Wic?

[mnearthmomma]

Not sure if this goes here or not...

Has anyone heard about or have a link to information regarding the rumored legislation regarding WIC 'nurses' being given the authority to enter your home to 'check' on you to make sure you are feeding your children and using the checks they provide?

I have done a search ont he Congess sites and whatnot but have been unable to find something other than info about the fiscal year....maybe some deeper reading is needed?

I am taking the girls in to WIC tomorrow, set up an appointment for giggles because I have heard so much about them pushing ABM around here. I want to see if they have a problem with the fact that I BF Zoe and would also like to see if there is info I can get about the foods they provide, who the companies are etc. as I have heard that Nestle is in cahoots with WIC. I also want to find out about whether or not they have Breastfeeding mentors or whatever, and if it's possible to become one. I am very curious about this organisation as it seems to help people but at the same time it seems to jack people in the bum, you know?

Soooooo, if you have some links about the above query, canya help a girl out?

[Blue Lotus]

WIC is a government program run by the agriculture dept, which provides foods to women and children in economic need.

Here is a link to more info: http://www.fns.usda.gov/wic/

One thing to remember, every state (and even city) implements the program differently. My local one is ok, and their bfing counselor is pretty knowledgeable and friendly. But I have heard horror stories about others, so I think it would totally depend on where you live.

I haven't heard about that legislation, but I would love to hear if it is true. I personally doubt it, because I would think it would be a stretch for them to go into your house. I know that they do have the authority to remove a woman from the program if she doesn't pick up her checks for two months in a row.

I'm sure other ladies will be along shortly to give you thier experiences soon. Hope this helps!

If I remember right, Nestle isn't one of the companies in NM (I know Quaker is, but I don't know who owns them). I would have to look on my packet, but I have a sleeping baby on my lap at the moment...

[mnearthmomma]

I know *what* it is, but I am curious about it's implementation.....thanks for your answer though!!

[lissabob]

I don't know about the nurses but I highly doubt it because there is nothing you sign saying that they can check on you. As for bfing- I re-certified my dd (after being off for over a year) and they were so HAPPY that I was still bfing at 3+ yrs and didn't give much wcm. But then I live in OR, and we have the best bfing rates and they are starting up the "risks of formula" program they have in Cali soon. :-)

[wendy1221]

WIC varies greatly from state to state, and even from office to office. Here in my town, there are 2 offices. THe one I go to is on campus and is extremely pro-bf and friendly. He one downtown, I went to once anf they are rude and act annoyed when you tell them you're bf. Whatever.

THey can't come to your house. NO WAY!

In Pa, where I'm from it, was similar to WIC here in IN.

[mnearthmomma]

I know they *can't* come into your house now, and if the legislation passes, it owuld be unconstitutional, I am just curious if it was just a rumor or if it is really something on the agenda, kwim?

For the record, we are not current;y using WIC, but like I said, I made the girls and appointment for a variety of reasons, the biggest of which is my own curiousity of the program.

[s_kristina]

The WIC office and the ones I have heard of are all horribly over booked and understaffed. At best the idea of the counselors and clerics having times to go to homes is laughable. I agree with the other ladies that WIC offices will vary greatly even within a city. There are 3 permanent offices and an office they use two or three times a month on a local base in the county I live in. For those offices there are either 2 or 3 IBCLCs and they always have hand pumps on hand either isis or harmony. They also have pro bf posters all over the offices. In the parish we used to live in we didn't have WIC, but a good friend of mine did. When she had bf problems WIC was no help at all. They told her she would be required to go to class in a not so nice part of time to even get a hand pump. That wouldn't have been much help when she was EPing.

I do know there is current legislation that will have the food packages changed to hopefully promote a more healthful diet. You can read about those changed here http://www.nwica.org/ There are also tons of other threads in this forum about WIC, their policies and their proposed changes in policy.

[ILoveMyBabyBird]

I haven't had any problems with WIC. I did not intend on signing up for the program because I planned to fully breastfeed my ds, but we had complications and I am not able to provide a full supply to ds. At the time my dh was not working full time, and I had just graduated, so we decided to sign up for wic to get his formula. In addition, because i was still breastfeeding, they signed me up for the program too. They have not discouraged me from breastfeeding, although they have not been super helpful either. but the nutrionist did say that any breastmilk I give ds is good. As far as using the checks, they did not seemed concerned if I did not use all the checks, I cannot drink 6 gallons of milk a month myself, but they do emphasize not giving the food to others. As far the formula--it is enfamil, not nestle that I receive, and they give me enough for a fully breastfed baby 9 cans a month, but I only go through about half that. Most the foods on the list are generic though--I don't think they are owned by nestle.

[hunnybumm]

I am currently living in NC and we get WIC. It takes about 2 months to get an appointment, half the woman are rude half are nice, they support BFing, but I doubt they are very knowledable about it. There is no way I would let any of those woman into my house, I highly doubt that bill will go through.

