Major disagreement with DH over birth plan (X-post)

[QueenOfThePride]

I posted this in my DDC, but we're still a small group, and I'd like some more opinions.

: I'm so sad that we can't decide what to do. My deepest longing is to give birth totally by myself. I keep visualizing myself laboring in our antique claw-foot bathtub, and giving birth squatting against the living room couch, catching my own baby, totally alone in the house. All I've told DH is that I want to have a home birth. I've never implied that I don't want him there, I do want us to do this together. Every time we discuss homebirth, DH gets all , and tells me, "You're going to need an epidural just like last time. You don't remember how bad it was. You HAVE to go to the hospital. You were screaming for the epidural with the first contraction. What if something goes wrong? We need a doctor to be there. BLAH, BLAH, BLAH" It is extremely hurtful, because DH is lying to me. I did not scream for an epidural at the first contraction. The only time I screamed was only once when DS was crowning and it was involuntary. I went into labor naturally, but my contractions stopped at the hospital, so they put me on pitocin. I did not get an epidural until I had been on pitocin for 18 hours, with them cranking up the dose every half hour. (Which was a bunch of #%@& because DS was posterior and stuck behind my pelvis, and without pressure on my cervix, I wasn't dilating, despite the massively horrible contractions that just rammed DS into my pelvis.)

Since then, I've found MDC and I've educated myself so much more about birth. I do not want anything to do with the hospital. I would be perfectly happy going UP/UC. As a middle ground with DH, we discussed hiring a midwife, but we can't afford it. We get medicaid, so a hospital birth would be 100% paid for. That is also one of the major reasons DH wants to go to the hospital.

There is one more alternative. Our hospital has one CNM on staff that delivers babies at the hospital. Without even meeting her, I could guess she is a medwife, but medicaid would cover it. If we decide to see her, I would refuse most tests and exams. If I end up laboring at the hospital, I would be a smart (read difficult) patient. I would not sign a general consent for care. I would refuse all monitoring. I would refuse to get on the bed at all. I would pile my sheets and blankets on the floor to give birth. I would refuse to let anyone touch me during the birth. I would catch my own baby. I would refuse to let anyone touch me or the baby for at least an hour after the birth. I would not admit my baby to the hospital, since I would refuse eye ointment, vit K, etc. I'm sure I would need a doula to make sure my wishes were known and respected. Do you think this would work?

I am really upset that we can't come to an agreement about the birth. I've been in a melancholy mood for a few days. I'm not sure why, it might be because of this arguement, DH not supporting my wishes. Maybe it's just my hormones. I don't want to be around people or talk to people. I feel like I can't even fake being happy. I feel a strong compulsion to just be alone. I need to get centered. I feel like I haven't even bonded to this pregnancy. I feel indifferent about it. I know I need time to myself, and it's hard to find with a crazy 2yo hanging on me and whining all day. At least he is starting preschool next week for two days a week.

:

[pigpokey]

Originally Posted by QueenOfThePride

There is one more alternative. Our hospital has one CNM on staff that delivers babies at the hospital. Without even meeting her, I could guess she is a medwife, but medicaid would cover it. If we decide to see her, I would refuse most tests and exams. If I end up laboring at the hospital, I would be a smart (read difficult) patient. I would not sign a general consent for care. I would refuse all monitoring. I would refuse to get on the bed at all. I would pile my sheets and blankets on the floor to give birth. I would refuse to let anyone touch me during the birth. I would catch my own baby. I would refuse to let anyone touch me or the baby for at least an hour after the birth. I would not admit my baby to the hospital, since I would refuse eye ointment, vit K, etc. I'm sure I would need a doula to make sure my wishes were known and respected. Do you think this would work?
:

You can try.

I could not battle in labor.

Labor opens you to the greatest love, trust and interhuman commitment in the world. This fact is all too sadly overlooked by the interhumans.

[velcromom]

My dh seems to take info better from others, it is all to easy with an emotional topic for me to come off harsh or judgemental from his pov. I suggest making an appointment to sit down and discuss his fears, your prior birth, options for the upcoming birth, and your needs, with a midwife. You can have about an hour/hour and a half appointment for free, and dh can fire away questions and the midwife can discuss with him when there is and is not really a need for a doctor's presence. It has really helped my dh just to be able to ask his questions and hear the midwife's answers. Same answers I was giving him mind you, but from her he takes it in more smoothly! Just call and tell her you are considering homebirth with a fearful dh, (don't say argumentative, lol) and would like to sit down for an informational interview with her.

And while you are there you can discuss the financial aspect of hiring a midwife, there may be options for payment that you can work out together - won't know til you ask!

