Am I a bad person (pg mentioned)??

[BCFD]

I don't know how I'm going to do this - I have to hear for 9 more months about a really good friend's pregnancy. She has been through an awful lot trying to get pg (many IVF's and failed cycles) and also had success a couple of years ago with her 5th or 6th IVF cycle. And of course it's sounding like twins so it will be b/g twins, because everybody has this kind of luck in the fertility game (that's sarcasm because I'm feeling VERY sarcastic today).

While I am thrilled that it worked for her and she will be giving her child a sibling (or siblings), there is still a very dark place within me that is so angry that it worked for her. I am so blessed to have my children (2 beauties through adoption) and I love them with all my heart. I have thought about this and feel so incredibly thankful that none of my IVF cycles actually worked because I wouldn't have THEM!!! I go through this sometimes when I hear about a friend or family member who is pg. It's not something I dwell on anymore and honestly I am so thankful for my own path and my children and the family we have created. I'm also a huge advocate for adoption since going through the process twice now.

So, why do I feel so bad? How can I look at my kids, that I would absolutely take a bullet for without hesitation, and actually still feel anger towards failed IVF cycles? I have really been thinking about this through the years and it's not so much the "baby" that makes me angry, it's the fact that somebody else actually "won" the IVF/fertility "game". ::::sigh:::: Does this feeling every truly go away? I feel so guilty sometimes, but it is so NOT a reflection on my children and the fact that we adopted. I just hate the fact that I didn't actually succeed and have a pregnancy after all those years of being caught up in IUI's and IVF. I always say that I wish I didn't ever choose the pg path first and wish we would have gone straight to adoption because something about the fertility journey can make you a cold, bitter, angry woman even after you become a mom. But then I'm glad we did have that experience because if not, we would have completely different children and that thought makes me sick to my stomach. So, I have to THANK the universe for making me endure all those years of IVF....because it makes me who I am today. It's such a vicious circle. We still have a bunch of embies and I honestly dread having to make the decision to use them and possibly get pg. So, it's not like we can't ever try again. I almost don't want to be pg, ya know? But there is still that 1% yearning to experience what it would be like. I want to be big and fat and feel a baby kicking and moving around. I want the souvenirs of ultrasounds. I just wish this 1% of me would go away forever.

God, it's so hard to explain, but I figured if anybody would understand, it would be you guys. I am just so tired of being angry and snapping at DP over little things when I hear about things like this. I love my children so much that I get teary eyed every day at some point because I feel like I am the luckiest woman on the earth. When I hold them and look at them and kiss them it just feels SO right!!! We had such an EASY path with adoption and when it all comes down to it, I am so very thankful that we stopped IVF treatments and adopted!! They are my everything and they are everything that matters most to me in this world. I just feel so many horrible emotions when IVF actually works for somebody else and I wind up really kicking myself for being such a bad person.

I just don't know how I'm going to get through the next 9 months hearing about "the baby kicking" and "the baby hiccuping" and the ultrasounds, the countdown of "I'm 23w4d today" and "I'm 23w5d today" and every freakin' little detail that I had to miss out on with my babies.

Somebody say something to make this better. : My DP is a huge help and always tells me that we have our own story of how our children came to us, but it doesn't help make the bitter feelings go away. Does it ever end? How do those of you with no bio children cope with this?

[dinade]

Hmm I lost lots of babies through msc and still get angry when a teenager gets pg and delivers. I think it's the knowing of what we're missing like we're still not whole. I don't know if what I'm saying is making sense I'm ahving trouble wording it. I'm sorry mama. Hugs and hopefully these feelings will subside some.

[Diane B]

I don't know if this will help or not...

but I do think it might help to unlink your grief from your kids, if that makes sense. What I mean is that how you feel about not having success with IVF has nothing to do with loving or not loving your kids, or being or not being grateful for them. It is what it is, which is grief, and grief comes and goes. You didn't get something that you wanted very much, and now someone else did, and it's painful. And it doesn't have a lot to do with the here and now, with how much you love your children and all the rest. I am a very contented, adoptive mom, and I didn't try all that hard to become pregnant in the first place because I always wanted to adopt. Still, I don't care to be reminded much about that very difficult, emotionally painful time. Of course you don't either.