When I was in CA for 4 months visiting my mom while my DH was deployed we transfered our WIC out there. We got an appointment within 3 days of calling. They were very nice and helpful. We got all the same stuff we got in NC. My only complaint is that they really tried to push the cereal and solids at 6 months. I eventually just agreed to get them but didn't use them. However, I got the same speal from my peds office in NC as well as the WIC office in NC.

The office in NC also told me when I found out I was preggo with #2 and still nursing #1 that I would need to wean #1. I told them I didn't and wouldn't wean #2 until he was ready and weaned on his own. They told me I HAD to tell my doctor I was nursing #1 still. They also looked at me like I was an ignorant idiot for nursing while pregnant.

Both offices were fine with not vaxing either children. I just gave them our religious exemption and they haven't asked since.

As a side note I am surprised that they are trying to make the foods offered more nutritious. The only things we get are eggs, cheese, milk, cereal, juice, beans, peanut butter, carrots (baby formula and baby cereal which we don't get). The cereals they offer are fairly good for you, no sugar cereals, the don't even allow rasin brand, mostly corn flakes, chex, etc. We don't necissarily 'need' WIC but it does help to suppliment our groceries. Everything we get from WIC is an suppliment to other meals we prepare.

[s_kristina]

Originally Posted by hunnybumm

As a side note I am surprised that they are trying to make the foods offered more nutritious. The only things we get are eggs, cheese, milk, cereal, juice, beans, peanut butter, carrots (baby formula and baby cereal which we don't get). The cereals they offer are fairly good for you, no sugar cereals, the don't even allow rasin brand, mostly corn flakes, chex, etc. We don't necissarily 'need' WIC but it does help to suppliment our groceries. Everything we get from WIC is an suppliment to other meals we prepare.

What they are doing is decreasing the amounts of milk, cheese and juice. Instead they are offering fruits and veggies. I also saw something about doing jarred baby food, but I don't know if that is going to happen or not. When we had ds in for his recert the nutritionist was really excited about the changes in the food packages. She said she frequently has to deal people that the amounts of juice and milk they are giving their children aren't healthy. Trying to tell them that when the program is giving them tons of milk and juice puts her in a difficult spot. With the changes the nutritionist can advise things that actually work with the food packages they offer.

[lacysmommy]

This is a little off topic from what you're trying to find out, but it may be one reason why WIC pushes formula a little more (because it actually costs less for WIC to have a baby on formula than on breastmilk!)

The agency I work for makes a contract between a formula company nd WIC. My agency is a neutral third party that conducts the bidding process and awards a vendor for the contract.

The contract works like this: This is a rebate contract. So WIC will sign a mother up for WIC and she chooses the appropriate formula for her child (usually regular milk-based formula, which makes up a majority of the formula used, probably around 70% or so). In turn the mother gets WIC checks with the type of formula printed on the check. Unless there is a great medical need for a non-contract formula, the mother will be getting a product that is on the contract for her baby.

Once the mother purchases the formula with the WIC check, WIC pays the grocer for the formula. Periodically, WIC submits their paperwork to the formula company to receive a rebate. In the case of this contract, rebates are typically at least for 95% of the purchase price. That means if a mother buys a $20 can of formula, WIC only foots the bill for $1 of the formula after the rebate comes in.

So essentially, by having mothers on formula, which has a really great contract, they're spending less than if the mother is breastfeeding. WIC actually SAVES money by having mothers formula feed, since many of the products that breastfeeding mothers use are not on contract (exception: juice, since you have to buy a specific brand, however I do not work on the juice contract so I'm not familiar with how that one works and I have no idea what the discount is). Not only that, the steep discounts that the formula company gives WIC will raise the cost of formula for mothers who are using it who are not on WIC, which is unethical. It does state in contract documents that you aren't allowed to raise prices to allow for discounts for WIC, but I really don't know how they would be able to offer such huge rebates otherwise. IMO they're lying when they say it doesn't affect those prices. How can it not?

For the record, WIC also has a great contract for Medela breastpumps. Unfortunately even with a great contract, pumps are still expensive (a $1000 pump costs WIC only about $250 I believe) and many WIC offices simply don't have the money to spend on breastpumps.

I will be PM'ing you with a link for the contract in question. Since I currently work for the agency I would like to keep myself a little more anynomous. If anyone else would like to take a look at this document I would be more than happy to PM you the link. To protect my privacy (and my job), I will not post it on a public forum.

I hope this information helps you! I am also very interested in WIC especially since women on WIC consistantly are at lower breastfeeding rates than other populations of women.

[Drummer's Wife]

I haven't heard about any new legislation allowing wic people to come into your home.. really doubt anything like that would happen. I'd love for them to add fruit and veggies, that would be so much better then a bunch of milk. I also wish we could get organic here but it's not possible. I wish there was a way to get something in place of the rice cereal as we will not be using it, at all and I'd feel weird donating it since I don't think any babies should be eating it....

my last appt the wic lady told me I would get a medela pump after the baby is born which would be great since the motor is going out on my PIS and I can't afford to fix/replace it.

