Newsweek article

[mimid]

Has anyone else read it? The cover article is about the new trends in pushing 1st graders. S-C-A-R-Y! I told dh that I now have a list of questions for when we face the whole school thing. I also warned him not to be surprised if we start hearing stuff about preschool and "educational" videos. I just don't get why people push their kids like that? Reading chapter books by kindergaden? The article did mention that the UK has been trying to reverse itself since they've been pushing younger kids for years and see the pitfalls.

[Flor]

I thought it was funny/sad when the mom who had been taking her kid to 3x a week tutoring since he was 3 YEARS OLD said it really paid off because her son was the first 5 year old in his kindergarten class to read a chapter book! Wow. Break out the balloons. He had tutoring 3x a week and now he reads a few months a head of his peers. When they are forty he can say that he has been reading for 35 years, while they have only been reading for 34.5!

Ok. I think one of the problems is that we are really pushing older kids. Colleges say that the kids aren't prepared enough, so the high schools push the kids harder. They high school says the in-coming 9th graders aren't prepared, so we push the younger kids farther. I don't understand why we let colleges/high schools decide whats best. Why not say "this is what a kid knows at the end of elementary school, so the middle school pickes up here" instead of the middle school deciding what they want the kids to come in knowing.

When I was in high school, I was a "college prep" student, and I had algebra in 10th grade. Now every kid in California has to have algebra in 8th grade. In order to achieve that, the curriculum has to change for every grade lower than that. Hence, we get kindergartners who have to read, do math, write paragraphs.

I have set out to find a different path for ds. He's going to Montesorri school because I don't want standardized test (written by who knows? ) to decide what my child should learn. I want him to enjoy school, have fun, paint, take walks with his class, cook, and all that. I know he'll learn to read.


The one good thing in all this that I see is that now that we have No Child Left Behind, my district is spending money and funding our English Learner programs. Before this, we were totally on our own, with no curriculum.

[CarrieMF]

My neighbor is like that. She has pushed her kids since they were 3 making them do 20-30 minutes of homework a night. Her oldest is in Grade 3 and no further ahead than any of the other kids, in fact my dd who was not pushed and went to a non-academic playschool is ahead of her peers in some parts. Her youngest is in Grade 1 and on the first day I was in the classroom with her. She was telling the teacher that her dd does pretty good, but she doesn't read yet. The teacher looks at her and said "she's only in Grade 1". I had to laugh out loud at that one because it's so true. Her oldest who she has pushed for reading and such has never read a chapter book beyond the step one/two/three books until I bought her one for her 8th bday in August.

[mimid]

We've been planning on sending dds to a religous school, but I keep hearing the same sorts of things about those, too. I have no clue what to do. At least we have a few years until I'm going to be really pushed into a corner and can only pray that there is a better option then or figure out if I really want to tackle hs.

[rabrog]

I think letting a child learn at their own pace is the only way to do it. If they are interested in things that are above their age level, great. There's nothing wrong in fostering that enthusiasm. But tutors....yikes!!

Jenn

[Thalia the Muse]

Newsweek tends to do these fuzzy alarmist articles about "Oh my gosh, some ludicrous trend is about to ruin us all!" and then it turns out they interviewed three nutty people and one person who wrote a popular book, and that's the extent of their research. So I wouldn't take this piece tooooo seriously.

[Gendenwitha]

Originally Posted by Thalia the Muse

Newsweek tends to do these fuzzy alarmist articles about "Oh my gosh, some ludicrous trend is about to ruin us all!" and then it turns out they interviewed three nutty people and one person who wrote a popular book, and that's the extent of their research. So I wouldn't take this piece tooooo seriously.

Yeah, I've noticed the opposite in schools, more dumbing down. I remember before I had kids, I talked to my 6th grade teacher just before he retired. He said he doesn't have the kids read The Hobbit anymore in class because they can't do it, it's too hard for them. So sad, to us that was one of the highlights of 6th grade.

[Flor]

Originally Posted by Gendenwitha

Yeah, I've noticed the opposite in schools, more dumbing down. I remember before I had kids, I talked to my 6th grade teacher just before he retired. He said he doesn't have the kids read The Hobbit anymore in class because they can't do it, it's too hard for them. So sad, to us that was one of the highlights of 6th grade.

I don't know if that's dumbing down, or more kids with different issues in the same room (Resource students are more mainstreamed, English learners, too).

