You know, reading the threads here when I lurk, it's a really depressing fact when you realize that keeping baby boys from a cruel and torturous operation is ignored and has become blatantly overlooked in a perfect example of mass brainwashing (gee, some psychologists should take up circumcision denial as a field of study even if it ruffles feathers). The genital integrity, as we all like to call it, of boys is considered so unimportant that many other cruel things, some less cruel, get more attention. Society cares more about hurting their pets by declawing/tail docking than baby boys and that's just a problem with priorities if I ever saw one. You get people who fight for the rights of humans and animals alike to be spared from harm who turn around and give circ the thumbs up! And these are usually people who have no religious issues to deal with.
A good argument with religious folks intent on circ'ing is to mention this clung-to biblical circ (that pro-circ'ers proudly boast Jesus received) was a cut of the tip and not an entire skinning off the penis!!! I sometimes imagine how asinine it would seem if the opposite scenario were the norm (not to make it a religious debate but if those sects of Islam, like the ones in Africa, that mutilate baby girls was the prevalent minority faith instead of judaism it would be hard for western countries/the UN to ban on the grounds religious rights). I have wondered about circumfetishists; we all know they exist and they make great strains to keep the practice going but are never targeted as sickos the way pedophiles are (and make no mistake, a good majority of circumfetishists are pedophiles in a way).
This is allowed to go on, is never cracked down upon, simply because they are organized in honour of a medical practice. Also I wonder, do circumfetishists exist in the female form of it because we would see those people referred to as sickos and efforts would be crazy in trying to stop such organizations. We'd have a majority of women being circ'd, a backlash and a wave of outrage from them while men take up the cause too because if they are allowed to keep their foreskin, how come women can't? But many women would still say "it did not hurt me, all this talk of barbarism is so silly, i do not regret it, i enjoy sex just as much, my daughter will have it done, these people are fear-mongering because studies show it's much more beneficial to have your clitoris/labia removed."
It'd be a culture where jokes about female circ are considered acceptable and the process is made to seem like a little snip that in America just has to be done even if the Europeans and most of the world finds it terrible. A culture where most women, outside feminist and anti-circ types, don't even see the unfair cruelty in this process done at birth. Imagine that! I would pose this bizzaro world reality to those women who actually do think male circ is not a cruel, oppressive practice. If they want to think that it's different to have girls given this ritual practice then they're just wrong no matter what their reasoning.
Some women will assail female circ from a variety of myths they hear, but using more myths will champion circ and say that if boys get it performed on them, they shouldn't complain because men get all the breaks over women and should learn to be tough/not cry. It's this mentality that's causing a generation of boys to be raised thinking their feelings are inconsequential and that feeling hurt and opposition to circ is sour grapes. Get over it, is commonly the motto told to them by mainstream society. Imagine if we did this to girls. I think because females have it tough in many other areas of societal expectations/pressure, they can better relate to this oppressive tough love attitude.
Fortunately for them, girls are expected to be emotional and express their feelings and female circ would be an easier battle to win than male circ is proving/will prove to be. These are some thoughts of mine on the subject because it really bothers me the more I know about circumcision. I'm no psychology major, but I think the phenomenon, if you will, of RIC is a subject ripe for intense scrutiny and study. I just wanted to express these thoughts and see what feedback I get. I feel this strongly that it terrifies me to think what it would be like if I actually was cut myself or if I had a son of mine cut (ok, that ain't happening but this is a hypothetical argument) or even if I knew someone personally who had this done (personally, I've yet to know for sure if this is the case although many Jewish people I've met over the years I'm sure have dealt with getting it done, but I didn't try to be a prude about it).
From now on, I am a bit hesitant but I'll make efforts to see if anyone expecting a boy, who I know, is going to get it done. Because I will do my best to prevent it whether it be friends, comrades, or family members. You never know if it could be a problem although from what I know my bro and 5 male cousins are not cut (and with rates being what they are in Canada, it's unlikely that anything under 99.9% of intact men will be having their son cut today and especially into the future-plus I have a cousin born and raised in England so it's a non-issue there). BUT, I do have a sister and 7 female cousins (the one in the UK wouldn't even face it I bet and likely wouldn't marry a circumcised man which is more likely in North America).
And it would suck if they got it done because I'd really loathe the fact I had a known relative who had to suffer like that. From what I know, there are no anti-circ pioneers in my extended family and the reasoning I've often heard from my parents was what the doctor told them; "It hurts, it's unnecessary, no one does that anymore, it's an old medical myth." Which is great for a doctor to have been saying back in the mid-80s since even then circ was more widespread in Canada than now, esp. lucky for me since I was born in the time of still above-national avg. rates in Ontario. I'm sure the reasons for my aunts and uncles were the same plus as the years went on, circ became defunded in almsot every province.
Anyway, it's good to know Canada is getting closer to the UK on this issue and if it weren't for the American influence circ would never have been too big and would not have stuck around so long. Case in point was Newfoundland which didn't join till 1949 and although it never adopted the medical obsession Britain had with circ, it still had strong enough British ties that it never adopted circumcision as the rates went down in Britain and up in Canada/the U.S. I'd feel a bit of guilt even if I'd never ever get to meet the kid in my life. If I were American, this could be the sad reality but it's still a possibiliy to have all intact sons, nephews, etc. It's how just one person can stop/stave off the cycle of abuse and save hundreds and hundreds of babies in one's lifetime.
