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Curious - Page 8

post #141 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by MamaInTheBoonies View Post
Or maybe, the mother just doesn't want to marry a "gangster" man and it has absolutely nothing to do with getting Sec 8.
Not to mention statisically, there are not too many rich/well-off women to "get with" those gangsta boys in the first place.
We only sleep with pool boys.
post #142 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnTheFence View Post

I also wanted to comment on something, I do not believe their are millions of families that are homeless. For one, since 1989 the numbe of homeless families has DECREASED.
Homelessness in the United States
Quote:
The best approximation is from a study done by the National Law Center on Homelessness and Poverty which states that approximately 3.5 million people, 1.35 million of them children, are likely to experience homelessness in agiven year (National Law Center on Homelessness and Poverty, 2004).
Quote:
They indicate a dramatic increase in homelessness in the United States over the past two decades.
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Recent studies suggest that the United States generates homelessness at a much higher rate than previously thought. Our task in ending homelessness is thus more important now than ever.
HTH explain what I am writing about.
post #143 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnTheFence View Post
For one, since 1989 the numbe of homeless families has DECREASED.
Sorry, but that is not true. I, for once, must say that MITB is correct in that the number of homeless families has dramatically increased! I do not know where you got such information, but it is incorrect, IMHO.

The number of homeless has increased steadily since the 1980's, when Good Ol' Reagan cut funding for President Kennedy's CMHC Construction Act of 1963. I guess he thought the money was much better spent on weapons and big missles

The changing in allocations of federal monies by President Reagan is not, of course, the single-handed reason the number of homeless has increased. But, IMO, it is one of the BIG reasons.
post #144 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by MamaInTheBoonies View Post
Quit lying. Quit stereotyping.

http://a257.g.akamaitech.net/7/257/2...cfr982.553.pdf

This is from the GOVERNMENT! Not county, not state, but the government law.
I agree, MITB, this is over the line, imo.

Pat
post #145 of 221
3.5 million people, does not equal MILLIONS of families.

Of the 1.35 of children do you believe they are all part of a "family" that is also homeless. No. A portion of those "children" are teens, that are alone, living on the streets and the majority of them are runaways.

Also if you READ the entire piece you would see that the determination of homelessness varied, that the initial findings were in 1996 and again in 2000. In their research "homelessness" was counted as ONE night without a place to stay. ONE.

They estimated in one portion of their findings that only 637,000 households were actually homeless, and this could acount from 1 day in a year to 365 days in a year.

Also if you note in this ONE article, that it clearly states that homelessness, and the number of those homeless is hard to calculate. Their are other research organizations that say that homelessness is down.

However, even in this article, there are not MILLIONS of families that are homeless.
post #146 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by MamaInTheBoonies View Post
You are so full of stereotypes, it is disgusting. :

MITB, please reconsider this post.

Pat
post #147 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnTheFence View Post
No you are wrong.(there are a good bit of resources to support this, a simple college Sociology class for one) There is more violent crimes among poor socio-economic classes, drug related crimes, prostitution, drug related crimes and so on.
Quote:
I am pretty sure that my neighbors are not crack heads or dealers so there is no need to for the police to come in the neighborhood, but they are welcome too.

Do you have any references or documentation to support these theories? Especially the first one please. :

Pat
post #148 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2happymamas View Post
The number of homeless has increased steadily since the 1980's, when Good Ol' Reagan cut funding for President Kennedy's CMHC Construction Act of 1963. I guess he thought the money was much better spent on weapons and big missles
While I am no fan of a Bush, when no1 was in office he increased funding for HUD, as has his Son.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/budget/fy2007/hud.html

I still hold that MITB is wrong in saying that millions of families are homeless in the US right now. I will not dispute that there are 3.5 million homeless people in the US, but she said FAMILIES.
post #149 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnTheFence View Post
While I am no fan of a Bush, when no1 was in office he increased funding for HUD, as has his Son.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/budget/fy2007/hud.html

I still hold that MITB is wrong in saying that millions of families are homeless in the US right now. I will not dispute that there are 3.5 million homeless people in the US, but she said FAMILIES.
So it isn't the fact that there are millions of homeless people but the fact that it isn't even more millions of people to fill the quota needed for you to agree it could be millions of "FAMILIES" ?

