Appreciation?

[dharmamama]

Is it completely unreasonable to expect my 12 year old to show me some appreciation for the things I do for her? I am not talking about "Thanks for saving me from an Ethiopian orphanage" gratitude, which I don't now and never will expect. I am talking about simple, "Hey, thanks mom" expressions of appreciation, rather than the current "I didn't want the jelly on that side of the bread," "I wanted the pink cup," "Why do I have to carry my clean, folded laundry ALL THE WAY TO MY ROOM??" state of affairs.

Am I completely dreaming? Is it reasonable for me to tell a 12 year old that if she is flatly unappreciative she can do these things for her own darn self?

Namaste!

[aniT]

Originally Posted by dharmamama

Is it completely unreasonable to expect my 12 year old to show me some appreciation for the things I do for her?

Yes actually it is. 12 year olds don't appreciate anything.

[frontierpsych]

I don't have a teen, but I was one! Yeah, i know how some kids can be. if it were me, I'd first just try a sarcastic "YOU'RE WELCOME!" lol, my mom used to do that, I'd get the picture. Not sure what to do in the long run though.

[dharmamama]

Originally Posted by frontierpsych

I'd first just try a sarcastic "YOU'RE WELCOME!"

Yeah, I have been using a version of that.

"THANK YOU MOM for this lovely dinner."

"THANK YOU MOM for washing and folding my laundry."

"THANK YOU MOM for getting me something to drink."

It's not really sinking in ...

So if it's unreasonable to expect a 12 year old to be appreciative, is it also unreasonable to expect that she at least PRETEND she is? Because, honestly, I don't really care how sincere it is, I'd rather hear an unenthusiastic "Thank you" over a criticism or complaint any day!

I guess my parents trained me well, because I recall saying "Thank you" as a matter or course when my mom did something for me. And I still say it to this day.

Namaste!

[PancakeGoddess]

: "thank you for saving me from an ethiopian orphanage"

but really, dharma, she's still really newly here, no? Maybe she's just still protecting herself emotionally somewhat?

If you really don't mind it being a rote habit, you could approach it like that - just do some role-playing or whatever. But it sounds like you might really want some true gratitude, and that can't be forced (I know you already know that... it's awfully hard to get the ungrateful stuff from kids this age, huh?)

[dharmamama]

Originally Posted by PancakeGoddess

If you really don't mind it being a rote habit, you could approach it like that - just do some role-playing or whatever.

Yeah, that's kinda what I have been trying to do with the "THANK YOU MOM" stuff. I am not snippy or snide when I say it. I smile and pleasantly model it for her. But honestly, I really would prefer a fake demonstration of gratitude to a constant stream of criticism. Between the rude demands to do stuff for her and the complaining about how I have then done it all wrong, well, I'm starting to feel more like a doormat than a mom.

Namaste!

[BelovedK]

It's definately natural for them to be totally self centered at that age. I like the role playing idea, not as much the sarcasm (though I have done that myself) What about talking to them in the language of 'feelings' and'needs' such as:

"I spent alot of time and thought preparing a healthy meal for the family to enjoy, when my efforts go unacknowledged, I feel unappreciated because I need for my efforts to be noticed and valued"

Then you could add a request (not a demand),

"Would you be able to say thank you to me in the future?, it would mean alot to me"

Let her make her own decision on how to handle it, she'll eventually get it

[BelovedK]

BTW, I highly recommend the book 'Nonviolent Communication' by Marshall Rosenburg. It is SO helpful in finding ways to communicate with anyone.

[frontierpsych]

Originally Posted by BelovedK

It's definately natural for them to be totally self centered at that age. I like the role playing idea, not as much the sarcasm (though I have done that myself) What about talking to them in the language of 'feelings' and'needs' such as:

"I spent alot of time and thought preparing a healthy meal for the family to enjoy, when my efforts go unacknowledged, I feel unappreciated because I need for my efforts to be noticed and valued"

Then you could add a request (not a demand),

"Would you be able to say thank you to me in the future?, it would mean alot to me"

Let her make her own decision on how to handle it, she'll eventually get it

Yeah, that's probably better advice than mine.

I'm just a very sarcastic person and it's my first instinct.
It can get me into trouble sometimes....
like when child A says child B made a face at him, and I way "Well beat him up!"

.... yeah.... that works well..... :

I don't get me.

[BelovedK]

My first impulse is to be sarcastic too

[PancakeGoddess]

sarcasm is a big issue for me to work on - my 11yo has it down perfectly, thanks to all my wonderful modeling.

yk, I had another thought, dharma. That friendly prompt you give her to remind her is the same thing I do with my toddlers and preschoolers. Maybe that kind of expression wasn't an early habit for her? Or maybe she's 12! Or both....

[Dar]

I wonder how much of it is cultural. I read a blog entry a couple years ago by someone from some eastern European country, and she was surprised and even a little annoyed by the US habit of saying thank you so often. To her it was massive overkill... but really it was a cultural difference. I have no idea what the Ethiopian cultural standard is for this, but if that's the issue, it might take a while...

Have you just sat down and talked with her? I remember doing that with Rain when she was 11 or so... a lot of her responses felt very rude to me, but she didn't feel that way. We talked about some examples, and ways of saying things, at least to the point where I could just give her the hairy eyeball when she said something that felt rude or unappreciative to me, and she'd backpedal a bit.

dar

[kathirynne]

Sauce for the goose...

I try to make a real effort to show appreciation to my children when they do something. (Even something small. For instance, "Thank you for hanging up your jacket and putting away your backpack when you came home from school. The house looks so much nicer when everyone takes care of their things.") I don't always remember to do this, but I notice that the "thank yous" from my children increase when they hear me say it to them.

