Homework hell

[Liz]

My ds is 6 and in grade one. He gets homework on Monday and it's due on Friday. Usually it is about 8 pages so we try to do 2 pages a night and we're screwed if we go out on a weeknight. We used to just start at the front and work to the back but I've learned to scan all the pages and try to pick a hard one and an easy for each night. DS breezes through the math with no help in less than a minute. But the reading pages can take anywhere from 15 minutes to an hour with dh or me working with him. The toughest have about 6 sentences that he has to read, then read and answer 6 questions - and answer in full sentences. He knows lots of the high frequency words but they don't seem to use them in these pages. They use words that he's never seen before and they're impossible to sound out. His teacher has never said anything about him having problems reading and I think he's made great progress considering I didn't think he could read at all at the start of the year. It's just become such an ordeal for all of us - he's broken down and cried twice this week. DH does lose his patience sometimes but we're not teachers, fer gawds sakes, why are we expected to know how to teach a kid to read!!!

Our parent/teacher conference is next week so I just want to get a feel for where average kids are in reading at this age because if we say there's too much homework is she just going to say he should be able to do this much homework in 15 minutes a night?!!!

Or maybe we should be helping him more. When he comes to a word he doesn't recognise and can't sound out should we just tell him and move on? I usually tell him the sound that he can't sound out, for example, in the word "light" I told him the "gh" doesn't make any sound. But then he doesn't remember it in the next sentence and we make him go through it again. Should we just tell him and keep going so he doesn't get discouraged? He's actually good at sounding things out but he forgets it so quickly it drives us crazy.

Feedback on homework of other average six year olds would be appreciated.

Thanks, Liz

[Kirsten]

Originally Posted by Liz

Or maybe we should be helping him more. When he comes to a word he doesn't recognise and can't sound out should we just tell him and move on? I usually tell him the sound that he can't sound out, for example, in the word "light" I told him the "gh" doesn't make any sound. But then he doesn't remember it in the next sentence and we make him go through it again. Should we just tell him and keep going so he doesn't get discouraged? He's actually good at sounding things out but he forgets it so quickly it drives us crazy.

Hi Liz,

Sounds like you and your dh are both really involved, and have a great plan for spreading out the work over the four days - so that is great. Your ds breezes through the math - so that is great.

I agree with your idea to help him more. He is only six, and just learning. In your example with the word "light" - you tell him the "gh" doesn't make any sound. So your average six year old would sound it out as "lit". "Light" is a bit tough; I'd just tell him. I'd have him read the six sentences, with you helping by telling him any words he can't easily sound out. He'll forget and need help over and over. That is ok. I think that writing out the answers should take more time than reading the sentences.

Different kids learn at different rates. My dd1 needed much more time and much more help to get through her 1st grade homework than my dd2 does. Help as much as he needs to do it in a reasonable amount of time, and without tears.

Come back and let us know how your parent-teacher conference goes.

[Evan&Anna's_Mom]

I think you have a great start for the conference. These are questions that your child's teacher should answer, since each teacher probably expects different things from parents in this situation. Definitely talk about how long he is expected to take and how to shorten it to a more managable load each night.

Our school teaches reading in K and DS had a story to read each night, but they were well suited to his ability and he didn't have any writing at all for homework last year. This year he's in first and his homework is 14 spelling words with a different practice exercise each night, a story to read aloud 3 times and a math sheet. He struggles with the spelling/writing too. In fact, I'm on the computer procrastinating starting his homework because tonight is "write 6 sentences using the spellling words" night and this is the one we battle with each week. I've learned not to schedule anything on Wednesdays!

[mamatowill]

At the conference tell the teacher exaclty what is happening with homework. I am a teacher and I try to assign only a half hour of homework a night (I teach grade 3) and the rule of thumb is 10 minutes for each grade. I know that some students will breeze through the homework and others will struggle. What I don't always know is if most students are finding the homework too difficult. I like when parents tell me this way I can evaulate the effectiveness of the homework. When I have parents tell me that there child is struggling with the homework I give them permission to modify the homework (i.e. answer 2 questions instead of 6). Students should not be learning new skills for homework just consolidating what they were taught in school.

[CarrieMF]

Is this homework mandatory because it sounds quite extensive to me.

Here the kids are reading by christmas, but they're not doing words like Light. They do some sight words in K and the beginning of Grade 1. They work on the sounds and then they start off doing the simpler ones. Words like Light come after Christmas.

[flyingspaghettimama]

I am so sorry for your frustrating predicament.

One of the things that the authors Sara Bennett and Nancy Kalish talk about in "The Case Against Homework," is that we (parents) are not supposed to be the teachers, and some homework can place us into that role, if too challenging. So who knows if you're even teaching reading the way his teacher intends?

I agree with mamatowill - talk to the teacher and ask if the amount or type can be whittled down, or if you as the parent can make some executive decisions about which homework is most important for your son's personal education (if it's reading, then do this, and not math if it's way easy for him) and do that homework first. The authors of the above book say that one option is to say that your child will do 10 minutes of homework per night, and whatever they get done in that time, that's what gets done.