I don't know how close you are to this friend, but people tend to be self-obsessed during pregnancy (or during the adoption process for that matter - it's just all-consuming) and so she may not get a subtle hint. How about something like, "Gosh, I really want to be supportive, but you know, I wasn't able to conceive through IVF, and sometimes, it's still a little painful. I'm very happy for you, but I just can't hear every detail, ok?" I think a good friend will understand.

Please be gentle and kind with your grief, and I'm quite sure it will ease with time.

[Sierra]

BCFD,

One of my very, very best friends in the whole world just got pregnant. It was after many years of trying and the whole subfertility roller coaster...all the interventions, etc. There is no one in the world I wanted this for more. I truly wanted her to get pregnant. I prayed that she would. I was so sad for her each cycle when she didn't. She and I started trying at the same time (though I always knew adoption was *also* in our family plans, whereas for her, it wasn't something she considered until after she had been on the subfertility journey for quite some time), and here I am with two beautiful children who truly are my world...so I want nothing more than for my friend to finally experience parenthood and the joys I get to experience daily because I am a mother.

Yet, we also started trying to get pregnant at the same time, and I still am not pregnant (though I am taking a break from trying until we know better what will happen with dfd). And there is this part of me that will always grieve, even when I have largely moved past the pain. There is a part of me that will be sad for my own loss even as I am absolutely overjoyed for my friend.

We've discussed this a lot on here, and it truly has nothing to do with my kids. I couldn't possibly love them more, not if I gave birth to them or for any other reason. I too find myself brought to tears daily by the intensity of my feelings for them.

This sadness isn't about my children. It has to do with the fact that I very much wanted to experience a healthy pregnancy and birth at some point, and that has happened in my life yet. I had a previous loss too, that makes it that much more painful.

So I guess I am just saying I relate.

I did find myself feeling, right after my friend shared her wonderful news with me, already sort of distant from her. I think it was my emotional protection mechanisms kicking in. And I also found myself, when I asked her about her meds and what worked this time, and she told me she had already determined this would be her last cycle and that she was going to adopt and not keep trying if it didn't work...but that it had worked and she thought in part because she had reached the point where she didn't "care so much" anymore...I just felt resentful. Like that was some magic pill. But again, this is one of my very best friends in the world. And I don't want to transfer my grief over to her for the duration of her pregnancy...and if I do, the friendship will likely slip away. So I did find myself making a very conscious decision that I was just not going to think about how this was a pregnancy, and totally focus my energy on this little baby and how much I am going to love him or her when s/he is here. And how I want our kids to be like cousins. And so on. Because five years down the line, this is going to mean so little, and I want to still have this friendship so I can have that, know what I mean? So I just bought a bunch of stuff for the baby and mailed it out to my friend (who doesn't live in my same town) for Christmas. The baby isn't here yet, but somehow it made me feel better to start thinking about him or her and not the pregnancy, you know? So I spent way too much money and my dw is going to "kill me," but I just felt like I needed to affirm for myself that I was going to maintain this friendship instead of distancing myself. So that's where I am at.

[Sierra]

P.S. If it is helpful, you could think about it like this. A mother who has one child die can grieve that child's death without loving her living children any less. She can still miss that child and wish that child were alive without it meaning that she doesn't appreciate her living children.

[BCFD]

Thank you everybody, you have no idea how much I appreciate you taking the time to really "spell it out" for me. I just need this kind of support right now and I appreciate the time you have taken to post.

I think what also makes me really angry is that people view adoption as the "last choice". Like, "if I can't have a bio baby then I guess I'll settle for adoption". I know it's mean to stereotype like that and that isn't the case for everybody, but it just seems like that sometimes. Sometimes I feel so resentful when I hear people going through 7 IVF cycles trying for a bio baby when they easily could have started the adoption process. It just feels like a slap in the face and almost like they are saying, "that's nice you have kids, but we want our own." We did do a lot of IVF cycles, but only because my insurance covered it. I honestly wish I would have looked into adoption instead of assuming that all adoptions cost $50K. It's ironic that in the long run we spent $40K+ in IVF.