[udonandbroth]

My ds just started Kindergarten and I have to say, the Newsweek article struck a chord with me. I was really shocked to learn in K orientation how much they are expected to know by the end: they need to be able to read 26 words, and all kinds of maths and writing sentences, too. There's no art, music, recess, show and tell and gym is 2xs a Month. This is not the Kindergarten that I remember. I was under the impression that Kindergaten was all about socialization but I seem to be sadly mistaken. I was happy to see that article on the cover of Newsweek because I felt validated... none of the other parents at orientation flinched but I did ask the teacher about where the arts were and she said first grade. :P We would so be in Waldorf if we had the money.

[1xmom]

Reading some of these posts just makes me really how grateful I am that my dd is in a really nice public school (one of the best schools in our county). She was in K last year and although she knew alot of words and everything, she was one of the teacher's top students. However, they had recess (at least 30-45 minutes). They had "specials" 1x/week which were library, dance, gym, art and music. I was able to visit the classroom a few times and the teacher was in no way strict about school work. If a child did not finish the homework, it was really no big deal, they just completed it before recess or something. Now that my dd is in 1st grade I haven't been able to visit the classroom this year yet (except for a few minutes before lunch), but the only difference right now is that each child has their own desk instead of tables. They still have their "specials" and recess right after lunch is 30 minutes.

[boongirl]

Originally Posted by Thalia the Muse

Newsweek tends to do these fuzzy alarmist articles about "Oh my gosh, some ludicrous trend is about to ruin us all!" and then it turns out they interviewed three nutty people and one person who wrote a popular book, and that's the extent of their research. So I wouldn't take this piece tooooo seriously.

Hmm... I actually think the piece was very accurately written. I was a teacher for 10 years before dd was born, in private and public schools, in poor and rich schools. I saw the same issues in all of the schools I worked. The state testing system has pushed academics into lower grades. In Seattle's public schools, K is for most kids all day, five days a week and the curriculum resembles first grade of yesteryear. The push for academics has given many parents a complex and they are turning more and more to tutoring or academic preschools. Kumon started a program for preschool kids that is actually popular! The baby einstein videos are popular with parents who think they are giving their child a leg up and so are the baby flash cards. There is no evidence to support that these increase a child's intelligence at all but they are still big sellers in baby stores. Parents are worried that their children are not going to be able to succeed in school and they think that starting earlier and earlier will help them. They do not realize that you only need to do two things: read to your child daily and encourage your child's curiosity.

The whole thing is scary to me and that is one reason we moved to a different city where K is still only half day. I do not want my child to be pushed into academics. I want her to enjoy her childhood and her schooling because there is more to life than just academics. But, if there is still a state academic test when she is in school, I will pull her out for the test days. I do not want her to have to take that test. It kills the love of learning.

I am hopeful that the leave no child behind act will be repealed soon as it is completely problematic in many, many ways.

[flyingspaghettimama]

Yes, I agree with boongirl - although I imagine (as with anything else) a lot depends upon where you are. I think many educated, intelligent, competitive parents in middle- and upper-class areas really push schools and children and teachers for as if that will somehow make their children win the race. To wherever it is that they're going. Harvard? Trade School? Dumpster Diving? I imagine that many parents are imagining the former but still might end up with the latter. I wonder if we're going to see a whole generation of drop-out kids, who burnt out at the tender age of 11. Droppin' out of the rat race, gonna weave a few baskets.

[GearGirl]

I've said a few times in groups of parents that I don't think there should be homework in elementary school, and I swear people look at me like I have two heads, total shock. Is that really such a shocking thing to say? They will learn more withyout being overwhelmed, it just goes against everything I think is right to cram so much in that they don't have a solid base. My ds has a Fall birthday and is very young for his grade so we were back and forth on holding him back. He appeared to be at the back of his K class in reading, but then they did this little assessment that the State gives at the end of the year, and he scored the highest score on each and every section. Sure, the rest of the class might be scoring high on even second grade stuff, but he was way ahead of the game for K, and we were made to feel like he was behind, and sadly so was he. In fact he was ahead.