I suggest reading the book - it has all sorts of wonderful ways to make homework meaningful, personalized, and enjoyable instead of a chore.

[mamaduck]

Ds is 6 and in 1st grade. He is supposed to read aloud to us for 20 minutes each night, but he can choose what to read. Some days he reads for only 10 minutes, and so I write down 10 minutes on his sheet. I am willing to support him in trying, but I know his limits and I'm not willing to turn learning to read into hell. It should be pleasurable and exciting. Of course, there are also some nights that he gets into it and reads 30 minutes. I let him reread favorite books again and again -- it helps him to feel confident about what he's doing.

Yes -- with confusing words, I just tell him. He was getting stuck on the word "through" the other day, and I just told him "that's a weird one, it is read like this:" and I demonstrated.

He also gets a page of spelling homework each week. Usually just 6 or 7 words to write 2 or 3 times each through thoughout the week.

[Noah's mommy]

I agree with what everyone else has mentioned-I'm a teacher-2nd grade (though I've taught first and third as well) and I definitely have parents modify homework as necessary (or I modify before I give it out). I would also ask the teacher what prompts she uses when a child is stuck on a word so that there is consistency-in addition to the sounding out or telling the child the word you can also have them skip it and think about what makes sense in the sentence, get their mouth ready for the beginning sound, reread, etc...

I've done the packet of homework thing too but we gave it out on Fridays and it was due the following Friday so that if there was a busy weeknight or nights the weekend was always there too-maybe see if that is an option-then you are spreading it out over 7 nights instead of 5?

[mamaduck]

Abby -- thats a good point about skipping and then trying to figure it out by the context, or by the pictures. That can really help the to feel successful and proud of themselves. When I do that with my son, I tell him that using the clues in the pictures and in the rest of the sentence to figure out the word still counts as really real reading!

[Liz]

Thanks for the responses everybody! We got through this week's homework on time and without any further tears so that's good. But both dh and I are really looking forward to the P/T conference so we can get some input from his teacher. At Curriculum night at the beginning of the year, his teacher really stressed how much ground they have to cover in grade 1 under the new curriculum and she didn't seem to agree with it. I'm not sure I agree with it either but it's her job to teach it so she's got to at least try. I get a bit of an apathetic "what can I do?" kind of vibe from her...... I'll keep you posted.

Thanks again!

Liz

[Terabith]

hint: the gh in light doesn't NOT say anything; igh is a phonogram that says i (as in the letter i). But that sounds like too much work for a first grader. Definitely tell the teacher about the stress and difficulty. When I taught (third grade) it was hard to tell how work went at home and I craved feedback from parents.

[Liz]

We got his report card yesterday and he got all Bs, with B- in reading and writing so he needs work in that area but he's doing fine. The parent/teacher conference is tonight. I'll keep you posted.

Liz

[mamaduck]

How strange to give such little kids actual letter grades. My ds goes to a school with no report cards -- we get a multi-page written assessment twice a year that includes social/emotional factors. But even the public schools just do meets, exceeds, or does not meet expectations on the report cards until 4th grade.

[1xmom]

Good luck w/your PT conference. My dd is in Grade 1 as well as has no where near the homework your son has. She has 10 spelling words and math maybe once a week. As far as report cards go, they did not get a report card this marking period, but will get one next month. At our PT conference she just went over her strengths and weaknesses.

[ChristaN]

I agree that letter grades in first grade sounds odd. My two dds have attended different schools in first grade and had very different styles of teachers, but neither got letter grades. My older dd (who is now in 3rd grade) had a really awful first grade teacher so I wouldn't want to emmulate her experience, but here it is: dd#1 had loads of flash cards for sight words and math facts as well as worksheets and 20 mins/night of reading in 1st grade. She was reading very well in 1st, but she has is also highly gifted, a girl (I understand, anecdotally, that girls often catch on to reading earlier), and she would have had an issue with the quantity of work if not the difficulty of what you describe. Dd#1 is not a fast worker despite being bright.

Dd#2 is currently in 1st. She is also 6, like your son. I would say that about 1/2 of the kids in her class are not reading well and I can't imagine the teacher expecting them to read worksheets and answer questions independently. Dd#2 rarely has homework for language arts and when she does it isn't that difficult. It generally consists of a worksheet with a fill in the blanks thing like: Today is December 7, 2006. I want to go ______ this weekend because _______. She can read that as can most of the kids in her language arts group, but it isn't long, IKWM. Asking a kid to read something a bit challenging is one thing, but asking him to read a lot of challenging material is too much and bound to lead to frustration.

For instance, if we are reading a book that is a bit beyond her independent reading level, I would only have her read a few sentences and then I'd read the rest of the page. If the language arts homework he is getting is beyond his independent reading level, he should get less of it so it isn't so frustrating IMO.

Let us know how the conference goes and remember that, if he's getting Bs, he's still doing better than "average."

