Critique this scenario, please - Page 5

[WuWei]

Originally Posted by thismama

Well it sure can be draining, especially if you get caught up in a million little dramas like this one. Is how I see it.

I don't get how seeing relationships with our children as full-on partnerships is accurate. So, like do you pay the rent and the toddler does the utilities and groceries? You work days, they work nights?

It is not a partnership. It is a parent-child relationship.

No, I wanted to have a baby for a long time and was 38 when I got pregnant and I had a hard time conceiving and ds adds so much joy to our life that I guess the extra trips through the checkout and longer time in the grocery store just don't seem like drama to me. Dh does a million little things for me and I for him too. We see these as being in relationship; and giving to each other ADDS joy to our own life.

But, as a partnership, I mean that no one is the boss over another person. We each discuss our feelings and needs and work together to find solutions where everyone is satisfied. That just is easier than struggling over every little thing, imo.

Pat

[thismama]

Originally Posted by rmzbm

Well, to be fair, I just reread it & it wasn't as bad as the 1st time, LOL, originally I read it as "I wipe your butt - so I own you" which, clearly, you didn't mean.

No, I'm not all hardcore like that. I go in for working with my child, and then there is a limit, kwim?

Like, we were just at Chapters today, in a hurry. I told her that we could play with the toys, but when our friend was done, we had to go.

So, she was spreading out the Dora videos , and our friend came up.

I said, "Okay, time to go!"

Her: "No, I'm not ready yet!"

Me: "Okay, should I count to ten?"

Her: "No! Thirty!"

So I count to 30, nice and slow.

Her: "No! I didn't mean 30 like that! You have to try again!"

Me: "Nah, dude. We gotta go."

Her: Does the funky chicken on the floor.

Me: "I'm gonna pick you up now buddy, coz we hafta go."

So, I pick her up and head for the door. She pulls it together in a few minutes, and gets into a game of trying to find our friend.

I try for the balance. But I do believe in the mama authority and the power to make some decisions.

[The4OfUs]

Originally Posted by rmzbm

Yes, it is a parent-child relationship...but can't you both STILL be equals? Noone in the family unit should be more or less than another member.

I know I'm not in on your personal convo with thismama , but here is where my disconnect comes in. I don't see my children as "less" than me and DH. I DO, however, see them as less *capable* (by merit of their lack of life experience and their level of brain development) of understanding some things, of thinking as abstractly, and of feeling the empathy and impulse control (they're still both under 3) needed to be able to participate equally in problem solving for all situations.

So, that's why I'm unable to completely dive into the 100% partnership dynamic with my children.

Again, just anotehr random thought to cyberspace..I htink I'm working out a lot of things for myself on this thread!

[rmzbm]

I think children are much wiser than we could ever hope to be. Their innate wisdom isn't scewed like ours.

That said, thismama - we were in Booksamillion like a week ago & that's how it played out with my 4 YO. "I am PLAYING with THOMAS and the TRAINS right now!" : Boy, did I have my work cut out for me that day...

[georgia]

Critique this scenario, please

At the grocery store today, DS (4) got a piece of cheese from the deli lady. DD (1.5) wanted some too. I guess I could have asked for another piece, but I didn't.

If it were me, I'd have simply asked for another piece of cheese. Knowing my dc the way I do, requesting another piece so that everyone could have their own would be the most effective way to ensure my cartriders were happy. Happy cartriders, happy mama. It's all good Of course, we don't eat dairy, so this whole cheese scenario is moot

I don't, at least for most mamas I know around here, believe it's a matter of not having a backbone---just simply different priorities, needs and paradigms.

[The4OfUs]

Originally Posted by rmzbm

I think children are much wiser than we could ever hope to be. Their innate wisdom isn't scewed like ours.

I think there's wisdom, and then there's:
I want to go to the playground (which is not within walking distance)
But I don't want to get in the car
But I want to go to the playground
But I don't want to get in the car
No, I don't want to play in the back yard instead
No, I don't want to take a walk instead
No, I don't want to do anything else, I want to go to the playground.
But I don't want to get in the car.


So, I put him in the car. He has a great time at the park, and forgets he DID NOT want to be in the car 5 minutes before.

Maybe it's just my kid. :

[sunnysideup]

Originally Posted by georgia

I don't, at least for most mamas I know around here, believe it's a matter of not having a backbone---just simply different priorities, needs and paradigms.

[thismama]

Originally Posted by WuWei

No, I wanted to have a baby for a long time and was 38 when I got pregnant and I had a hard time conceiving and ds adds so much joy to our life that I guess the extra trips through the checkout and longer time in the grocery store just don't seem like drama to me.

See, I wanted to have a baby for a long time too. And, still some things seem like unnecessary drama to me. So I take what I perceive as the easiest, most straightforward route outta those things as I can, while feeling like I am respecting my child and myself.

But, as a partnership, I mean that no one is the boss over another person. We each discuss our feelings and needs and work together to find solutions where everyone is satisfied. That just is easier than struggling over every little thing, imo.