I think the other thing that really makes me so incredibly sad is an AP mother's group that I joined a year ago (I don't associate with these women anymore) made me feel like less of a mom because I didn't nurse my children at the breast. I mean, to my face they were very supportive and understanding, but I'd get those looks like, "You poor barren woman, you'll never feel a baby kick you from the inside and nourish them from your breast". All they did was sit around and discuss birth stories and their past pregnancies in front of me knowing how very sensitive I was to the subject. It was to the point that I embarked on adoptive breastfeeding (had very LITTLE success doing that) and nursed my baby for 6 months using a Lact-Aid because I felt like it was the only way I would be a REAL mom. My supply could only be measured in cc's, not oz's, and I just gave up. I honestly do think that breastmilk is the absolute best thing for a baby and consider myself to be an advocate for other women pursuing ABF, but it just always feels like such a slap in the face to me when mom's with bio babies dis me for using a bottle and formula (like, what else am I supposed to do?). It's like I am less of a mother because I can't provide this for my child....and it hurts more than anybody will ever know.

Maybe I'm just in a really bad place right now and feeling uber sensitive about it, so please forgive me if I am offending anybody. Thanks again for listening to me and offering support. I sure need it right now.

p.s. Diane, you are so right about separating this from my children. I was trying to convey that because I never want people to think it's about that. I can't imagine my life with any other little babies in my life. My kids are my world and it's really not about biology. ::::sigh:::: Thanks again for listening....

[Sierra]

Originally Posted by BCFD

I think what also makes me really angry is that people view adoption as the "last choice". Like, "if I can't have a bio baby then I guess I'll settle for adoption". . . .It just feels like a slap in the face and almost like they are saying, "that's nice you have kids, but we want our own."

I think I know what you mean. Everyone comes to adoption in their own way, and even recently here on a thread I defended that. I am not in a position to judge another mama experiencing the pain of infertility, and I certainly feel joyful for families who are adopting no matter what brought them to their decision. Nonetheless, though, when someone close to me keeps trying and trying and trying, mentioning that after this or that they will consider adoption, it can feel like they are saying my family wouldn't be good enough for them. They're not saying it, but it is as if somewhere deep down inside them they are feeling that if they adopted they'd be "settling" (which hurts because what they'd be "settling" for is what my family has/is).

Now before anybody misunderstands, let me say that then I think, yeah, but they are trying for the very thing that I wanted so badly-- a chance to carry a healthy pregnancy and give birth. That is what they are fighting so hard to have. It's not about the kids, at all. Once they would become an adoptive family, if they don't know that already, they would find it out right away.

A child, however the child arrives, is-- for most of us in this world (and I recognize there are times when this is not the case, but I think I am speaking for most adoptive parents)-- never a second choice in the heart of his or her parents.

And their pain at the idea of not having that pregnancy certainly is not about *my family*. At least as far as the people I know (and again, I know there are other cases...but I am talking about the people in my life with whom I have had this experience), I truly don't believe that these people are looking at my family and thinking, "oh, they are a second rate family." They are just thinking of that pregnancy they so badly want to experience. Just as I grieve my loss of my first, and just as I grieve not having had a healthy pregnancy and birth, they are grieving and holding onto any hope they can find that they can have that experience of entering into parenthood through pregnancy and birth.

And in a few cases, they eventually do get to have that experience. But lots of us don't. I always knew I would adopt, so when I started struggling with my fertility, it was like, "well, I really would love to have a healthy pregnancy and birth, but what I would love more is to have my baby in my arms...not potentially years down the line, but soon. So why not adopt first, and try again later if at all?" And for me, I have had the approach in building my family so far of trying all angles...and then whatever happens first....

