Healing the Gut Tribe - November! - Page 2

[JaneS]

Originally Posted by caedmyn

Nolansmom-- I share your frustration. The diet I'm doing is helping me but DD seems to be getting worse and worse. She now has little patches of eczema all over her arms and legs

If it were my DS it would be fruit causing increased bacteria/yeast or a food he is very allergic to: coconut for example, causing a histamine reaction.

Are you trying high amounts of EPO?

[JaneS]

Originally Posted by Chinese Pistache

I must be out of the loop, but what happened to JaneS? Is she ever coming back?

I got burned out facing new issues with DS (food allergy and environmental testing). We had to get rid of our cat (at Grandmas now). Have to do lots of stuff around house. Not only cleaning absolutely everything to get rid of cat dander but just discovered we probably have a mold issue, which might explain the underlying reason to all this.

Diet changes with DS have been super hard. So I've been under massive stress. DH is not being at all helpful either. I will not be back here to the extent that I used to be for a very long time. But I will try to stop by with new things I'll hopefully be finding out on this journey. :

[caedmyn]

Originally Posted by Nolansmum

I have seen significant improvements for myself, that's why I'm so frustrated about DS's eczema not getting better. Is my body just dumping tons of toxins as it is healing? Could it be more enviornmentally caused and less diet? I have been making the assumption that it was more diet caused. Are you putting anything on the patches for your DD? I broke down this morning and put some steroid cream on after I disinfected with TTO. It seems like the lotions, ointments and creams I put on just make the areas red and inflammed:

I just put coconut oil and sweet almond oil on it--hers is quite red but doesn't appear to bother her at all so I try not to worry about it too terribly much (it's not working as you can probably tell!). But I am going to make a couple of my own herbal salves to put on it, so I will let you know if they help.

[caedmyn]

Originally Posted by JaneS

If it were my DS it would be fruit causing increased bacteria/yeast or a food he is very allergic to: coconut for example, causing a histamine reaction.

Are you trying high amounts of EPO?

How young is too young for accurate allergy testing? The only foods she is getting directly are (you guessed it) coconut oil and coconut milk yogurt or kefir. So maybe she is allergic to the coconut milk...but if she is, how in the heck can I get probiotics into her? She'll eat the powder but it isn't making enough of a difference. She can't do dairy...what are the other "milk" choices? Rice...I would think that would be even worse from a digestion standpoint. And almond...I'm afraid to do that because of the allergenic potential She doesn't get any fruit or sugar (unless there's still some in the yogurt--it never gets tart), and I very rarely have either (maybe a couple of times a month).

Anybody?

[Punchy Kaby]

Originally Posted by JaneS

I got burned out facing new issues with DS (food allergy and environmental testing). We had to get rid of our cat (at Grandmas now). Have to do lots of stuff around house. Not only cleaning absolutely everything to get rid of cat dander but just discovered we probably have a mold issue, which might explain the underlying reason to all this.

Diet changes with DS have been super hard. So I've been under massive stress. DH is not being at all helpful either. I will not be back here to the extent that I used to be for a very long time. But I will try to stop by with new things I'll hopefully be finding out on this journey. :

Sounds like your journey is continuing to be difficult. YOu are making huge changes. Your DS is so lucky to have such a wise and mama. We miss your thoughtful insight!

I don't mean to suck you in, but if you have time to go into more detail about getting rid of your cat. Did your DS react on a test to cat dander? I ask because we have 2 cats and have suspected all along that they could be a part of the problem. The only 2 times DS was free of the rash(once it started at 4 months old) was our vacation and when we moved to a new house that never had pets.

[Punchy Kaby]

Originally Posted by caedmyn

How young is too young for accurate allergy testing? The only foods she is getting directly are (you guessed it) coconut oil and coconut milk yogurt or kefir. So maybe she is allergic to the coconut milk...but if she is, how in the heck can I get probiotics into her? She'll eat the powder but it isn't making enough of a difference. She can't do dairy...what are the other "milk" choices? Rice...I would think that would be even worse from a digestion standpoint. And almond...I'm afraid to do that because of the allergenic potential She doesn't get any fruit or sugar (unless there's still some in the yogurt--it never gets tart), and I very rarely have either (maybe a couple of times a month).

Anybody?

