please explain

[Israel]

Hello everyone. Maybe someone can explain this to me....

How do lesbian/gay couples reconcile their gay lifestyle and children? If you choose to not be in a heterosexual relationship, why do you choose to seek the fruit of heterosexual realtions, i.e. children? Does this not seem an unnatural act?

[Nicke]

Well, maybe you can explain to me what is so unnatural about wanting to love and nurture a child, regardless the parents choice for a life partner?

[Mallory]

Seems kind of strange for a first post doesn't it?:

[Elphaba]

fruit of heterosexual relations?

come on queer mamas, where are you?

[Nicke]

Originally posted by Mallory
Seems kind of strange for a first post doesn't it?:

I thought so too.

[tara]

tara smells a troll. tara won't play.

[Rachel Fox]

Seems kind of strange for a first post doesn't it?

I concur!

[Israel]

Without a doubt I will tell you that I do have more conservative views on this. I am not ashamed of that. I am not a "troll" but I am interested in the thought process behind gay parenting. WIth so much emphasis on being "natural" in mothering magazine and these boards, I find it interesting that there is advocacy of extremely intense medical intervention in an unnatural way (i.e. conception via test tubes,etc. in a medical office is not a natural act). I think it is a cultural lie that we convince everyone that we are all equal with equal roles. Example, I as a male cannot give birth and role of dad is different than mom! Equality is definite, but we are not equal in roles. Difference in roles does not mean one is better or worse. We are taught to embrace "cultural diversity," yet everyone stands on their heads and screams at the mere metion that there is a difference between men and women. I am trying to understand the liberal mindset on these boards and thought I would be honest about what I believe and ask a question. Please tell me that you all are not "tollerant" as long as everyone is equally liberal???? My wife and I get mothering magazine but some of what I see seems entirely anti-healthy child raising. THis is my viewpoint, not necessarily that of my wifes. SHe can speak for herself.
I am looking for some balanced discussion on issues where obviously there is a differnce in opinion.

[tara]

Hmmmm... So you come here and tell us you think gay parenting is unnatural, unhealthy and unequal and then want balanced discussion? Sorry, Israel. That does not feel to me like a respectful beginning to a discussion. I'm still not going to play.

[aolwife]

Ideally, if we lived in groups and villages where each person contributed to the good of society and everyone did what they could to make sure EVERYONE was taken care of it would only matter if you could love a child unconditionally. If we were truly a loving society, all the children who are not being taken care of properly in our country would be. If we didn't care about sexuality maybe all the babies in daycare for 10 hours a day while both parents work could be in a home with a loving adult.

There are so many children out here who are in bad situations and I'm not just talking about the poor. There are more heterosexuals who go through extreme medical practices going against nature just to have a baby that they will put in daycare in 6 weeks. There are single mothers who can't qualify for state daycare who shuffle their children from babysitter to babysitter, some of whom they've never met, just so they can work enough to pay rent and put food on the table.

I personally do not believe in technical baby making (test tube babies, IVF) but I only express my opinion through life choices. I do however believe that gay couples should have the opportunity to raise a child. I am in the process of contributing to a situation where a gay couple will have the chance to bring a child into this world. I am very proud to be a part of this and I think this couple will give me a run for my "best mommy of the year" competition!

[Cynthia Mosher]

This thread was removed from the board for my review to make sure the discussion was acceptable for the board. Though I am concerned about a new member posting such a question and I have made that clear in this thread, I think this is a discussion that can be had respectfully and some may wish to take part in it, as aolwife has demonstrated in her post.

However, I totally understand the feeling that this is an inflammatory topic question with prejudicial intent and some of you may not want to be involved in it. We will be moderating it carefully and will step in if any inappropriateness occurs. If you note such before we do please let us know.

Peace everyone

Edited to add: If most of you here in the QPing community feel uncomfortable with this discussion please let us know. I am more concerned about the members of our community than I am the interests of a new member and won't hesitate to remove this discussion if that is what you'd prefer.

[mplsmom]

Thank you, Cynthia,
Israel, I am wondering if you posted similar questions in the infertility area, the multiples section (most multiples are concieved with much more 'unnatural' means than most of our childen are) and in the single parents area?? If not, why??