[momma of monkeys]

I was just getting ready to post about homework....my ds is also 6 and grade one. According to the school ds should only have approx 20 minutes of homework per day....the quickest he has ever completed it was 23 minutes. Most nights it is a struggle to get it done in a couple hours. He has between 4-8 pages per night...yep, you read that right...per night. Plus he is supposed to read one book (little school books never more than 10 or so pages)
He actually didn't go to school yesterday and has 12 pages to complete tonight. Let the meltdown begin and it has.
I *wish* ds only had a couple pages a night or a week....he is in some accelerated classes and really does not need 'help' from me he just breezes through it when he wants to...it just seems like so much for such a little guy....

[ChristaN]

Originally Posted by momma of monkeys

I *wish* ds only had a couple pages a night or a week....he is in some accelerated classes and really does not need 'help' from me he just breezes through it when he wants to...it just seems like so much for such a little guy....

I don't think that quantity is the point of accelerated classes. I've had that conversation w/ dd#1's teachers repeatedly. She simply doesn't need as much repetition to learn, so it is actually counterproductive. Dd#2 is also in the accelerated reading class for first grade and she has very little, if any homework. At most, she gets homework once a week and it takes her maybe 5 minutes to do. I actually wonder on the opposite end for her why she has so little !

My point, though, is that advanced classes don't neccesitate excessive homework. Advanced classes should indicate advanced material or quicker movement through the material, not more busy work.

[momma of monkeys]

Originally Posted by ChristaN

I don't think that quantity is the point of accelerated classes. I've had that conversation w/ dd#1's teachers repeatedly. She simply doesn't need as much repetition to learn, so it is actually counterproductive. Dd#2 is also in the accelerated reading class for first grade and she has very little, if any homework. At most, she gets homework once a week and it takes her maybe 5 minutes to do. I actually wonder on the opposite end for her why she has so little !

My point, though, is that advanced classes don't neccesitate excessive homework. Advanced classes should indicate advanced material or quicker movement through the material, not more busy work.

It's not just my ds who has that much homework...I talked with another momma in ds' class (who is also sn, not in advanced classes) and her ds has a sh!t-ton of homework as well....
I am going to ask AGAIN if ds is for whatever reason not completing classwork and then it becomes homework. I just don't get it....:

[Liz]

Okay so we had the parent teacher conference last night. We only have 15 minutes so after she went through the 2 page report card basically reading it verbatim and not really adding any information, we get to our concerns. I didn't go into this with a list or anything, I didn't want to put her on the defensive, so I'm just winging it. The first thing that came up was, she had mentioned that ds sometimes spoke out of turn. DH said he didn't think that was a bad thing, he was glad that he spoke his mind, mentioning that DH was very shy as a child and didn't "speak out of turn" out of fear. She laughed nervously and said, sort of sarcastically (she does this constantly), something like "this behaviour was not considered appropriate in school." I asked if it was a problem, any worse than the other kids and she admitted that it was pretty common.
Next, I bring up math. He got a B but he seems to me to be quite good at math. He tells me he's the fastest in the class - he's 6 he rates everything on speed But even other parents have told me their kids have said that Crawford is really good at math so I wondered why he only got a B when he got a B+ in other subjetcs. She just starts repeating what it says on his report card, "Can add and subtract numbers up to 20" or something like that. So I said, well he can multiply. She says, "We don't do multiplication in grade one." So I just left it at maybe she could give him some tougher math homework.
So then we get to homework. We told her it was taking an hour some nights and we found the homework really hellish. She was totally surprised and actually this was the only genuine reaction we got out of her (are you getting that I'm not bonding with this woman? ). So I asked just how much are we supposed to be helping because we sit there and keep him working, coach him through sounding out the words but what do we do when he comes to a word he can't sound out? She says, "Well, those are sight words. We learn them in class." So I start listing some of the words we've struggled with just off the top of my head: stomach, penguin, pepperoni, Antarctica, Fiona. She says we've learned stomach in class. I said well he didn't remember so are we supposed to tell him or let him struggle with them? She says (with that slightly sarcastic laugh) oh you just tell him. This shouldn't be painful. So i say, "Well, we're not teachers, we don't know that. You really should have a hand out you give out at the beginning of the year to tell parents what is expected of them." So then she sheepishly hands us a hand out......

So I'm going on way too long and I have tp get dinner ready but in the end I've decided 3 things:

1. she isn't a bad teacher just not a good teacher (B- in my books)
2. it doesn't matter that he's not getting As, it's just up to us to inspire him beyond a B.
3. I'm going to talk to the principal about how the school system assumes way too much. They are very bad at understanding their audience. They've just been doing it too long to understand what's it's like on the other side.

Thanks for listening!

Liz

[mamaduck]

What is it with sarcastic teachers??? I've encountered this too, and even sarcastic toward the *kids* sometimes, which is entirely counterproductive.

Liz -- in your shoes, I would just totally back off your son. I wouldn't show him his report card or talk to him about it all. I'd support him with homework, but give him permission to stop working at the point it becomes hellish, and simply send a note to the teacher each and everytime you reach that point telling her that it was too hard. Other than that -- I'd encourage him to enjoy his life. Jeesh. Six year olds soak up everything around them and learn what they need to through osmosis. There is no need for this sort of stress!