what about the argument... - Page 2

[13Sandals]

I've become convinced since the introduction of the chicken pox vaccine that vaccines do work. I know there are still outbreaks - but the incidence has gone down. Now, that being said - does that mean its best for society? DOes it mean that the benefit is worth the cost - absolutely not. Its only a matter of 5-8 more years before we will see college outbreaks of chicken pox - just like every other disease because there can be no doubt in anyone's mind at this point that vaccines simply do not produced lifelong immunity. the sad thing is - chicken pox is dangerous to adults and some will probably die from these college outbreaks -and then the CDC will blame it on the non-vaxers spreading it to the few whom the vaccine failed - then we will see booster shots added at the 11/12 year old check-up and before college entry....

but yes - I believe they do temporarily offer protection and I think its important that non-vaxers admit this in order to effectively shift the focus of the debate to the cost/benefit reality. I believe our arguments are more effective when we say "yes they work. no, they are not safe - no, they do not help societal health in the long-term. in fact, I suspect they make us sicker." If we could focus on this - maybe we could actually get a long-term study done on vaxed and non-vaxed populations...

[mamakay]

I've become convinced since the introduction of the chicken pox vaccine that vaccines do work.

Just a head's up...
Be careful about applying something you see happening with one vaccine to ALL vaccines.
It's not really that cut and dry. Some vaccines don't work at all, some kinda work sometimes, some work in one way, but not in other ways (which make for even larger problems) and some work fairly well.
All this IMO, of course.

[phishers3]

Originally Posted by insider

But who's making that argument?

mainly - the family... :

What is with the college outbreaks... I was reading on the CDC last night and saw outbreaks of mumps (or measles.. I forget which)... at colleges here (IA) and in the UK - links/resources for why this happens???

Additionally - A simple question why boosters? my oldest is "due" for some and I am just not taking her unless I understand the benefit (or lack thereof) since she was fully vax'd as a babe (well, in accordance with the early nineties schedule)

[mamakay]

What is with the college outbreaks... I was reading on the CDC last night and saw outbreaks of mumps (or measles.. I forget which)... at colleges here (IA) and in the UK - links/resources for why this happens???

If you keep looking around on the CDC sight you'll find that they say the mumps outbreaks were caused by the vaccine not actually working as well as they always thought.

[tjdtd]

Not really the case.

[QUOTE/]The idea of herd immunity is really that there will be less people spreading the disease, the more are vaccinated. But think about it - that's based on the premise that the non-vaxed are disease-ridden and that if there are too many of them, they will "spread" that disease to the vaccinated. How can that happen if your vaccine works? How will that screw up your antibodies from functioning? It doesn't. Imo, you have no responsibility for anyone's health, but you and your own. It's one thing to have proper health "etiquette", by staying home when you are sick or covering your mouth when you cough, but it's another to be expected to endanger yourself or your child for the perceived well-being of others.[/QUOTE]

The idea of the herd immunity is, as you almost state, that there will be less people carrying the disease. Any disease is constantly changing and growing. As it changes it can out 'grow’, so to speak, the vax designed to prevent its spread. This is the purpose of vaccinating the herd against disease. No vaccination is foolproof the idea is to retard the diseases growth so that as many people as possible are kept from being carriers of that particular type of that particular disease.

The growth and changing of disease is easily seen in the flu. Every year there is a new flu vax. This isn't because the old one wears off but because there is a new 'type' of flu that last years vax doesn't protect ageist.

Not to say that the massive amounts of vaccinations that are standard these days isn't going overboard. Certainly the sudden need to vaccinate children from non-deadly diseases is a wonderful way for drug companies and doctors to make more money from the insurance companies and us.


Never forget that medicine is a for profit business.

[Nekawa Ma]

I'm subscribing to this thread. Incredibly helpful information here, about several issues I've wondered about. Thanks to all who've posted. :