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Car seats? - Page 3

post #41 of 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by boscopup
Yeah, I haven't thrown out my expired infant seat for that very reason... Is there any type of carseat recycling out there? Or do they just have to go to the landfill?
You are supposed to destroy it and then throw it out... I think I am going to dismantle mine though and recycle whatever I can... Our recycling is pretty good here and they all kinds of plastics...
post #42 of 70
boscopup-NO, carseats are genearlly not recyclable, just not the right kind of plastic. Also, keep in mind that you have have headrests or high seat backs to use the Apex. If you have those, it's a nice seat though.

paxye-I would not use the Kokoon in a carseat. It's not reccomended to put anything between the baby and seat/straps b/c it can cause compression and loose straps in a crash and can void the liability of the seat manufacturer if anything were to happen to your baby. The safest thing is to find a cover that goes OVER the seat, not in it.

Sheacoby-I'm glad the pics helped. Evan was only 19" at birth so he's pretty close to your babies. AJ was longer. AJ probably would've been able to use the Safeseat till about 18 mos (maybe) and then would've outgrown it in height. Evan is our little peanut and may never outgrow it. lol I had one chunker and one peanut so I'm kind of excited to see how this one will be. I laugh and say she'll be 10# just to be different!

BathrobeGoddess-I'm sorry Britax wasn't much help, I've heard they aren't sometimes, despite having nice seats. I don't think they've ever heard of the problem b/c people don't know it is a problem, kwim? But there's no way a normal nb would come close to those stap slots. IF you really don't want an infant seat, the Cosco Scenera has low bottom slots (same as Snugride I I believe) and is only $40 at Wal-Mart right now. That's cheaper than an infant seat.
post #43 of 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by thepeach80
paxye-I would not use the Kokoon in a carseat. It's not reccomended to put anything between the baby and seat/straps b/c it can cause compression and loose straps in a crash and can void the liability of the seat manufacturer if anything were to happen to your baby. The safest thing is to find a cover that goes OVER the seat, not in it.
I had a big discussion on this on another ddc recently...
You can check it out here

The Kokkoon is a bit different than other seat covers that I have seen as it does not have any padding in the bottom part so there is no compression... It is a lot safer to use then putting a snowsuit on baby and keeps babies a lot warmer in cold climates then the covers that just go over...
If you live in a cold climate... do you put a snowsuit on baby? Do you use a few layers of clothes instead?
There is essentially no difference in a layer of clothing and the bottom layer of the Kokkoon especially since that layer is only under and not both under and over like layered clothing or especially a snowsuit... (the compression in those are scary)

I do understand your concern though and I have to say that I voice the same concern with other seat covers that I have seen... ("cuddle bag" or especially the "Bundle me")
post #44 of 70
I understand as well, but Toddlermama brouhgt up an excellent point in that there are no guidelines to regular aftermarket products like that. They can say they have crash tested it till the cows come home, but who's going to prove it and they aren't standing accountable to anyone, so IMO it doesn't matter. Like I mentioned before it can void your carseat warranty and the liability of the carseat company in case something were to happen to your child. I'm just not comfortable taking those kinds of chances. I do live where it gets cold have lived in even colder places in the past so I know plenty about keeping warm. Having the car warm ahead of time (when possible), dressing baby normal, adding a blanket over the harness and then putting the cover over the top will offer the same kind of warmth the product you posted would.

I did just notice it is a Candian product though so I'm not sure how the testing etc goes up there and maybe that letter does mean more up there, I'm not sure. It would be something you would need to call and ask the manufacturer or your carseat about.
post #45 of 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by thepeach80
I understand as well, but Toddlermama brouhgt up an excellent point in that there are no guidelines to regular aftermarket products like that. They can say they have crash tested it till the cows come home, but who's going to prove it and they aren't standing accountable to anyone, so IMO it doesn't matter. Like I mentioned before it can void your carseat warranty and the liability of the carseat company in case something were to happen to your child. I'm just not comfortable taking those kinds of chances. I do live where it gets cold have lived in even colder places in the past so I know plenty about keeping warm. Having the car warm ahead of time (when possible), dressing baby normal, adding a blanket over the harness and then putting the cover over the top will offer the same kind of warmth the product you posted would..
Well... here it is illegal to have your car running for more than 3 minutes when not in movement so heating the car up in advance is not an option... and at -30 a few blankets will not do the trick...