[Starr]

Thats a tough one. I can relate that other people having said Americans in general say thank you and other phrases so much that they are overused and lose their meaning. Not sure if this is the case here. Do your other two children say thank you on a regular basis where she could understand that its an appropriate thing to do? I like the one idea where someone mentioned telling her thank you for doing such and such chores. Maybe after doing that a few days ask her if she likes you complimenting her good behavior and then mention that it would be nice for you to be complimented for all your hard work. I think its hard because there are so many other factors in your situation. Given that she has been home a few months now the honeymoon phase has probably started to wear off, yet she is fast approaching the teenage years without being your everyday teenager. She still has a lot of catching up to do and I think learning manners is part of it. Good luck.

[aywilkes]

Originally Posted by Starr

Thats a tough one. I can relate that other people having said Americans in general say thank you and other phrases so much that they are overused and lose their meaning. Not sure if this is the case here. Do your other two children say thank you on a regular basis where she could understand that its an appropriate thing to do? I like the one idea where someone mentioned telling her thank you for doing such and such chores. Maybe after doing that a few days ask her if she likes you complimenting her good behavior and then mention that it would be nice for you to be complimented for all your hard work. .

My son is only 8 but he does a lot of complaining. He also says thankn you a lot too. What I do (when I'm a really good mom), is we keep thank you journals and share or each morning we get up and say what we are thankful for. We did it one day with my niece. I said one thing, she said the next, and my son said the next and we kept rotating. It was cool. My niece is only 6 though so I'm not sure how it would work with teens. I will say that gratitude is lacking in alot of cultures including the U.S. and I have lived in other places - it seems to be strongly influenced by family upbringing.

[dharmamama]

Thanks for all your replies everyone. I have heard that Ethiopians don't say please (which I have noticed with Desta, and which we are working on by simply saying "Pardon?" after she fails to say please), but I have not heard that they don't say thank you. In fact, the Amharic phrase for Thank you is one that I learned very quickly and heard a lot in Ethiopia.

I have talked to Desta, as has my husband, about how it makes me feel when I do something for her and she criticizes it. I have told her that if she has specific ideas on how something should be done, she can tell me beforehand or just do it herself.

Efram and Ramona say thank you fairly regularly, probably because I have taught them to. They also say it with much gusto when they are particularly pleased with something: "Oh, THANK YOU Momma for blah blah blah." I can tell a difference between the "Thank you because I should say thank you" and the "I'm really excited about what you did for me" thank yous, but I am not bothered by that. I am one of those old-fashioned people who think that people (adults AND children) should say thank you when others do something for them because it's simply good manners. Even complete silence would be better than constant criticism of my efforts. I guess I will just have to keep plugging away with the modeling and continue to remind her that I feel crummy when I am criticized for doing something for her.

Oh, and I do thank her regularly. Her morning chore is to unload the dishwasher and I always remind her with a please and thank her when she is done. If she answers the phone when I am busy or gets her sister a glass of water or whatever, I thank her. I thank her for putting her laundry away and for wiping the counter after she gets a snack. I guess it will just be a matter or time. Or I'll get to the point where I tell her that I am tired of doing things for her and being criticized for them and that she can do them herself. I'm trying to be patient. Learning to live with a brand new almost-teen is hard, and there are several small things like this that really, really bug me.

Namaste!

[MillingNome]

By the title and reading through the thread, I'm guess this is not a lack of saying thank you as much as a lack of appreciation. Thank you's are nice but it's the tone of it that matters to me. I don't care if dd or ds always say please and thank you if they can still ask nicely. Along with other suggestions, I would try to ease her into doing as much of her work as possible. At 12, most kids can take care alot of their own responsibilities. You could start by having her help fold with you so she can learn how you do that. I dunno, IMHO, I don't want to sound like a mean mom but anytime I can shift work to dd that makes sense, I do. While I love her dearly she has to learn to do it all anyway. It sounds like you have a great dd who will learn with a little gentle guidiance

I suppose a declared work strike to get her to see all you do would not fit into the spirit of a nfl place such as mdc

eta: omg- I'd forgotten Desta was only with you as of May. It might be that she is testing some boundries or limits within her new family. I would still try to ease her into doing as many of her own chores but way more slowly and with lots more patience.

[terrordactyl]

when i was 12 i was exactly the same way. i wish i could say i wasn't but i was a little brat and always just complained. they grow out of it sorta

[NiBeKa]

Wow, right up my alley. My 13 yo dd is deserving of the world's respect and gratitude and expects it. The Ethiopian orphanage owes her! But...she really is a good kid and as long as me, her dad and bros are the only ones priveleged to be a part of her all-about-me phase I'm not too mean in retaliation. :This too shall pass!
We just continue to instill our values on her headphone covered ears.

[mammastar2]

Originally Posted by dharmamama

Is it completely unreasonable to expect my 12 year old to show me some appreciation for the things I do for her? I am not talking about "Thanks for saving me from an Ethiopian orphanage" gratitude, which I don't now and never will expect. I am talking about simple, "Hey, thanks mom" expressions of appreciation, rather than the current "I didn't want the jelly on that side of the bread," Mm-hmm, really? "I wanted the pink cup," Oh really? It's in the cupboard "Why do I have to carry my clean, folded laundry ALL THE WAY TO MY ROOM??" Blank look, followed by "oh, if it's easier to get it to your room if you do the laundry yourself we can set something up"state of affairs.

Am I completely dreaming? Is it reasonable for me to tell a 12 year old that if she is flatly unappreciative she can do these things for her own darn self?

Namaste!

It sounds from your other post like you've already put your needs out there, and that she gets appropriate modelling. Might I suggest the above? Without being really nasty about it, perhaps you can make it so ineffective to get what she wants by way of her snide comments that she has to try the much more effective route of showing appreciation...