It's kinda scary to envision ever having had this done knowing what I know now. As someone lucky enough to be intact, this kind of info really makes you value your foreskin in more ways than one and you stop feeling indifferent to it (even though before I knew how evil circ was, I knew I never would like to have it done to me). The fact circ is so institutionalized shows me this world is not much more compassionate than it has always been; anything and everything no matter how awful can be justified and hardwired into people's minds. People in general can be taught to be duped into anything without even knowing they're being duped! I often wonder if society is gonna answer a question I pose that Bob Dylan once said, "When you gonna wake up?"
A good argument with religious folks intent on circ'ing is to mention this clung-to biblical circ (that pro-circ'ers proudly boast Jesus received) was a cut of the tip and not an entire skinning off the penis!!! I sometimes imagine how asinine it would seem if the opposite scenario were the norm (not to make it a religious debate but if those sects of Islam, like the ones in Africa, that mutilate baby girls was the prevalent minority faith instead of judaism it would be hard for western countries/the UN to ban on the grounds religious rights). I have wondered about circumfetishists; we all know they exist and they make great strains to keep the practice going but are never targeted as sickos the way pedophiles are (and make no mistake, a good majority of circumfetishists are pedophiles in a way).
This is allowed to go on, is never cracked down upon, simply because they are organized in honour of a medical practice. Also I wonder, do circumfetishists exist in the female form of it because we would see those people referred to as sickos and efforts would be crazy in trying to stop such organizations. We'd have a majority of women being circ'd, a backlash and a wave of outrage from them while men take up the cause too because if they are allowed to keep their foreskin, how come women can't? But many women would still say "it did not hurt me, all this talk of barbarism is so silly, i do not regret it, i enjoy sex just as much, my daughter will have it done, these people are fear-mongering because studies show it's much more beneficial to have your clitoris/labia removed."
It'd be a culture where jokes about female circ are considered acceptable and the process is made to seem like a little snip that in America just has to be done even if the Europeans and most of the world finds it terrible. A culture where most women, outside feminist and anti-circ types, don't even see the unfair cruelty in this process done at birth. Imagine that! I would pose this bizzaro world reality to those women who actually do think male circ is not a cruel, oppressive practice. If they want to think that it's different to have girls given this ritual practice then they're just wrong no matter what their reasoning.
Some women will assail female circ from a variety of myths they hear, but using more myths will champion circ and say that if boys get it performed on them, they shouldn't complain because men get all the breaks over women and should learn to be tough/not cry. It's this mentality that's causing a generation of boys to be raised thinking their feelings are inconsequential and that feeling hurt and opposition to circ is sour grapes. Get over it, is commonly the motto told to them by mainstream society. Imagine if we did this to girls. I think because females have it tough in many other areas of societal expectations/pressure, they can better relate to this oppressive tough love attitude.
Fortunately for them, girls are expected to be emotional and express their feelings and female circ would be an easier battle to win than male circ is proving/will prove to be. These are some thoughts of mine on the subject because it really bothers me the more I know about circumcision. I'm no psychology major, but I think the phenomenon, if you will, of RIC is a subject ripe for intense scrutiny and study. I just wanted to express these thoughts and see what feedback I get. I feel this strongly that it terrifies me to think what it would be like if I actually was cut myself or if I had a son of mine cut (ok, that ain't happening but this is a hypothetical argument) or even if I knew someone personally who had this done (personally, I've yet to know for sure if this is the case although many Jewish people I've met over the years I'm sure have dealt with getting it done, but I didn't try to be a prude about it).
From now on, I am a bit hesitant but I'll make efforts to see if anyone expecting a boy, who I know, is going to get it done. Because I will do my best to prevent it whether it be friends, comrades, or family members. You never know if it could be a problem although from what I know my bro and 5 male cousins are not cut (and with rates being what they are in Canada, it's unlikely that anything under 99.9% of intact men will be having their son cut today and especially into the future-plus I have a cousin born and raised in England so it's a non-issue there). BUT, I do have a sister and 7 female cousins (the one in the UK wouldn't even face it I bet and likely wouldn't marry a circumcised man which is more likely in North America).
And it would suck if they got it done because I'd really loathe the fact I had a known relative who had to suffer like that. From what I know, there are no anti-circ pioneers in my extended family and the reasoning I've often heard from my parents was what the doctor told them; "It hurts, it's unnecessary, no one does that anymore, it's an old medical myth." Which is great for a doctor to have been saying back in the mid-80s since even then circ was more widespread in Canada than now, esp. lucky for me since I was born in the time of still above-national avg. rates in Ontario. I'm sure the reasons for my aunts and uncles were the same plus as the years went on, circ became defunded in almsot every province.
Anyway, it's good to know Canada is getting closer to the UK on this issue and if it weren't for the American influence circ would never have been too big and would not have stuck around so long. Case in point was Newfoundland which didn't join till 1949 and although it never adopted the medical obsession Britain had with circ, it still had strong enough British ties that it never adopted circumcision as the rates went down in Britain and up in Canada/the U.S. I'd feel a bit of guilt even if I'd never ever get to meet the kid in my life. If I were American, this could be the sad reality but it's still a possibiliy to have all intact sons, nephews, etc. It's how just one person can stop/stave off the cycle of abuse and save hundreds and hundreds of babies in one's lifetime.
It's kinda scary to envision ever having had this done knowing what I know now. As someone lucky enough to be intact, this kind of info really makes you value your foreskin in more ways than one and you stop feeling indifferent to it (even though before I knew how evil circ was, I knew I never would like to have it done to me). The fact circ is so institutionalized shows me this world is not much more compassionate than it has always been; anything and everything no matter how awful can be justified and hardwired into people's minds. People in general can be taught to be duped into anything without even knowing they're being duped! I often wonder if society is gonna answer a question I pose that Bob Dylan once said, "When you gonna wake up?"