I am a pediatric registered nurse. Before I even thought of becoming a parent, I took care of several children of gay and lesbian parents while they were ill in the hospital. The first child was born to young straight parents, he had multiple medical problems. His birth parnents gave him up to a gay couple, they could not handle the demans of his needs. This childs dads are great. Every one loves this child, and his family. The child has so much more to expect from life because of his dads. Througout his multiple, long hospital stays, one parent was always with him - to comfort him, read to him, what ever the child needed.
The second child has two moms. She became very ill with a serious, but very curable illness, requiring a week's stay in the hospital. Her brother was cared for by friend, so both of her mom's could be with her. Again, this child was healed with help from the love and support of her moms and community.
I now work in peri-natal nursing, taking care of premature and sick babies. You would be quite amazed to see what some straight people go thru to have babbies.
I thought for many years before I had a child. Most of us do not have 'woops, I pregnant, now what' experiences. Our children are chosen, wanted, cherrished. That is a lot more than I can say about many of the children in this world.

[Israel]

No I didn't post this question in the infertility forums, etc. b/c that was not so much my intent. Though since you do ask I do have extreme reservations regarding, as aolwife said, "Baby making." In that process multiple babies are made but only one is kept and to me that does make sense. One of our friends just had in-vitro fertilization and her little baby is pretty darn cute! Sad to think of the embryos that were tossed though. That is just my opinion though b/c I think life is pretty sacred. When so many children need to be adopted it, personally, I am saddened by the loss of life it creates. As I stated in my other post I am trying to gain insight/understanding into my sister who is gay and suddenly wants a child.

My wife says I have jumped into things too quickly without introducing myself. maybe we can talk about not immunizing...? Our family is upset that we go that route.

Originally posted by mplsmom
Thank you, Cynthia,
Israel, I am wondering if you posted similar questions in the infertility area, the multiples section (most multiples are concieved with much more 'unnatural' means than most of our childen are) and in the single parents area?? If not, why??

I

[mplsmom]

"As I stated in my other post I am trying to gain
insight/understanding into my sister who is gay and suddenly wants a child."

Ok Israel, I understand now.
Why do you want (or have) children??

[sandy's family]

It sounds as though Israel your real issues are with the fact you have a sister who is a lesbian. I'm wondering if you have even asked your sister the questions you have presented here? I wonder if you have talked to your sister at all about her being a lesbian or has your religious beliefs kept you from listening? I doubt she wants your approval. If she knows you and respects your beliefs she would not expect it, however, Im sure she wishes to be respected for her decisions in her life and if that includes a family then try to open your mind and listen. Without all the issues about wasted embryos and all you have to at least think about all the children born unwanted by even one straight parent because of careless sexual encounter. Your sister wants to bring a child into the world already wanted and loved. That's really what having a child is about. The rest is all about our own inabilities to understand.

[JessicaS]

I am not homosexual but I have some feelings about this.

I think of all the children born unplanned or wanted to couples that do not even like each other by the time the child is born, children born unloved, unappreciated and it is pretty hard to feel negative about a loving couple who wish very much for a child and must work very hard to become pregnant.

I have a friend who was raised by same sex parents and she is a thoughtful, kind person who is well liked and respected by many. I wish there was more people in the world like her.

I think it is great. I wish them all the joy in the world.

[mplsmom]

Israel, Have you been able to focus your thoughts you??
Do you have a problem with your sister being a Lesbian?
Do you have a problem with others being gay or lesbian??
Do you have a problem with people other than a married man and woman having children?
Do you have a problem with people creating children when there are so many children who need homes??
Does homosexuality conflict with your political or religios beflies??

I am willing to talk about this issue, more for your sister's benifit than for your's.

Here are some web sites that you will want to visit in your journey.

http://www.lethimstay.com/index.html
http://www.rainbowfamilies.org/
http://www.familieslikemine.com/newsletter/index.php

[alexa07]

Israel.

I am not a lesbian and am raising two daughters in a fairly traditional way (married to DH). But I do not even understand your question. I love being a parent to my two DD's. It is certainly nice to co-parent with someone who is as biolgically connected to your kids as you, but its only a very small part of it.

Wanting to nurture another life has, as far as I could possibly see, no connection to one's sexual preference. Wanting a child who is biologically connected to you also seems to have no connection to one's preference, except it is of course harder if you are not in a relationship with someone of the opposite sex. Just as it would be harder if you were in a relationship with someone who could not have biological children. But lots of things are harder in life for some people, it doesn't mean there is anything wrong with wanting them or taking the extra steps that might be necessary to get them.

[bunny's mama]

i find this whole thread upsetting and out of place on these boards, especially as introduced by a new member.

i began to write a long and sincere reply to isreal's questions, but stopped and erased it because i don't see the need for anyone here to be in a position to have to defend why two loving individuals want to have children together. it's just that simple.

this has always (well, almost always) been a safe, supportive forum for queer parents. IMO, that's how it should stay.

and isreal, it's not about censoring you because you have a different viewpoint.

[sandy's family]

If you can't try to help the blind ignorance of others , opinions will never change. I say let him ask and educate him.