We are so similar in what we are going through. No dairy, no fruit. I eat some honey, I tried without and there was no difference. I am getting water kefir grains this weekend and will try to get some kefir into DS. I do believe we are allergic to coconut, I have cut it out completely and only have a few household cleaners left that have coconut derived ingredients (dishsoap and laundry detergent, the 2 hardest to replace things.)

[JaneS]

Originally Posted by caedmyn

How young is too young for accurate allergy testing? The only foods she is getting directly are (you guessed it) coconut oil and coconut milk yogurt or kefir. So maybe she is allergic to the coconut milk...but if she is, how in the heck can I get probiotics into her? She'll eat the powder but it isn't making enough of a difference. She can't do dairy...what are the other "milk" choices? Rice...I would think that would be even worse from a digestion standpoint. And almond...I'm afraid to do that because of the allergenic potential She doesn't get any fruit or sugar (unless there's still some in the yogurt--it never gets tart), and I very rarely have either (maybe a couple of times a month).

Anybody?

I really don't know for sure re: how young too young. I do know that the younger they are, the more likely that they will react to more just because their system is so immature. Maybe you can just give more powder, lots and lots? (gradually build up)

[Janelovesmax]

Originally Posted by caedmyn

How young is too young for accurate allergy testing? The only foods she is getting directly are (you guessed it) coconut oil and coconut milk yogurt or kefir. So maybe she is allergic to the coconut milk...but if she is, how in the heck can I get probiotics into her? She'll eat the powder but it isn't making enough of a difference. She can't do dairy...what are the other "milk" choices? Rice...I would think that would be even worse from a digestion standpoint. And almond...I'm afraid to do that because of the allergenic potential She doesn't get any fruit or sugar (unless there's still some in the yogurt--it never gets tart), and I very rarely have either (maybe a couple of times a month).

Anybody?

Did you try goat's milk? It's far less allergenic...

[JaneS]

Originally Posted by Nolansmum

Sounds like your journey is continuing to be difficult. YOu are making huge changes. Your DS is so lucky to have such a wise and mama. We miss your thoughtful insight!

I don't mean to suck you in, but if you have time to go into more detail about getting rid of your cat. Did your DS react on a test to cat dander? I ask because we have 2 cats and have suspected all along that they could be a part of the problem. The only 2 times DS was free of the rash(once it started at 4 months old) was our vacation and when we moved to a new house that never had pets.

Thank you

Yes, DS reacted on his intradermal allergy testing to cat and the red wheal stayed for days showing a delayed reaction as well. And dust, dust mites and certain molds. He started last winter getting a stuffy nose that came and went off and on throughout the year.

My biggest fear is The Allergy March. Google this term, its very interesting. Kids start with eczema. Get food allergies around 2. Then the asthma shows up. I want to do everything humanly possible to avoid asthma with DS b/c I think if he progresses to that, it will be bad and be for life given the other issues his immune system is fighting.

If I had to do it all over again knowing what I know now, I would have given the cat away much sooner, like as soon as the eczema showed up. I wanted to but DH did not and I didn't press it. He grew up with animals and I did not, however the cats were mine. It would have been very hard for me so I was easily convinced. DH sent me all sorts of stuff saying that people with pets had fewer allergies and I know that's true, EXCEPT: only if the person has a healthy normally functioning immune system. Our DS does not.

I now think that in the presence of an immune system that is obviously fighting off "invaders" and losing, the less stresses put upon it might be for the better. But that might be my overwhelmed perspective now talking.

I tend not to believe the Hygiene Hypothesis. I don't think it's because we are cleaner that our immune system cannot properly develop oral and environmental tolerance, it's because of the chemicals and antibiotics and nutrient deficient food with diseased gut flora at the root of it all.

[caedmyn]

Originally Posted by Janelovesmax

Did you try goat's milk? It's far less allergenic...

Yes, she definitely reacted to that--actually she's gone right downhill since I tried goat milk yogurt--it totally messed up her sleep and her eczema's never really gone away since. I've never given it to her directly but I don't see why she would handle it any better directly.

[caedmyn]

Originally Posted by JaneS

My biggest fear is The Allergy March. Google this term, its very interesting. Kids start with eczema. Get food allergies around 2. Then the asthma shows up. I want to do everything humanly possible to avoid asthma with DS b/c I think if he progresses to that, it will be bad and be for life given the other issues his immune system is fighting.