And yes... here we do not have the same kind of system as in the states... in Quebec anyways... no third party can be sued in the case of an accident... but maybe that is where the problem lies... it could be that there are no safety issues with certain car seat covers but the companies just want to cover their butts anyway... All I know is that I feel safer with the Kokkoon then other options and the crash safety test is a confirmation of that for me...
post #46 of 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxye
I was thinking more about my bucket too and decided to get a new one... It is not expired yet but it doesn't have the 5 point harness but only the 3 point...
Isn't it strange that the 3 point harness is still being sold at all?! The bucket for dd #1 was, and now that I know, the 5 point is obviously so much more secure.... I am just surprised that 3 point is still an option!

Oh, and my SIL mentioned that there is a program in our area where a church group takes used carseats to Guatemala with them- I'm sure assuming that getting the kids there into 'something' versus 'nothing' is better. Not sure on the exact politics! :
post #47 of 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwestmeg
Isn't it strange that the 3 point harness is still being sold at all?! The bucket for dd #1 was, and now that I know, the 5 point is obviously so much more secure.... I am just surprised that 3 point is still an option!
Someone gave us a 3-point harness Evenflo, and I absolutely could not use it. I tried it out, and it just didn't seem like it'd hold ANYTHING! Thankfully, we had already gotten a Graco Snugride with a 5-point harness. It had the paperclip style chest clip, but that was easily replaced for $5 by going to BRU and buying a new chest clip (made by Graco - same chest clip that was on their then-current Snugrides).
post #48 of 70
Well, both my boys used the same infant seat, and it's seen better days...

So since I found out two weeks ago, I'm having a girl (yeah!), I wanted her to have her own new one, and something really 'girlie' so I found the Graco Snugride, 'Giselle' model:

http://www.elitecarseats.com/Graco-S...e_071206#specs

Have to scroll down for the pic area and select 'Giselle'. It's black with a soft pink and looks so snuggly and warm for a Thanksgiving Due Date baby that will be spending most of her 'infant seat' time in cold Colorado mountain weather!
post #49 of 70
I am tossing the snugride that I had for Dory and getting a decathalon for Jack from the start. I decided it is better to wake him when putting him into a sling (knowing that he will go back to sleep) than to carry the bucket and have him wake up and then struggling with a two year old, infant and a car seat as well as any packages I might have.... it's just insane and they weigh too much. Dory has a Marathon now, and I absolutely adore it. the marathon and decathalon start at 5 pounds.
post #50 of 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by zzwhitejd
Dory has a Marathon now, and I absolutely adore it. the marathon and decathalon start at 5 pounds.
Yes, but as was posted earlier in this thread (I believe) they don't always fit a nb well. I've always heard the rule was a baby couldn't use the seat if the straps were more than an inch above their shoulders. A mom from here called and they said it shouldn't be more than just a bit above their shoulders. The bottom slots are 10", my boys were about 7.5" in torso when they were born so it wouldn't have worked for them. It does have the extra infant pad though that might help boost them some.
post #51 of 70
I'm with Paxye on this one - I'm investing in a Kokoon as well, as it can easily reach -45 here with windchill, and there's just no way to get the car warm in 3 minutes. Winters here are brutal - I've had frostbite on my hands and fingers several times now - and I have looked into all of the risk factors and overall it seems like the safest and best choice. I'm really fortunate in that my psychiatrist used to be a car seat safety engineer - he actually helped to do all of the crash testing on the bucket type seats back in the 80s - and we've talked about it and he doesn't see why it would be an issue - it's certainly a heck of a lot safer than using a snow suit on a baby...
post #52 of 70
Another option for a car seat cover that does not go under the baby at all is The Nuzzler. That's what I'm getting. I am also planning to have some rolled lambswool blankets around the baby when he's really tiny and not filling up the seat yet. The Kokhoon looks nice and cozy, but aside from the under-the-baby issue, the headrest part would also interfere with the Side Impact Protection on our britax companion. We are allowed to warm up our cars, though, so it's not as much of an issue here. I'm more concerned about the walk from the house to the car than the actual car time.

