only one who lives on a budget. Teachers are not the highest respected or highest paid profession. I've spent over $60,000 for my education, both under-grad/grad at a state school...I don't make close to that. Come Dec, I'm dropping down to one income so I can be home with my newborn. We just get by now as 2 people on two incomes, who knows what three people on one income will bring my household. However, I still went out and spent a bunch of money for cute little first day of school gifts, arts/crafts stuff, bandaids, books, etc for 24 little ones I've never met...is it that much to ask that you help out the teacher's expense by sending in a box of dollar-store tissues?

[menudo]

$123,000 a year is considered lower income?

I said the same thing! Isn't that a HIGH income level for anywhere? OMG, I could live so nice on that! I would buy the class a years worth of tissues-name brand!

My income is...ok-subtract approximately $103,000 from that. Now add that they are sending my kids to 2 different schools due to overcrowding and I now need childcare due to half day kindergarten-and NOPE not eligible for help (Thanks GWB!) Can't quit and get welfare-quitting a job makes me automatically ineligble for some time...

Anyway, I want that income so these lists will be of no issue!

[moondiapers]

Originally Posted by BlueIrises

Children's desks don't always allow for all their supplies to be kept in their own desks. Other supplies are colloected to make sure they last the entire year. I collect several items, not all, from the students on the first day of school. They are each required to bring in 25 pencils. I collect all of them. I've tried to leave them to the students but the children misplace them, lose them, chew on them, break them and come Winter vacation, no one has pencils. However, by collecting them, I take on the responsiblitly of sharpening and "providing" 40 pencils day. There are two bins and in/out...the students trade broken pencils for sharpened ones and they never have to say they don't have a pencil to use. This system has allowed me to never have to request for additional pencils to be sent in. There is no room in their desks to store the multi-pack of post-its or looseleaf paper. I collect it and keep them on a shelf for everyone's easy access. Their books and folders and pencil cases take up so much room in their desks. This totally creates an atmosphere of community...my students grow into wonderful "sharers". Sharing items and respect of other people's property are lessons that are taught. If this is addressed in the beginning of the year, you don't have issues of broken supplies or children doing w/o b/c others won't lend a helping hand.

I later posted that there wasn't room in dd's desk either. parents proved a washtub to put their things in. They got put in the cabinet at the end of each day....I still can't afford doubles of everything. What about the student who goes home and doesn't have the supplies to complete her homework? DD frequently brought her supplies home to complete an assignment then brought them back the nest day.

[BlueIrises]

Originally Posted by Kaitnbugsmom

How can a person be arrested for not enrolling their kids in school? This has me : /puzzled... Nobody forced me to enroll my kids in p.s. it just happens to be the best choice therapy wise for my 7 y/o and my 5 y/o wants to be like her sister and so forth [she's more interested in the playground, i think, but we'll see]

A little history lesson...many of the laws that were created stating all children must attend school are over 100 years old. The laws were created during the Industrial Revolution time period when children were working in factories. Many children were forced into working in unsafe factories to help bring money home to the family. When unions began to organize and factories were deemed unsafe for children, child labor laws were created and so were laws mandating schooling. The schooling laws were instituted to keep children from either finding illegal work or roaming the streets. These laws are still on the books. Your child doesn't have to be enrolled in a public school today, but does need to be recieving some sort of schooling whethet it be homeschooling, public or private. The point of the law is to keep children safe...factories are no longer an issue in our country (since we outsource everything...sarcastic tone there) but street crime certainly is...

Okay back to summer vacation...school doesn't start for 15 more days...

[charmander]

Originally Posted by Kaitnbugsmom

Rural- sort of {college town, in the center of a 'diamond' of other college towns of various sizes... High school enrollement last year for the city school was 702, average daily attendance was 669.. {browsing the lunch menus for the week on the school corp's site, so I checked the 'about us' tab}

lower-income- Compared to California probably. According to our city homepage, the average during the last census was $123,000/year

southern- I.wish. west central Indiana

I think the poster was saying that in her city, the average yearly income was $123,00. Not that $123K would be considered low-income.

[BlueIrises]

Originally Posted by moondiapers

I later posted that there wasn't room in dd's desk either. parents proved a washtub to put their things in. They got put in the cabinet at the end of each day....I still can't afford doubles of everything. What about the student who goes home and doesn't have the supplies to complete her homework? DD frequently brought her supplies home to complete an assignment then brought them back the nest day.

I can only speak for how my classroom runs and I don't collect things that children need for home. My students keep all their own coloring/cutting supplies for this reason. I collect the pencils b/c every home has writing utensils, looseleaf (after they put a handful in their hw folders...its just too bulky to carry/store the whole package) and post-its (the children keep one pack with them at all times).

I've never had a problem with this system or with children not having what they needed for hw. We pack up together and they are told the items needed to go home. They even borrow stuff from my supplies such as scissors, come March and they lost their own...

They hardest part for the students is getting past the fancy pencil thing. It is shock to have to hand in their pencils on the first day of school when they bought the glittery, football laden pencils (even though my list says plain). But then we talk about the "value" of a pencil and after a week of always having supplies available for them they appreciate the organization I have set forth for them.

Every classroom is different...

[BlueIrises]

Originally Posted by CarrieMF

I'd be more than happy to supply the classroom with enough cloth hankies, even bringing them home and washing them here.

I think you should go into your child's class and offer up this service. Put your money where your mouth is...suggest to the teacher to do a year-long lesson on environmental responsibility. I would love to hear the results. I hope it would be successful.

[aniT]

Originally Posted by BlueIrises

The point of the law is to keep children safe...factories are no longer an issue in our country (since we outsource everything...sarcastic tone there) but street crime certainly is...

Public school are paid X amount of $ each day that your child attends school. If your child is absent because they are sick they don't get money that day. This is why schools always ask that you try to bring your child in at least part of the day if they have appointments or what not. They still get paid for a partial day.

Because of this, schools have begun fining parents when their children are out of school excessively. Generally the fines are for kids that are constantly cutting school, but I believe 100% that the fines are more about the lost ADA money than the schools generally caring about that kid.

If it was all about caring, they wouldn't call and yell at parents whose kids are legitimately out sick too often.