This is what I am afraid of, too, although I'd never heard the term before.

I hope that you are able to continue to make progress with your DS, and I am glad you are finally seeing some improvement in him.

Nolansmom--I just don't know what to do from an environmental standpoint. I am afraid to even find out if it is coconut--I can't live without coconut oil right now, especially since I can't do butter or dairy fats. DD has always worn natural fabrics almost exclusively, along with cotton and wool cloth diapers. I've always used Bi-o-kleen on her clothes and mine w/no fabric softener. I did try natural dish detergents for a long time but they just didn't clean the dishes so I went back to Palmolive...I really can't imagine that would make much of a difference, anyway. DD only gets a bath about every 10 days as she hates the water. There is chlorine in the water but I've never noticed that it makes any difference. We don't have any pets and the house we're renting is brand new. I don't think anything is related to the house, anyway, as nothing improves when we are gone for up to two weeks at a time.

I'm going to start another batch of coconut milk kefir tonight...hopefully DD will take it and we'll see what happens. I really wanted to do coconut milk kefir instead of kefir sodas just because of the sugar in them--I don't want to feed her yeasties, and I doubt she'll drink them if they get too sour. Maybe I'll try a strawberry kefir soda and see what happens with that if she won't drink the coconut kefir or I eliminate coconut milk.

[Punchy Kaby]

Nolansmom--I just don't know what to do from an environmental standpoint. I am afraid to even find out if it is coconut--I can't live without coconut oil right now, especially since I can't do butter or dairy fats. DD has always worn natural fabrics almost exclusively, along with cotton and wool cloth diapers. I've always used Bi-o-kleen on her clothes and mine w/no fabric softener. I did try natural dish detergents for a long time but they just didn't clean the dishes so I went back to Palmolive...I really can't imagine that would make much of a difference, anyway. DD only gets a bath about every 10 days as she hates the water. There is chlorine in the water but I've never noticed that it makes any difference. We don't have any pets and the house we're renting is brand new. I don't think anything is related to the house, anyway, as nothing improves when we are gone for up to two weeks at a time.

I hear you about the fats, I use olive oil, walnut and flax oils, as well as taking EPO. I am afraid I don't get enough omega 3's because I also do not eat eggs, although at this point I have no idea if DS is intolerant to them. And with his cheeks so bad if I tried eggs I cannot tell what the reaction is to. It sure would be nice to bake a muffin and have an easy snack to take out. It is so hard to tell what is actually making a difference. Am I spending all this time and money and just making myself crazy?

I have some homeopathic remedies for pet dander and hayfever. I may try taking one of them, or giving it to DS. They happen to be in alcohol, thank goodness not a lactose pellet. Maybe it will work to lessen his histamine response

[bluets]

caedmyn and nolansmom, are you doing EPO? i'm talking about LOTS of EPO. i was just reading today that GLA (gamma linolenic acid) gets depleted quickly when inflammation occurs. having spent the last few month tweaking my oils, i just did a recalculation of the amount of EPO and borage oil i had been taking before ds's eczema started creeping back.

through the summer, i would take 2 KAL UltraOmega 3 6 9 capsules in the morning and 2 at night (400 mg of each of fish oil, flax oil and borage oil in each capsule) - there's no way i could remember to pop pills at lunch at work. on top of that, i was taking 2600 mg of EPO in the morning and another 2600 mg of EPO at night. i'm thinking i might go back to this type of combination and i'm going to drop gluten-loaded grains for a while (i thought i could handle them but i'm thinking not). most recommendations i've seen for EPO are in the 2 to 4 g, not 5+ g. (ND didn't think i needed so much GLA but i'm guessing i do still)

was just reading about gliadin and zonulin. i have a few papers to read more carefully so i'll report back once i've done that - but the short version is that it looks like gliadin and zonulin interact to cause a leaky gut scenario. (gliadin is one component of gluten; zonulin is a cellular protein in our gut lining i think) i stumbled onto this by joining the GFCFNN yahoo group.

another thing... dh gets these itchy patches - they're almost microscopic but they might be eczema. it cleared up nearly instantly when he smeared hemp seed oil on them. it turns out that hemp seed oil has almost as much GLA as EPO but has a generally more balanced oil profile than either EPO or flax seed oil. since he's taking it orally, i'm toying with the idea of replacing the KAL UltraOmega with the CLO i'm now taking and some hemp seed oil, and then supplementing with EPO on top of that.

borage oil has more GLA than EPO but it also contains some slightly toxic components so it isn't recommended that one take it in high doses.