HTH!

Lex
post #53 of 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by lexbeach
Another option for a car seat cover that does not go under the baby at all is The Nuzzler. That's what I'm getting. I am also planning to have some rolled lambswool blankets around the baby when he's really tiny and not filling up the seat yet. The Kokhoon looks nice and cozy, but aside from the under-the-baby issue, the headrest part would also interfere with the Side Impact Protection on our britax companion.
There wasn't any difference for the headrests on the kokkoon and the one that was on my carseat... but I could use both interchangabely because it threaded through the same way... so I can't see how you couldn't use the Britax headrest with the kokkoon... (though I am not sure how exactly it is made since it is not a carseat that is sold in Canada)

However... on that site that you mentioned there was a cool page about car seat safety (to prove why the "nuzzler" is safe) and it says how to tell if coat that you are using is safe...

Quote:
Car Seat Safety Expert Says Coat Compression is Dangerous

Jen Ellis, a mother and certified Child Passenger Safety Technician from Meridian, Idaho, makes a point each winter to educate parents in online forums about winter coats and car seat safety. "It is unsafe to put a thick coat, snowsuit, or blanket on under the harness of a car seat," Ellis says. "In a crash the coat would compress, making the straps too loose and possibly allowing the child to be ejected from the seat." According to Ellis, the car seat harness needs to stay close to the child’s body at all times. If a coat is in between the harness and the child's body it could cause the child to be ejected from the seat. All coats and clothing will compress in a crash, but thicker winter coats and snowsuits could compress enough to allow the child to be ejected from the car seat, Ellis explained.


Check All Winter Coats for Car Seat Safety

It's easy to check and see whether a baby's winter coat or infant snowsuit is too thick to be safe in a car seat. "This test will show you how thick the coat is and how much the coat will compress during the crash," she says.
1. Take the car seat into the house.
2. Put the winter coat or snowsuit on the child.
3. Put the child in the car seat and buckle the harnesses as you normally would before car travel. Adjust the straps to the appropriate fit for your child.
4. Take the child out of the car seat without loosening the straps at all.
5. Take the coat off your child.
6. Put the child back in the car seat and buckle the harnesses again, but do not tighten the straps.
7. If you can fit more than two fingers under the harness at the child's shoulder bone, the coat is too thick and is not safe for use with the car seat.
http://www.babypolargear.com/car_seat_safety.html
I just tried the test with the Kokkoon since I had it on hand and there was no difference at all with the straps if the kokkoon if off or on the carseat... so that reassures me even moreso...

However, Now I am a bit worried about when they are older and no longer in a infant seat and need to be in snowsuits because I KNOW that their suits are too thick but they do still need to be warm... (like my 2 yo or 4 yo)

Thepeach80... what do you recommend?
post #54 of 70
I feel loved to be included! Obviously your situation in Canada is a bit different since it's colder there (though I have lived where it was -60 so I do understand) and it's illegal to warm your car (who came up w/ that rule, I'm guessing people w/ heated garages, lol). There are some better options though than some. For AJ I made his first snowsuit, it was 1 layer of fleece. Looking back I should've made it smaller (I didn't want him to outgrow it) so it wasn't quite so bunched when strapped in. Last year he just wore a coat that was fleece and windbreaker material. The boys always have their heavy blankets w/ them in the winter, especially b/c I can't warm my car up ahead of time when we leave work (they get to come w/ me). I think that helps a lot, but of course if you have to leave them in the car, they can get cold as well. Here's some advice from another website w/ some options for things other techs have found to be safe so hopefully they are. There are some options at the end specifically from Canda!

Cold Weather Links

The danger of heavy coats and car seats is that the fluff in the coats can compress and leave the harness loose. A loose harness means possible ejection or partial ejection during a crash. The more layering of fabric that you add, the more compression you will have as well, so it's important to keep that in mind as you choose your child's outfit for the car ride. The best type of infant seat cover to buy if you must use one is a "shower cap" style that slips on top of the infant seat and is held in place with elastic; there's nothing behind the harness straps at all. Don't forget to always look underneath the cover to check that the harness is secure on your child! For older kids, polar fleece is warm, comfy and thin. If you live in a very cold climate where you must wear coats, pull the coat out of the leg straps of the harness as you tighten to eliminate bulk in that area. Your kids may also be more comfortable buckled into their car seats without their coats on; after buckling, put their coats on backward for warmth. Experiment to find what works for your family safely.