[Shell_Ell]

I thought medicaid covered homebirth? I saw a section in the insurance paperwork for my midwife that was specifically for medicaid. I would keep looking. You are early enough in pregnancy that you still have time to figure it all out.

If you do end up with a CNM in the hospital, could you hire a doula? I know there are many options for free doulas in the area. Please PM me if you need names (I can't remember how close you are to Madison)

I'm sorry.. my husband and I battled about our first child, but I held my ground always. This time, I haven't had to fight. And when he starts saying anything negative, I ask him to stop. I don't need that, and neither do you!

[QueenOfThePride]

The more I think about it, I could see myself going with the hospital CNM. I'll have to meet her and get a feel for her style. It depends on if she would support my off-the-wall birth plans. And DH would be able to simmer down and be supportive knowing we would go to the hospital, even though mentally, I won't really be surrendering my care.

I don't think medicaid covers homebirth. I was looking at a potential midwife's website and it said medicaid doesn't cover her services.

[LavenderMae]

Medicaid does cover homebirths in my state, I would definitely check it out. I would call a homebirth midwife and ask not the medicaid office though.

[kathan12904]

There is no hope for us as women to take back birth from hospitals, insurance companies, and invasive practitioners until we have claimed it in our own lives. I understand that a conflict between partners over this very important event can escalate quickly and has much more factors and emotions to it that just control or disagreement, but we must be able to stand our ground and convince our closest family and friends of our rights in order to have any hope of making real changes in the way our culture views and treats birth. This is certainly not directed at anyone specifically or the OP, it is a strongly held belief and hope for the women who have fight so hard for the birth that they deserve. In the same way that women were not given the right to vote or recieve equality in the world at large without organized movement that included ticking off more than a few husbands, women will not be recognized as the strong birth warriors that they are until we can come together as community and show our strength and power to our partners. Good luck, OP, and do not give up. This is your birth and your decision and that takes precidence over any one else's views, including DH. Not that his view doesn't count, but maybe he can decide what you should do for birth when it is him in the driver's seat.

[Shell_Ell]

PM'ed you.. be forewarned there's A LOT of information. lol!

[FreeThinkinMama]

Originally Posted by QueenOfThePride

The more I think about it, I could see myself going with the hospital CNM. I'll have to meet her and get a feel for her style. It depends on if she would support my off-the-wall birth plans. And DH would be able to simmer down and be supportive knowing we would go to the hospital, even though mentally, I won't really be surrendering my care.

I don't think medicaid covers homebirth. I was looking at a potential midwife's website and it said medicaid doesn't cover her services.

I think having a midwife (even a cnm) in the hospital is a fair compromise with your dh. Interview the cnm and also take a tour at the hospital to get a feel for their philosophy. Like you said you'll have to be diligant about standing up for yourself and educated about all the possible interventions. I'm planning on having a hospital birth and thinking about switching to a CNM now at the last minute. Even a mom who plans a homebirth could potentially be transferred to a hospital and should be prepared on how to handle that situation. Also look into finding a doula, someone who can be an advocate for you.

[nznats]

Originally Posted by QueenOfThePride

My deepest longing is to give birth totally by myself. I keep visualizing myself laboring in our antique claw-foot bathtub, and giving birth squatting against the living room couch, catching my own baby, totally alone in the house.

I feel a strong compulsion to just be alone. I need to get centered. I feel like I haven't even bonded to this pregnancy. I feel indifferent about it.

I just wanted to say... I felt this way when pregnant with my daughter. I felt she should have been freebirthed, I felt and dreamt about how she was meant to be born. I went against that, and chose a midwife, chose to go to a birthing centre. The midwife turned out to be awful, letting me down, performing interventions that in the end resulted in a transfer to a hospital 20 mins away, where I had synto, epi and a c-section.
Im not saying this to scare you, or even to say I think this will happen to you, but from my experience going against my intution because of other people (we dont have the money/insurance issues because maternity is fully covered by our government) resulted in a detroying result for me.

I wish I could offer a suggestion on what to do, but other than finding a midwife that you can pay off, or plan a freebirth, but go to the hsopital for prenatals and lie to your hubby in regards to your plans, and in the end you could just not tell him till the last possible moment about being in labour and then refuse to go to the hospital. The problem with that is the tension in labour and then him possibly calling 911 on your which would be far from what you want.

I hope in the end you get the result you are happy with, and I wish you a safe and happy pregnancy!