[caedmyn]

Originally Posted by bluets

caedmyn and nolansmom, are you doing EPO? i'm talking about LOTS of EPO. i was just reading today that GLA (gamma linolenic acid) gets depleted quickly when inflammation occurs. having spent the last few month tweaking my oils, i just did a recalculation of the amount of EPO and borage oil i had been taking before ds's eczema started creeping back.

through the summer, i would take 2 KAL UltraOmega 3 6 9 capsules in the morning and 2 at night (400 mg of each of fish oil, flax oil and borage oil in each capsule) - there's no way i could remember to pop pills at lunch at work. on top of that, i was taking 2600 mg of EPO in the morning and another 2600 mg of EPO at night. i'm thinking i might go back to this type of combination and i'm going to drop gluten-loaded grains for a while (i thought i could handle them but i'm thinking not). most recommendations i've seen for EPO are in the 2 to 4 g, not 5+ g. (ND didn't think i needed so much GLA but i'm guessing i do still)

was just reading about gliadin and zonulin. i have a few papers to read more carefully so i'll report back once i've done that - but the short version is that it looks like gliadin and zonulin interact to cause a leaky gut scenario. (gliadin is one component of gluten; zonulin is a cellular protein in our gut lining i think) i stumbled onto this by joining the GFCFNN yahoo group.

another thing... dh gets these itchy patches - they're almost microscopic but they might be eczema. it cleared up nearly instantly when he smeared hemp seed oil on them. it turns out that hemp seed oil has almost as much GLA as EPO but has a generally more balanced oil profile than either EPO or flax seed oil. since he's taking it orally, i'm toying with the idea of replacing the KAL UltraOmega with the CLO i'm now taking and some hemp seed oil, and then supplementing with EPO on top of that.

borage oil has more GLA than EPO but it also contains some slightly toxic components so it isn't recommended that one take it in high doses.

I've been taking 3000 mg of EPO but maybe that isn't enough. I guess I'll look into that UltraOmega, although I would think between the CLO oil I take and the grass-finished meat I eat, along with high omega 3 eggs, that part of it would be okay. Maybe I should get some hemp seed oil and try applying that directly to DD's eczema.

[Pookietooth]

nolansmom. Happy to see a post from you JaneS, although I am sorry things having been going so well with your ds. Hope they get better. Oh, and as far as pets preventing allergies, some studies have shown that it's just people with dogs, and in fact those with cats have a higher allergy rate!

[Punchy Kaby]

Originally Posted by bluets

caedmyn and nolansmom, are you doing EPO? i'm talking about LOTS of EPO. i was just reading today that GLA (gamma linolenic acid) gets depleted quickly when inflammation occurs. having spent the last few month tweaking my oils, i just did a recalculation of the amount of EPO and borage oil i had been taking before ds's eczema started creeping back.

through the summer, i would take 2 KAL UltraOmega 3 6 9 capsules in the morning and 2 at night (400 mg of each of fish oil, flax oil and borage oil in each capsule) - there's no way i could remember to pop pills at lunch at work. on top of that, i was taking 2600 mg of EPO in the morning and another 2600 mg of EPO at night. i'm thinking i might go back to this type of combination and i'm going to drop gluten-loaded grains for a while (i thought i could handle them but i'm thinking not). most recommendations i've seen for EPO are in the 2 to 4 g, not 5+ g. (ND didn't think i needed so much GLA but i'm guessing i do still)

was just reading about gliadin and zonulin. i have a few papers to read more carefully so i'll report back once i've done that - but the short version is that it looks like gliadin and zonulin interact to cause a leaky gut scenario. (gliadin is one component of gluten; zonulin is a cellular protein in our gut lining i think) i stumbled onto this by joining the GFCFNN yahoo group.

another thing... dh gets these itchy patches - they're almost microscopic but they might be eczema. it cleared up nearly instantly when he smeared hemp seed oil on them. it turns out that hemp seed oil has almost as much GLA as EPO but has a generally more balanced oil profile than either EPO or flax seed oil. since he's taking it orally, i'm toying with the idea of replacing the KAL UltraOmega with the CLO i'm now taking and some hemp seed oil, and then supplementing with EPO on top of that.

borage oil has more GLA than EPO but it also contains some slightly toxic components so it isn't recommended that one take it in high doses.