What is an acceptable number of homeless people for you to become concerned?
post #150 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by WuWei View Post
Do you have any references or documentation to support these theories? Especially the first one please. :

Pat
Sure thing!

Poverty, Ethnicity, And Violent Crime by James Short
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0813320143

Socioeconomic Status, Subcultural Definitions, and Violent Delinquency
Karen Heimer
Social Forces, Vol. 75, No. 3 (Mar., 1997), pp. 799-833
doi:10.2307/2580520
post #151 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by pumpkinsmama View Post
So it isn't the fact that there are millions of homeless people but the fact that it isn't even more millions of people to fill the quota needed for you to agree it could be millions of "FAMILIES" ?

What is an acceptable number of homeless people for you to become concerned?
who said I wasn't. I have been volunteering with homeless organizations since I was a teen. the last few years I have not been involved in a more hands on way because I've been pregnant, breastfeeding, taking care of 4 children, and surviving 2 major hurricanes that hit my area.

i just think MITB doesnt need to exagerate.
post #152 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnTheFence View Post
While I am no fan of a Bush, when no1 was in office he increased funding for HUD, as has his Son.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/budget/fy2007/hud.html

I still hold that MITB is wrong in saying that millions of families are homeless in the US right now. I will not dispute that there are 3.5 million homeless people in the US, but she said FAMILIES.
He increased funding for a subset of people called the Chronically Homeless. These are people, usually with a mental illness, who cannot be maintained in normal housing (such as an apartment) and thus keep getting thrown out. The housing and vouchers available for the "regular" homeless has actually decreased. This includes families. And criteria for homelessness has changed. For example, if you are homeless and are getting out of the cold by spending nights on various friends/family's couches (couch-surfing), you are NOT considered homeless by HUD's standards. However, if you are living in a motel, you are considered homeless and meet HUD's criteria for Section 8. How many homeless people can afford to stay in a motel to prove they are homeless?

In our county, which is an average county, the wait for Section 8 is 54 months. That's a long time to spend out in the cold. If you're a single person, its not unheard of to commit a crime in hopes of getting jail time, where at least its warm and you're guaranteed a meal. Or get smashed enough that you can blow over the legal limit and go to detox, where's there's beds with blankets and food.

In the last two years, the waiting lists have grown and the number of vouchers have been reduced. There is an entire subset of people we call "the unenrollable" who don't even show up on HUD's little data collection reports. They aren't even counted.

Our county alone lost 3000 housing vouchers during 2005. That's 3000 more people on the streets. And we weren't meeting the needs of the homeless to start with - the pending lists were huge even before 2005.
post #153 of 221
OK, before this gets shut down...I'm gonna give my comments for whatever they are worth.

OP: I would not have my children live someplace else. But my husband grew up in a boys home because his parents were unable to care for him and he thrived in that environment.

I feel somewhat jealous of those that have caring grandparents who want to be involved. We do not, so for us that is not a choice. In our will, if we should die, our friends will get custody, not our family. And actually our families are OK with that, they don't want custody anyway.

Section 8: I think MITB, you are angry and it seems you have aright to be from the way you have been treated. But as a former landlord (we just moved this spring) we declined having our tenant use section 8. It was a no=win situation from our perspective. First of all, we were pretty sure he was using drugs, but were told that unless we could "prove" it, then he couldn't be kicked out. And he was a 40 yo man who hung out with kids my daughters ages in his apartment. Again, told nothing we could do about that unless actual proof of something wrong.

Section 8 would place limitations on the lease we had, make it difficult to sell the house and make it difficult to evict if needed. In essence, we would now have a 3rd party involved in our rental agreement=the government. No, thank you.

I am very sensitive to the issues of the poor, having been so in the past, although I have been accused of not being sensitive on these boards. But I think I take a different stand than most. I follow what is being discussed on the spirituality boards "The Secret", the law of attraction.

I feel if you are constantly talking about the bad in your life, complaining about it, being angry, etc. you will more of the same. This is the idea behind "The Secret", if you haven't seen the movie, I highly recommend it. It is truly lifechanging and opens up the world to good possibilities.

So that's my 2 cents, probably coming across as condescending, but not really meant to be. But of course, the original OP's question didn't really deal with poverty, just asking about kids living with grandparents. To which my answer would be no.
post #154 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnTheFence View Post
Sure thing!