[Lisa Lubner]

you could always make a plan to labor at home as long as possible. that's what i did with my last birth (since it was illegal for a midwife to attend a homebirth vbac)... i labored alone in my room, and by the time i came out into the living room (where my DH was) to call the midwife, i was already in transition. by the time we got to her office i was 9cm! at that point the hospital (who did NOT want to "allow" me to vbac) didn't have any sway at all since i was already so far along. remember, you don't HAVE to do anything you don't want to do. if you don't want to go on the monitor, then don't. if you don't want eye drops or vitamin K, then refuse them. sometimes, you can fill out the refusal forms and turn them in before you're even admitted to the hospital to give birth. just make sure your husband is on board with you for these things, so that if there's any point where you are seperated from your baby he can go wherever they take him/her and make sure they honor your requests. if there is only ONE midwife at the hospital where you might birth, chances are she will be seeing to more than one birth while you are there and will leave you alone for the most part.

good luck!

[QueenOfThePride]

Yes, I'd imagine that if we do 'plan' to go to the hospital, I'd labor at home as long as possible, and if, OOOOPS! we didn't make it in time, that would be OK with me! LOL

[WinterBaby]

Originally Posted by QueenOfThePride

Every time we discuss homebirth, DH gets all , and tells me, "You're going to need an epidural just like last time. You don't remember how bad it was. You HAVE to go to the hospital. You were screaming for the epidural with the first contraction. What if something goes wrong? We need a doctor to be there. BLAH, BLAH, BLAH" It is extremely hurtful, because DH is lying to me. I did not scream for an epidural at the first contraction. The only time I screamed was only once when DS was crowning and it was involuntary. I went into labor naturally, but my contractions stopped at the hospital, so they put me on pitocin. I did not get an epidural until I had been on pitocin for 18 hours, with them cranking up the dose every half hour.

This is the part that would have me really uspset if I were in your position. To feel like I'd been a strong amazing birthing woman, and to have my husband express such a radically differentjperception of me as somehow more weak and needy would be extremely hurtful to me. It's about the place where I'd be throwing down and forbidding him to be at the next birth. However, that's not exactly helpful for anything. To put it in the other direction, it probably means your husband felt terrified and vulnerable during your birth. He remembers how bad it was - for him. To say you were screaming for the epidural from the first might really mean he was very traumatized by your pain and wanting the epidural from the first. In all, it sounds like your birth was traumatic for him, and I don't really know how you address that as you move towards what really feels like it's going to be better for you. You can work through your own fear, how do you shoulder someone else's? I, for one, don't know. But I'd still feel hurt and angered by his words.

[QueenOfThePride]

I am so mad! I talked to DH last night, and we sort of got things ironed out. I told him he hurt my feelings by saying I wanted an epi right away and he apologized. Then he told me why he said it... My OB told him at some point, (away from me) that I hadn't really felt any contractions yet, and when they actually start, that it would be really bad, and I would be in a lot of pain and I would want an epi. (Or something like that, I don't remember the exact wording.) I am so beyond ! I am never going back to that hospital! They wouldn't recognize a laboring woman if she smacked them with a placenta. I hadn't had any contractions yet? I labored at home for ten hours with what...gas pains? And why did DH keep this from me?

[jessjgh1]

Originally Posted by QueenOfThePride

Every time we discuss homebirth, DH gets all , and tells me, "You're going to need an epidural just like last time. You don't remember how bad it was. You HAVE to go to the hospital. You were screaming for the epidural with the first contraction. What if something goes wrong? We need a doctor to be there. BLAH, BLAH, BLAH"

Essentially, he wants me to turn myself over to a professional, because that would make him more comfortable?

Wow, I could have written most of what you wrote about my dh, too. I'm stressed out enough about it, and I have not even made up my mind that homebirth is what I want to do. Well, that's not really true. I just need to sort out the complications that I had at the end of my last pregnancy to make sure that doesn't preclude me from having a homebirth-- I feel very strongly that homebirth is my best option- I just hadn't planned to get into a conflict about it yet. Luckily it should be covered by our insurance.

My dh already accused me of wanting a homebirth only to make me feel better about the way my last birth went--- like I'm in a contest to be the 'best' MDC mom, or something. He's already told me that I'll end up needing an epidural again and that it was a "GOOD thing" I was in the hospital.

In fact, it was a good thing that everyone at his office or their wives (and sisters and sister in laws) was in the hospital too... because x, y, and z happened requiring, a, b, and c, ending up with epidural, c-section, c-section.... Grrr, I think my head almost exploded.

And he refuses to have our son involved in the birth. Which is another HUGE stressful conflict for me.

I didn't post to compare notes...sorry for my rant.... but I think that birth was very stressful for my dh (and sounds like for yours)... and this is often the way that he reacts to that-- by being overly protective, falling back on what is comfortable to him (listening to the doctor), wanting to play it safe, etc. Being scared of change and something that is not the norm.

