conversation I had last week

[Cate]

So, the other day I was watching my dd's gymnastics class. I was sitting in the observation area with several other mother's, and ds asked to nurse. Not a big deal, I pick him up, and he starts nursing. One of the mother's looks at me and ask the typical "so, how long do you plan to nurse him?". I responded "until he decides he's done". She was agast "you know, that could be four of five years!?!" I said "yup, I know, or longer" So she goes off into this whole tirade about how a friend of hers works at a preschool, and there's a kid who goes there that doesn't even know how to use a straw or a sippy cup because he's still being nursed. Of course at this point all the other mothers jump in about how horrible that is, and they can't believe that anyone would nurse their child to age four or five. blah blah blah.
Now, nothing really unusual about this conversation, except the bit about the kid not knowing how to use a cup or a straw at age 5. Now, how likely is this to be possible? I mean, what child, by age five, would never have had anything but breastmilk from the tap? Is this just an urban legend, or is it really possible that a child (who has no health reason for it) not be able to use a cup or a straw by that point?

[MySunflowerBoys]

Sounds like an urban legend to me! My two yr old, with Down Syndrome- low muscle tone in mouth- nurses, uses a straw cup, sippy cup and open cup!

How ridiculous!

[velcromom]

Well I know some moms who never use straws or sippy cups, their kids learn early to drink from regular cups, so I could see it being true that a kid has never used one. If the teacher didn't think to offer a regular cup she might be confused why the child isn't familiar with sippys and straws and naturally, blame anything she doesn't understand on the fact that he's still nursing.

I'm sure it's a total lack of understanding about extended nursing that leads people to think that if a child is nursing they must not drink anything else. Still, that the teacher wouldn't offer a regular cup seems dumb because even the younger children at our preschool can use regular cups. Maybe we just have a higher percentage of moms who never use sippys.

[Meiri]

I'd've asked them if the teacher had considered offering the child a regular cup. DD, who weaned at 7, was using a regular lidless cup some of the time as a toddler. Were their's?

We used various sippies for each child, but it's assinine to assume that every family would do so. We also had them using regular cups at meals too.

If a nonbreastfed toddler cannot handle a regular cup should we blame the bottle?

[sapphire_chan]

Originally Posted by Meiri

If a nonbreastfed toddler cannot handle a regular cup should we blame the bottle?

Yes. Or rather, the attitude behind the bottle. I'm betting that most breastfeeders, EPers and mamas who FF-by-necessity have children who learn to use a regular cup about the same time. I'd guess that parents who bottle-prop have children who don't use a regular cup for longer than FF-by-choicers who don't bottle-prop.

[starlight82]

Urban Legend - or completely unrelated. My 7 month old can drink from a straw. He loves water, and rather than give it to him straight from my water bottle, and have it pour down his shirt front, I pop a straw in, and he drinks right up. He's been doing that for about a month. I offered him water in an Avent sippy and he threw it repeatedly.

[elanorh]

My sister is a speech pathologist and she says that the "suck" instinct phases out during infancy, and if you don't introduce straws/sippies etc. while it's still in place, even if babe is suckling elsewhere, they won't automatically make the connection to suck on the straw/sippy.

We didn't try straws 'til Ina was about 18 months and she still doesn't have them figured out. And we never did sippies (my sister's theory is that the increase in children with some speech problems correlates to overuse of sippies, especially the ones with the "leak proof" valves). We just used regular cups and water for quite awile 'til Ina was capable enough to have cow's milk or watered juice in her cups. So, she also wouldn't know how to use a sippy.

And it has nothing to do directly with breastfeeding ... although honestly I see no reason to introduce a bottle or sippy or whatever if nursing at the tap is available to babe. So that attitude (which some bfers would have I'm certain) may contribute to more kids being that way. But in the end -- does a child have a "need" to know how to use a sippy? No. They didn't exist until a generation ago or so. Same for bottles. And straws, well - I'd imagine that skill can be learned, the same as blowing bubblegum etc., it just takes some thought/practice on the child's part. No biggie.

[BurgundyElephant]

How completely disrespectful of those other mothers to make those comments, when you had just said that you would perhaps be nursing up until the same age.

[lauriebeth]

i dont know, but it seems like this woman was just spouting off some urban ledgend.

why do parents care how other people choose to raise their child? I mean, Why would someone get so snippy with you about nursing??? I just dont get it... And to have the other women chime in about how horrible CLW is...:

Its like if you are doing something different, everyone gets SO upset! That is one main reason why I just hate telling people that my 14 mo old is still nursing... I get a lecture everytime about how I need to stop.

[marybethorama]

Originally Posted by Cate

Now, nothing really unusual about this conversation, except the bit about the kid not knowing how to use a cup or a straw at age 5. Now, how likely is this to be possible? I mean, what child, by age five, would never have had anything but breastmilk from the tap? Is this just an urban legend, or is it really possible that a child (who has no health reason for it) not be able to use a cup or a straw by that point?

I can't imagine. Unless he was never offered one?

My kids were EBF'd and they did drink other liquids as has every other kid I've known.

Maybe the child has some other issues?

[Cate]

Originally Posted by elanorh

And we never did sippies (my sister's theory is that the increase in children with some speech problems correlates to overuse of sippies, especially the ones with the "leak proof" valves).

A little off topic here but...
I'm curious, what evidence does she have to support this theory? Where did it come from? I'm not contesting it, I'm intreged by it. What in particular about the leak proof valves would cause speach problems? Is it a matter of affecting the muscle development?

[Kavita]

Originally Posted by elanorh

My sister is a speech pathologist and she says that the "suck" instinct phases out during infancy, and if you don't introduce straws/sippies etc. while it's still in place, even if babe is suckling elsewhere, they won't automatically make the connection to suck on the straw/sippy.

We didn't try straws 'til Ina was about 18 months and she still doesn't have them figured out. And we never did sippies (my sister's theory is that the increase in children with some speech problems correlates to overuse of sippies, especially the ones with the "leak proof" valves). We just used regular cups and water for quite awile 'til Ina was capable enough to have cow's milk or watered juice in her cups. So, she also wouldn't know how to use a sippy.

And it has nothing to do directly with breastfeeding ... although honestly I see no reason to introduce a bottle or sippy or whatever if nursing at the tap is available to babe. So that attitude (which some bfers would have I'm certain) may contribute to more kids being that way. But in the end -- does a child have a "need" to know how to use a sippy? No. They didn't exist until a generation ago or so. Same for bottles. And straws, well - I'd imagine that skill can be learned, the same as blowing bubblegum etc., it just takes some thought/practice on the child's part. No biggie.

I have heard that before about sippy cups. I think the reason is that they have to use an immature suck to get the liquid, it can affect the muscles. I have a friend whose DS is in speech therapy and the speech therapist told her that it's best not to use them. I met a speech therapist once at a picnic who said that it's true that they aren't the greatest but that it probably isn't such a problem if they are used occasionally, more of a problem if the kid is carrying it around with them all day, and that it's best to remove the valve.

BTW, DD wasn't figuring out the straw either, she loved to chew on straws but couldn't make the connection about drinking from them. Then DH had gotten some juice boxes of apple juice. I usually don't buy juice boxes, or give her any juice at all, but I let her have a little from the box--when she had gotten the straw in her mouth, I squeezed the box a little so some juice flowed into her mouth. You should have seen the look on her face when she realized that liquid came out of there! She started sucking away and that was how she learned to use a straw!

[Momtwice]

They thought nursing until 5 was wrong so they offered flimsy "proof" instead of saying what they really think, because they did not really have good ammo to back up their argument and they knew it. Good for you for challenging their assumptions!