I aim for discussion and working together. But I don't find it always possible. She is *3*. So... if it comes down to it, I have the authority. I'm comfortable with that, it is what seems 'easier' to me. If I can find a consensual way outta things, I take it. Often I can't.

[thismama]

Originally Posted by rmzbm

I think children are much wiser than we could ever hope to be. Their innate wisdom isn't scewed like ours.

See, I think this is a romanticised view of children, that can really give them more power than they need or want, or is good for them. I am the mama. My child is not my guide. I mean, in some deep ways I would say yes she is my guide, but in the context of the fact that I am *her* guide. Like, the teacher may learn from the student, but the teacher is the teacher. Kwim?

That said, thismama - we were in Booksamillion like a week ago & that's how it played out with my 4 YO. "I am PLAYING with THOMAS and the TRAINS right now!" : Boy, did I have my work cut out for me that day...

Yeah, now that sounds like my reality a lot of the time.

[thismama]

Originally Posted by georgia

If it were me, I'd have simply asked for another piece of cheese.

I might well do this too. If the worker was still right there, if s/he seemed open to the request, if it wouldn't have been a big deal (hunt her down, interrupt another customer, ask for something that is already put away). But I wouldn't feel like I *had* to do this, had to go out of my way, to avoid upsetting my child who wouldn't share. If I did it, it would be out of consideration for their feelings and wanting to make life easier for everyone. If it was an easy option for me.

Otherwise, share!

[thismama]

Originally Posted by The4OfUs

Maybe it's just my kid. :

That's what I think a lot in these conversations. We should get our kidlets together! Pair of freaks.

[*LoveBugMama*]

Originally Posted by The4OfUs

I think there's wisdom, and then there's:
I want to go to the playground (which is not within walking distance)
But I don't want to get in the car
But I want to go to the playground
But I don't want to get in the car
No, I don't want to play in the back yard instead
No, I don't want to take a walk instead
No, I don't want to do anything else, I want to go to the playground.
But I don't want to get in the car.


So, I put him in the car. He has a great time at the park, and forgets he DID NOT want to be in the car 5 minutes before.

Maybe it's just my kid. :

And mine.

I think I understand how you feel. I am also feeling like I am somewhere in the middle. But if I had to choose, I think Thismama`s posts feel more right to me.

[littleaugustbaby]

I think you handled it well, OP. And I agree with everything thismama said.

[Kylix]

I haven't read the whole thread but just reading the first couple pages, it brought up a thought I have had for the past couple years.

One generalization I have noticed (and I realize there are exceptions) is that I have noticed that parents who are very capitalistic politically expect their children to share whereas parents who are more socialistic in nature tell their children they do not have to share. It kind of doesn't make sense to me.

Anyone else notice this?


Kylix

[WuWei]

Well, I am a laissez faire capitalist and don't expect sharing; but we live consensually.

Pat

[the_lissa]

Originally Posted by Kylix

I haven't read the whole thread but just reading the first couple pages, it brought up a thought I have had for the past couple years.

One generalization I have noticed (and I realize there are exceptions) is that I have noticed that parents who are very capitalistic politically expect their children to share whereas parents who are more socialistic in nature tell their children they do not have to share. It kind of doesn't make sense to me.

Anyone else notice this?


Kylix

I'm a socialist, and I try to foster sharing.

[thismama]

Originally Posted by the_lissa

I'm a socialist, and I try to foster sharing.

Me too. That's an interesting observation, tho, Kylix.

[mumto2]

Thismama - you are sensible. I agree with everythng you have said.

The issue isn't really about the cheese imo. In our family, it just does not happen that one person has a 'windfall', particularly a consumable windfall, and that person will enjoy it without sharing with the others.

I cannot fathom a situation where it would be OK in our family for one child to be feeling upset and left out because the other would not share something as trivial as a piece of cheese!! And from the op is sounds as if it were a particularly generous piece.

It just isn't OK for one to have in abundance and one to be without.

My dc are 5 and 8. We have always expected and facilitated sharing, though not always an equal share. They have an extremely close sibling relationship along the lines of 'How can I be happy when my sister is so upset and am able to fix that?"

Now I am all for being gentle, but a firm gentle. I'm not going to leave younger child crying while older child takes all the time he wants to decide if he is going to treat sister with common kindness.

IME, when the expectation for being aware of the needs of all family members is clear, it becomes second nature. When the mighty individual rules, we have all the world wide problems of poverty and third world debt...... but thats a whole 'nother issue.

[dani76]

Has anyone thought about the idea that maybe his sister wasn't hungry? She just wanted what her brother had. Should DS be expected to hand over or share whatever he has just because his sister wants it?

Are we teaching the sister that all she has to do is ask and she receives? Don't both children need to learn that some things belong to us individually?

Just putting a different spin on this.

[WuWei]

It just isn't OK for one to have in abundance and one to be without.

I believe in an abundant Universe and that there is plenty to share. Therefore, it isn't necessary to force sharing, imo, because there are unlimited possibilities for meeting needs.

Pat