But it is frustrating when he is unwilling to talk about what the real issue is-- or read up on homebirth safety or talk to a midwife or attend a seminar.

BUT IT IS SOOO EARLY. I know from past conflicts I have to give it time and allow him to soak it in.

It is just so frustrating to NOT have that support and secureness NOW. And to have to spend time and energy navigating a conflict. I did that for Joshua's birth and I was looking forward to not having the conflicts again ( )

Kathan: There is no hope for us as women to take back birth from hospitals, insurance companies, and invasive practitioners until we have claimed it in our own lives.....
it is a strongly held belief and hope for the women who have fight so hard for the birth that they deserve. In the same way that women were not given the right to vote or recieve equality in the world at large without organized movement that included ticking off more than a few husbands, women will not be recognized as the strong birth warriors that they are until we can come together as community and show our strength and power to our partners.

Good luck, OP, and do not give up. This is your birth and your decision and that takes precidence over any one else's views, including DH. Not that his view doesn't count, but maybe he can decide what you should do for birth when it is him in the driver's seat.

THANK YOU so much for saying this. It has challenged me and kept me going the last few days-- I've been lurking around for a little while now- hadn't want to go 'public' yet online- this pregnancy is still sinking in.

I truly think that this is right that women should not to fight to have birth the way they want it. Emily, I understand feeling that you could go through a hospital birth fighting every step for what you want-- but you SHOULD NOT have to do that. And your dh probably knows you well enough to understand that you will do exactly that-- and how will that allow you to relax and concentrate on having your baby? How will that contribute to a healthy birth? How will that alleviate stress?

Take the money factor out. If you could have your ideal birth, what would that be? Now, is it money that is getting in the way of that? That might not solve the problem- unless homebirth ends up being covered by insurance, but it might be a way to get dh to see what the goals are and work around the obstacles instead of putting the blinders on.

I hope you can find a way to get your dh on board. Good news is that you have time on your side!

Jessica

[Romana]

My OB told him at some point, (away from me) that I hadn't really felt any contractions yet, and when they actually start, that it would be really bad, and I would be in a lot of pain and I would want an epi.

Wow, what arrogance. I know we see this all the time, but still - OBs who believe more in what the monitors tell them than what the mom tells them. :

We planned a UC with the understanding that, as a FTM, if anything made us uncomfortable or worried during the labor (over and above all the other things we talked about specifically beforehand, like cord prolapse, meconium, SROM w/out labor, etc. etc. etc.) we would transfer to the hospital. I ended up just pushing at the hospital and what I really needed was a little help to know that I could start pushing (I'd been waiting for 7 hrs) and how to push effectively. Next time I'll have a much better understanding of the signals my body is giving me.

I'm so sorry your dh isn't on board. I would consider a very late transfer in your circumstances. Sounds like you labor strong and beautifully, so I'd take care of yourself and labor at home as long as you feel you can (and if that means Ooops!, then so be it) and only go to the hospital at the very end of labor if necessary. That way you can be prepared for the hospital with the midwife and a doula, etc., but possibly still UC if it works out that way.

It's not your ideal, but it may be a workable compromise. One of the big reasons to wait to go to the hospital until the very end is because if you arrive complete and ready to push, they can't really do much of anything to you except let you give birth (simply because there is no time). If you have a provider set up ahead of time that knows what you want, hopefully there will be little interference. And then if you DO need to transfer for any kind of complication earlier in labor (or just exhaustion or whatever), you know that you have SOME relationship with the person who would be assisting and they have some knowledge of your wants/needs.

Sorry to go on and on. I hope you find a solution that you feel comfortable with. I, too, would not be able to spend all of labor fighting my attendant and/or policy.

I just wanted to add that I think it's crucial, especially since your dh is not totally on-board, that you have a doula present for the time you spend at the hospital. I wouldn't want the interference at home while laboring, but those little whispers in your ear can be extraordinarily helpful. My doula was invaluable for just that reason, at just the right time. She was only present for 30 mins of labor (pushing) but it was worth it.

Julia
dd almost 9mos

[QueenOfThePride]

Whoa! Congratulations Jessica! We're preggo together again!

The money issue might be solved. I just put in a resume for a job that I would love, and that I am highly qualified for, and that pays an awesome wage. If I get it, that would fix pretty much everything. It's a FT job, and for the longest time, I didn't want to work FT and have to put DS in daycare FT. But lately he has been begging all day long every day to go play with his friends, so I think he would like it.

DH and I are coming to more of an agreement about home birth. I wrote a list of interview questions for midwives, and asked DH if he had any questions to add, and he said he didn't.