Lands End Car Seat Squall Submitted by blueize
(at www.landsend.com if above link is broken; item #09465-6AE3)
This cover does have a fabric layer under the child's bum, which can compress in a severe crash; however, it appears to be a thin fleece.

Lands End Polartec Car Seat Cover Submitted by Throkmorton
(at www.landsend.com if above link is broken; item #08182-5AE7)
This cover is the preferred type of "shower cap" style cover.

Lands End Open Bottom Sport Squall Submitted by Heather (bcHOSTmurphydog77)
(at www.landsend.com if above link is broken; item #04402-5AE7)

Lands End Hooded Sport Squall Submitted by Heather (bcHOSTmurphydog77)
(at www.landsend.com if above link is broken; item #09460-1AE2)

Lands End Marinac Jacket Submitted by Heather (bcHOSTmurphydog77)
(at www.landsend.com if above link is broken; item #08642-0AE2)
This is a great jacket for warmer climates! It's fleece, but has a built-in water-proof layer that adds warmth.

Lands End Marinac Poncho Submitted by Heather (bcHOSTmurphydog77)
(at www.landsend.com if above link is broken; item #02733-2AE9)
It doesn't get better than this for car seats. Just make sure the poncho doesn't go behind the child when she's in the car seat.

The Nuzzler Submitted by Kelly (kmnmurphy)
www.babypolargear.com/infant_car_seat_cover.htm

The Car Seat Cozy Submitted by Alison (Alisonshine)
www.inventiveparent.com/carseatcozy.htm
This cover works on a convertible seat.

The Mountain Equipment Co-Op Ursus Bunting Suit Submitted by Throkmorton
(at www.mec.ca if above link is broken; Product Number: 4017-644)

The Mountain Equipment Co-Op Gustbuster Jacket Submitted by Throkmorton
(at www.mec.ca if above link is broken; Product Number: 5001-660)

The Kiddopotamus Posh Pouch Submitted by marklar05
(at www.babiesrus.com if above link is broken; search for "Posh Pouch")

The Sneek-A-Peek Submitted by jujuB.
(at www.jollyjumper.com if above link is broken; item #432)
Be sure to use it without the head hugger shown in the picture.

Infant Car Seat Covers Submitted by Jennifer (OmahaJ)
www.vtone.com/infantcarseatcovers.htm

The Britax infant seat has a special headrest that inflates to offer side impact protection, no other seat is made like it so that's why it wouldn't work w/ it.
post #55 of 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxye
However, Now I am a bit worried about when they are older and no longer in a infant seat and need to be in snowsuits because I KNOW that their suits are too thick but they do still need to be warm... (like my 2 yo or 4 yo)
We've never had our kids (now 3.5) wear coats/snowsuits in their car seats. They do sometimes wear their coats from the house to the car, but then we take them off. Otherwise, we just quickly get in the car, buckle up and then wrap them in fleece and/or wool blankets. They love being so cozy in the car. Also, they wear hats and mittens, so that helps.

HTH!

Lex
post #56 of 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by thepeach80
Cold Weather Links

The danger of heavy coats and car seats is that the fluff in the coats can compress and leave the harness loose. A loose harness means possible ejection or partial ejection during a crash. The more layering of fabric that you add, the more compression you will have as well, so it's important to keep that in mind as you choose your child's outfit for the car ride. The best type of infant seat cover to buy if you must use one is a "shower cap" style that slips on top of the infant seat and is held in place with elastic; there's nothing behind the harness straps at all. Don't forget to always look underneath the cover to check that the harness is secure on your child! For older kids, polar fleece is warm, comfy and thin. If you live in a very cold climate where you must wear coats, pull the coat out of the leg straps of the harness as you tighten to eliminate bulk in that area. Your kids may also be more comfortable buckled into their car seats without their coats on; after buckling, put their coats on backward for warmth. Experiment to find what works for your family safely.