My idea is that if I try to have a child in many different ways, I am more likely to have a child sooner than if I go down just one avenue. And I am always eager to meet my babies, so I am all about things that speed up the process of them getting here. As in, for example, trying to get pregnant while also getting foster-adopt licensed, while also trying to find a private agency that might be a good match to do an adoption through, while also doing a search for some parents who are looking to do an adoption plan for their child. In both cases of my ds and dfd (who I pray hard will become my dd), foster-adopt was by far the fastest route. And that was great because my heart was about to burst with such eagerness to start getting to know my children. But I recognize that the process happens so differently for everyone.

I think part of the issue is that in society, adoption still isn't fully honored in realistic ways for the gift that it is. It is either seen as a "secondary option" to "cure infertility," or seen as philanthropically minded parents coming in to rescue "needy children." Neither of these are realistic depictions of adoption. Adoption can absolutely be a first choice, and a happy, wonderful choice that isn't intended to cure infertility but is intended to help families grow. And it isn't about children needing to be rescued. In the best cases, it is about parents and children who both need one another. And about an adoption triangle and what is best for everyone. Am I making sense? This is a hard thing to express in words, and I am terribly afraid of being misunderstood because I know this is a sensitive topic for all...infertile folks, parents who have adopted, folks who have been adopted, and birthparents.

I think the other thing that really makes me so incredibly sad is an AP mother's group that I joined a year ago (I don't associate with these women anymore) made me feel like less of a mom because I didn't nurse my children at the breast.

What I hear you saying is that basically, it's like the world can act like adoption makes us less of mothers somehow, even if the world accepts our children as the blessings they are.

It is hard. I have always been really, really open about our whole adoption process, and I am so glad that the folks in my life have always treated us like terrific parents.

At the same time, when I would shop at the food coop, for example, I used to feel like people were staring at me and thinking awful things about me when I'd have to bottlenurse ds. One time a man at Circuit City of all places did attack me for not breastfeeding, and then when I told him I was an adoptive mommy he started barraging me with all kinds of overly personal questions in a really judgemental way...but most of the time it has been the looks I get, not the things people have said, that have been hard.

These days, I no longer think twice. I don't even wonder about what people are thinking. And I am not really looking to see how they are responding. Sometimes I will catch a glance of someone looking at me funny, and I always just give them a sticky sweet smile and go on and nurture my baby as I bottlenurse. And I like to think that seeing me being a nurturing bottlenurser will help those folks think more about the assumptions they were making about us. Because I know deep in my heart that I am an awesome mother who didn't have the choice to breastfeed but who does one heck of a job being a loving bottlenurser. And I know in my heart that my kids and I are no less bonded for it.

But again, it helps that I have such a supportive, great community around my family in which people know our story and think it is as beautiful as we do.

All they did was sit around and discuss birth stories and their past pregnancies in front of me knowing how very sensitive I was to the subject.

It's tough because on one hand, that may have been a lot of what they had in common, but on the other hand, all the folks I have met up with have always been great about talking plenty just about the daily parenting stuff we can all relate to. I am sorry you had that experience.

It was to the point that I embarked on adoptive breastfeeding (had very LITTLE success doing that) and nursed my baby for 6 months using a Lact-Aid because I felt like it was the only way I would be a REAL mom.

Did you do this before or after you adopted? Here, this isn't a viable option in almost all cases for foster-adoptive parents, at least until after the adoption is complete (and usually that is so far down the line it is that much more of a struggle...ds absolutely was freaked out when I tried a couple times after our adoption...and I decided not to pursue it because well, it wasn't good for him to freak out like that).

I honestly do think that breastmilk is the absolute best thing for a baby and consider myself to be an advocate for other women pursuing ABF,

Me too. And I also think I am a huge advocate of breastfeeding in general...

but it just always feels like such a slap in the face to me when mom's with bio babies dis me for using a bottle and formula (like, what else am I supposed to do?).

Yeah, that is totally lame.

[DeannaK]

Adoption doesn't cure infertility.

For me, I became a mom through the miracle of adoption but I still battle with infertility. They are two seperate states. For child #2 we are going to go back to A.R.T treatments first, if that does't work we will try to adopt again.