I have been taking black currant seed oil, 1500 mg a day which delivers 270 mg of GLA, or twice as much as EPO. Maybe I'll try upping that amount. So if inflammation uses up GLA, what does that mean for trying to balance out omega 3, 6 and 9? I will look at the hemp seed oil.

[Pattyla]

Haven't read anything but I wanted to post this update.

Took dd to the acupuncturist today. LOVE HER! She thinks that the naturopath is right about what is wrong with dd (Staph) and that I am right that she isn't responding to what he has recomended she take. She thinks that her immune system is just so shot that it needs help to recover. She also does NAET and tested dd for like 20 things today. Thankfully we did get some answers to things to watch out for and got cleared on some other things. The best part though is that she lives a couple of blocks away from me and offered to treat dd at her house for cheaper than treating her at the place I went today. I am so grateful! Not sure when we will get started on that (today was just testing, no treatment) but she did teach me some massage/acupressure stuff to do for her immune system.

[bluets]

Originally Posted by caedmyn

I've been taking 3000 mg of EPO but maybe that isn't enough. I guess I'll look into that UltraOmega, although I would think between the CLO oil I take and the grass-finished meat I eat, along with high omega 3 eggs, that part of it would be okay. Maybe I should get some hemp seed oil and try applying that directly to DD's eczema.

if you're doing CLO, don't waste your time with the KAL product. Try increasing EPO or adding Borage oil/black currant seed oil/hemp seed oil.

GLA is not one of the Omega PUFAs (i.e., not omega-3 or omega-6 etc) but it is in the fatty acid synthesis pathway. mdheal.org has a nice article about this in relation to allergy and atopy, along with a drawing showing where GLA shows up in the picture.

[bluets]

Originally Posted by Nolansmum

I have been taking black currant seed oil, 1500 mg a day which delivers 270 mg of GLA, or twice as much as EPO. Maybe I'll try upping that amount. So if inflammation uses up GLA, what does that mean for trying to balance out omega 3, 6 and 9? I will look at the hemp seed oil.

i still haven't quite figured out the entire fatty acid pathway. i probably just need to bite the bullet and get my hands on a really good nutrition textbook - one with lots of charts and pathway diagrams to which my brain responds well. GLA is different from the omega EFAs. btw, i learned that omega-9 is not an EFA because your body builds it from existing building blocks (but you gotta make sure that those blocks are there).

you can use hemp seed oil on veggies but cool the veggies first if you've cooked them else the heat will trash the fats. it's got a slightly nutty flavor. an alternative source is just plain ol' hemp seeds. no idea if those need to be soaked or whatnot before using.

in my readings i learned that "they" are trying to genetically modify mainstream oil plants to increase their GLA content - transferring the GLA-producing genes from evening primrose or borage into safflower, sunflower, canola, etc.

[bluets]

Originally Posted by caedmyn

How young is too young for accurate allergy testing? The only foods she is getting directly are (you guessed it) coconut oil and coconut milk yogurt or kefir. So maybe she is allergic to the coconut milk...but if she is, how in the heck can I get probiotics into her? She'll eat the powder but it isn't making enough of a difference. She can't do dairy...what are the other "milk" choices? Rice...I would think that would be even worse from a digestion standpoint. And almond...I'm afraid to do that because of the allergenic potential She doesn't get any fruit or sugar (unless there's still some in the yogurt--it never gets tart), and I very rarely have either (maybe a couple of times a month).

Anybody?

are there any fermented veggies that might work - ones that might be digestible and fermentable, that is. ginger carrots without the ginger?

i wouldn't subject her to allergy testing yet unless you're prepared to be gutsy with the docs and insist on a blood draw. our allergy doc seems to be on speed or something - sees like 6 patients at a time and is exceptionally pushy. before we knew it, ds (13 months old then) was getting pricked and everything turned out to be negative. i'd look to see if enterolabs or genova diagnostics has something for IgG tesing.