But if you test the straps out with and without the carseat cover and there and no difference whatsoever (therefore there is no compression) then what really is the difference or danger? (since compression is the danger) Wouldn't it be better then even a small coat with minimal but slightly noticable difference in the straps and a chance of even slight compression? Also since clothing is both under and over the baby (and therefore between the baby and the straps) wouldn't that mean that even a simple layer fleece coat has more compression potential then only one layer that is only under?
Sorry... I just can;t get my head around this...

Anyways...

Here... Simple coats are not enough...
We live in a "long johns under thick pants + snowpants, t-shirt + sweater + coat, hat & scarf and very good boots that certified good down to -40 with 2 pairs of socks and 10 minutes to get each kid dressed and cross you fingers that they don't have to pee soon" climate... so I really can't see one of those options mentioned working for us... any other ideas for making them safe while keeping them warm?...
post #57 of 70
Not necessarily. Depending on where baby is in the seat and how you are using the straps wrong, it could be just as dangerous as far as head injuries (straps are to keep baby down in the seat) as having the straps too loose. Plus, I know you in Canada don't face this, but this is a warranty issue as well. Using something in a seat that isn't approved by the manufacturer voids the carseats warranty, so getting a part fixed, new replacement etc isn't an option. We also do have the ability to sue a company if our child is hurt while using a product they made, that ability is taken away if we add things to the seat that the manufacturer forbids which is generally all aftermarket products.

I guess I can't really help you anymore w/ the carseat clothing issues. I wasn't a small child when I lived in Alaska so maybe that's the difference, but I never dressed like that even when it was -60. Obviously if I was going to spend a long time outside I would, but I didn't need all that to keep warm on my walk to the car and then while the car warmed up. You could ask at car-seat.org and see if any of the Canadians there can help.
post #58 of 70
I guess when we go out it is because we are going out to play in the snow etc at a local park that is too far to walk to... so it is not just to go into the car and then into a warm place... if we are going just to the store or something however the layers that come off are the underneath layers but the snowpants and coat (hats, boots and mitts) are still needed... (of course it didn't help that our old car didn't have a reliable heater so it was often as cold in the car as out for whole trips... we just changed cars last month)

The kokkoon doesn't change the position of the child in the seat either so I don't see that as a concern...

But I see your POV of how using something that is safe is still not recommended because you would no longer be able to sue the company if you are in an accident...

ETA... I will check out the site you mentioned to see if there are any safe options for older kids that need to stay warm... thanks!
post #59 of 70
Just to add...

in your post with the list you have a "simular" to the kokkoon type of car seat cover (that only has a thin unpadded layer on the bottom)... why do you recommend that one?

Lands End Car Seat Squall Submitted by blueize
Quote:
(at www.landsend.com if above link is broken; item #09465-6AE3)
This cover does have a fabric layer under the child's bum, which can compress in a severe crash; however, it appears to be a thin fleece.
This Coat also looks like there would be a lot of compression... (or maybe it is just the picture)
Quote:
The Mountain Equipment Co-Op Ursus Bunting Suit Submitted by Throkmorton
(at www.mec.ca if above link is broken; Product Number: 4017-644)
and this one isn't availible at all anymore on either the canadian or US websites

Quote:
The Kiddopotamus Posh Pouch Submitted by marklar05
(at www.babiesrus.com if above link is broken; search for "Posh Pouch")
post #60 of 70
W/ the first one if I'm reading it right, there is no back to it, it looks like it just has a back top and bottom, but nothing in the middle back where the straps are. I probably would still say no to this for me just b/c people looking at wouldn't know the difference between this and ones that do go all the way behind. I wouldn't think if it truly had no back it would be an aftermarket product, but I would have to see it to know. ETA: O.K. I guess the person who suggest it has seen it and said it has a back, but that's not what the description says so I will definitely ask!

The 2nd one did look puffy to me too, but according to the description it's just a snowsuit made of Malden Mills fleece, so that's just normal 1 layer fleece.

http://www.kiddopotamus.com/p_fsposh.php This is the last one. Or this one. http://www.kiddopotamus.com/p_posh.php

These are just ones that have been reccomended by other techs, I haven't seen any of these products IRL, just trying to trust other techs. I will ask about that first one though.
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