And for the most part all the ladies at my new wic office are very positive about me still nursing my 21 month old, even being pregnant. Only the dietician told me that if I wanted to wean to wear layers of hard to access clothing, but I told her no thanks we will be tandeming/

[hunnybumm]

I am truly appauled that the formula companies work so hard to save WIC money and promote formula feeding. I do know that any woman I have talked to who exclusively uses formula says the amount WIC gives doesn't supply all that she needs. So she still has to go to the store and buy 4 to 5 cans on her own. So the formula companies are getting her money from those extra 4 - 5 + cans. To me that still doesn't make a lot of sence, but they have to be making money somewhere down the line.

I would much rather have more fruits and veggies than all the milk and cereal. We do eat the cheese (we only get about 3 lbs a month, which is 6 blocks) and do use the juice. But we end up with 15 boxes of cereal, and we only 4 gallons of milk, so 5 gallons I don't even pick up at the store. And we never finish the entire gallon, it always goes bad.

As it is now in my state a nursing mother gets tuna, juice, eggs, milk, carrots, cereal. I don't like carrots, so if they were to offer fruits and different veggies (like broccilli, green beans, corn) then that would be great. I always thought they went way over board with the milk, however, most of my friends go through all of their milk.

[rozzie'sma]

My friend is on WIC and I know that she does have home visits from the nurse. I am not sure if it is mandatory though

[LLobsterTV]

WIC is implementing a program that hires women who are current or former WIC participants that have experience in bf as well. WIC is creating a peer to peer program in which they pay the mom $10 an hour up to 10 hours a week to work with other women on WIC who have a desire to BF.

In Kentucky, it's only available to a few counties, but hope to make it statewide in the next year or so. I have actually considered participating.

[KittyKat]

Constitutionally, no one has a right to enter your home without your permission or a warrant.

The social workers tried to pull some BS on us after our baby died. They actually stated they would "need to" inspect our home, I told them they would "need to" show me a warrant. Then they asked why I "felt that way" and I said because it's the law! She backed down right away, didn't expect me to have a BRAIN apparently. I was disgusted, for one, that I would be accosted in my own home the DAY after my BABY DIED, and for another that they would knowingly attempt to break the law by telling me they had to search my house when they had no legal right to do so.

What a UA violation!

When I was on WIC for a brief time last year (DH was temporarily unemployed, WIC sometimes meant the difference between not getting gorceries for that week...) they never came to my house, I had to get my mom to watch the kids and go down to the health dept.

[Leta]

I am on WIC, and man, it's complicated. I've asked the counselors at WIC repeatedly about why BF moms get $6 worth of tuna, carrots, and beans per month, but bottlefeeding moms get $80 worth of formula. All I ever get back is "Gov't contract..." Formula companies are evil.

If the gov't really wants to improve the rate of WIC participants who BF, they need to give moms the money that would have been spent on formula, even if, in the gov'ts case, that's only $5 or $10. Hospitals have implemented similar programs wherein they pay pregnant women to quit smoking, and it works. It's ridiculous, I know, good health should be its own reward. But I'm a public health student, which is essentially the study of how to change people's behavior, and the reality is, money is a FANTASTIC motivator.

Any money spent on paying moms to breastfeed will be more than offset by reduced medical expenses for infants. (And even if that infant is not on Medicaid or CHIP, we all pay for everyone's medical care folks, through our purchases and interest rates.)

[Usually Curious]

I wish WIC would just give out monetary vouchers. The milk and cheese that is allowed is not kosher. Who needs that much juice?! Even then, it's not kosher. They give no allowance for dietary restrictions.

I'd rather spend the $40 or so at the Farmer's Market!

It's not worth my time and frustration and we definitely qualify.

By the way, my local WIC office has a nutritionist who breastfed all six of her children and was in the process of weaning her 3 year old when I met with her. Also, there was a young, hispanic woman with her entire breast out nursing her 6mo and no one blinked.

[JessasMilkMama]

The only way they can enter my house is with a warrant or over my dead body

[angelpie545]

Originally Posted by rozzie'sma

My friend is on WIC and I know that she does have home visits from the nurse. I am not sure if it is mandatory though

Nope, having a public health nurse visit you in your home is an option, but most definatley is not mandatory. I don't think they would ever have enough staff, time, or energy to invest into visiting homes for as many people that are on WIC! There are only three or four public health nurses at our WIC department, I think. I had home health visits with a public health nurse when I was pregnant with #2, because she would bring me clothes for my daughter, and point me in the right direction of resources when I needed them. I was lucky though, she was a really sweet lady. I know not all of them are like that, and I probably will never participate in the program again unless I absolutely need it.