Poverty, Ethnicity, And Violent Crime by James Short
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0813320143

Socioeconomic Status, Subcultural Definitions, and Violent Delinquency
Karen Heimer
Social Forces, Vol. 75, No. 3 (Mar., 1997), pp. 799-833
doi:10.2307/2580520
You sited a book? :
http://anitra.net/homelessness/faqs/causes/index.html
Quote:
But an increasing number of people become newly homeless, so the total number of homeless people is rising. People who considered themselves to be making a good income a few years ago are now at risk of becoming homeless, or have done so.
http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/20...03_175406.html
Quote:
The homeless population continues to rise nationwide. It is estimated that the homeless population reached 3.5 million in the United States. But the US Federal budget has stopped providing fund to build new affordable housing, which forced many local governments to cut the public housing projects.
http://72.14.203.104/search?q=cache:lP_Li0m8PgUJww.nationalhomeless.o rg/publications/facts/Why.pdf+NUMBER+OF+HOMELESS+PEOPLE+IN+uNITED+sTATES &hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=11
Quote:
In 2004, 12.7% of the U.S. population, or 37 million people, lived in poverty. Both the poverty rate and the number of poor people have increased in recent years, up from 12.5% in 2003, and up 1.1 million from 2003
I'm sure I could find more.
post #155 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maggi315 View Post
But as a former landlord (we just moved this spring) we declined having our tenant use section 8. It was a no=win situation from our perspective. First of all, we were pretty sure he was using drugs, but were told that unless we could "prove" it, then he couldn't be kicked out. And he was a 40 yo man who hung out with kids my daughters ages in his apartment. Again, told nothing we could do about that unless actual proof of something wrong.
Okay....so, are you saying it's ok to rent to a drug abusing maybe pedophile as long as it is NOT Section 8? I guess I don't understand your point.
post #156 of 221
No, the point was without section 8, I was able to evict him with my lawyers help, which we did. But my attorney told us that if we accepted section 8, we would have to go through the government and have that third party that would intervene and eviction wouldn't be so easy.

The fact that he qualified for section 8 is also scary. He is a single man, no dependents, and yet after 3 months on a waiting list, he gets approved? Huh? That doesn't seem right, but he told us that he was ex-military so he got special treatment, not sure if that is correct. When we rented to him, we were trying to help him out, he seemed to be trying to get his life together, his record was clean, and he just started a job (which he quit 2 days after moving in )

So, long answer, huh? Basically, I just wanted to put in a landlords perspective. I have 5 kids, I have to be selective and pick what options will be best for our family. Getting rid of him immediately was definitely in my best interest and section 8 would have been a problem.
post #157 of 221
Do you even read the posts MITB? She wanted a reference to Crime and its relation to Poverty.
I have read the book because I am just into that kind of thing.
post #158 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by MamaInTheBoonies View Post
Okay....so, are you saying it's ok to rent to a drug abusing maybe pedophile as long as it is NOT Section 8? I guess I don't understand your point.
the POINT is, if this guy had section 8 vouchers, she suspected hes a pedophile and using drugs, but unless she had PROOF, then he could not be evicted. You dont seem to get that many of us do not want the government involved in our homes, our property, and the determination of who gets to live on our property.
post #159 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maggi315 View Post
No, the point was without section 8, I was able to evict him with my lawyers help, which we did. But my attorney told us that if we accepted section 8, we would have to go through the government and have that third party that would intervene and eviction wouldn't be so easy.

The fact that he qualified for section 8 is also scary. He is a single man, no dependents, and yet after 3 months on a waiting list, he gets approved? Huh? That doesn't seem right, but he told us that he was ex-military so he got special treatment, not sure if that is correct. When we rented to him, we were trying to help him out, he seemed to be trying to get his life together, his record was clean, and he just started a job (which he quit 2 days after moving in )

So, long answer, huh? Basically, I just wanted to put in a landlords perspective. I have 5 kids, I have to be selective and pick what options will be best for our family. Getting rid of him immediately was definitely in my best interest and section 8 would have been a problem.
He probably had some sort of mental illness. I was reading today from some of the links that MITB actually posted, that if someone who is on SSI for mental illness applies for Section 8, they cannot be prhibited from getting approval even if they have a criminal history. This had something to do with the Disability Act, and it even mentioned in one paragraph that the reason they may have been convicted of crimes, could be in direct relation to their mental illness.
post #160 of 221
I wouldn't, but then we homeschool anyway.
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