[Kate'smommy]

I've been thinking a lot about this article because my ds just started kindergarten in a suburban public school that was described by his preschool teacher as "fast." I went there myself but it has changed a lot. They made it clear at orientation that this was going to be like first grade was when we were kids. They were going to learn to read and write. Some people recommended we put ds in one of the school's many "developmental kindergarten" classrooms because he has a summer birthday. Several kids in his class are already six. This seems to be the way they deal with the children who can't keep up with K being the new 1st grade.
My ds is excited about the reading they have started doing, he's enjoying school, and his teacher says he's doing great. He considered the weekend reading homework fun because he was so proud of himself. They still have recess, gym, and music and they still do fun art projects and have sharing every day. It's only a half day program also. We lucked into the teacher that all the experienced moms requested. She's been there forever and seems relaxed about the academic and behavioral expectations.
However, I'm still nervous about whether ds will keep enjoying the higher expectations. Dh and I are the type to push for changes if we think there's a problem with the school. We also wonder about whether things are going well for all the children -- kids are all so different. I know there are plenty of kids in the district who have been diagnosed with ADHD, and I wonder if part of that is these higher expectations. I'm personally torn because I always wanted the district to increase expectations at the high school level, but I think they may be mistakenly focusing too much on the youngest grades.
I think homework in elementary school should all be fun and different from the usual work and only be on weekends. Learning for kids who are not even school-age should all be fun and based on the child's desire to learn new things, no pressure at all. I'm frightened that all the moms-to-be that I know are requesting those videos and even flash cards for their showers. People seem to have warped for profit the real info that the first five years are very important to development.

[ChristaN]

I was discussing this with a friend yesterday. She has been teaching for 20 years in CA. What she had to say was that, back in the 80s when she was going to school to be a teacher, it was all about individualizing education. What she has seen in recent years, in direct relation to NCLB, is the exact opposite. Every child must fit in a box. If you have a child with exceptional needs (in any way out of the "norm") that child is not going to have his/her needs met in today's ps.

We have very much seen this. My older dd, for instance, is very ahead in some subjects (as much as 8-10 yrs "above" grade level), but she works very slowly. She thinks things through and does not work as fast as expected. School has been a pretty bad experience for her. She must learn and do what is expected for her grade whether she already knows it or not. She must do X repetitions b/c that's what the teachers believe to be necessary for learning. She must get it done in X time frame whether she can do it or not. If you have an uneven child, a very advanced child, a late bloomer... basically anything that is not pretty darn close to the box NCLB expects as showing proficiency for that grade level, that child is hung out to dry.

What I see as the problem, more so than pushing (although I've come across my fair share of those parents as well), is the expectation that everyone will do something at the same age and in the same time frame. All children should be reading well by age 6; all children should be able to spit out rote memorized facts on a 30 second timed test accurately, etc. It shows no respect or understanding of individuality and it crushes the spirit of the child who doesn't live up to the expectations set of him.

[Kate'smommy]

I just had to add that today ds said he was asked to write all the numbers from 1 to 20 but he stopped at 4 because he couldn't remember how to make a 5. He said he was also asked to spell mom and dad, which he could do but I know I couldn't do on the sixth day of K. I'm hoping they don't actually expect all the kids to be able to do all this already. :

[mimid]

I'm also hearing stuff like this from parents who have kids in the few Jewsish schools we would consider sending the girls to. These young kids have hours of homework and long lists of vocabulary to memorize and the older kids have horror stories about basically learning for the tests to get into the next school. There is all this competition for the school to have high test scores to attract more students and for the kids to have high test scores to get into the schools. I talked with someone without kids and he said that he would get together with other parents and hire tutors for the different subjects and basically homeschool his kids in a group-like setting for the same amount of $$ that the private schools charge. It sounds like a great idea to me, but there aren't any parents I know of with similarly-aged kids who think it is a good idea. In fact, it mostly seems like non-parents love the idea.

[zen-ozz]

I read the article and found it very discouraging. DS just started Kindergarten this year and so far it seems reasonable. But it is full-day and I think that is too much for 5 y/o and based on the needs of parents rather then the children.

I was shocked to read about the parents who are holding their kids back from kindergarten so that they will be academically more successful. We could have started DS last year (our cut off is the beginning of december) but I felt like school is way too intense and that kids need more play and fun time. So we waited for Kindergarten to give him more of a childhood. I never once considered academics.

I just feel like if you love your child and provide a strong, healthy environment they will ultimately do fine. I could care less about Harvard or other Ivies. DH and I went to state school and we did just fine. DS may not want to go to college and that will be fine too. My job is to provide a safe, loving environment and to help provide him with the skills to make good decisions based on his own needs. The rest will take care of itself.

[udonandbroth]

:

[boongirl]

Originally Posted by zen-ozz

I was shocked to read about the parents who are holding their kids back from kindergarten so that they will be academically more successful. We could have started DS last year (our cut off is the beginning of december) but I felt like school is way too intense and that kids need more play and fun time. So we waited for Kindergarten to give him more of a childhood. I never once considered academics.

I have never considered this either, keeping kids back from K to give them a leg up on academics. But I have heard of, and encouraged, parents keeping their sons at home one more year because of maturity. All day k is hard one very young boys.