Breastfeeding and "Clan of the Cave Bear" - Page 2

[Rhiannon Feimorgan]

Originally Posted by TigerTail

Give me Claire & Jamie anyday.

Hear hear! There are some good nursing refrences in those books to. In Outlander, the first one, when Jamie is discribing to Claire about how his mother died he says he was 8 years old so at least he was weaned. Like if he'd been a little younger he would still have been nursing. Another part of that book discribes his sister expressing milk when she has to be away from her newborn.(to rescue her brother from hanging) We are told that the newborn was being fed goats milk and it was understood that this was not a good situation and could not go on longer than a day or two. They also talked about the intence bond and dependance of not only a nursing baby for her mother but of a nursing mother for her baby.

However GD is severly laking in these stories. Kids are getting beatings left right and center. But i guess that was the way of it in the 1700's

[homefrontgirl]

I agree about the Outlander books. There is even a part in the 2nd one (I think) where Claire bf her daughter despite the fact that it's not really done by other mother's in the 50s/60s. Claire explains that she had seen it done so many times in her time traveling that it was natural and expected to her.

[Meiri]

Oh! I actually gasped in sadness thinking of the poor Neanderthals on the Geico ad when you said that. I saw his aggrieved face & everything. Don't be mean to the cavemen.

Hey! I was including the Cro Magnons in that too. Ayla was one of them, only adopted by the Neanderthals, and apparently was the only inventive one in her subspecies too. To give credit where credit is due, her adopters had invented Sign Language.

[OkieMama2three]

I remember reading the first two or three in highschool, but honestly do not remember the breasfeeding references. But then again, in my mind it was a given that mothers breastfeed their babies, so I probably just kinda skipped over it cause I mean, yeah of course she was breastfeeding, what else was she gonna do?
Might have to re-read now....... I'm always up for some "mental bubblegum"

[turtlewomyn]

I read those books in fourth grade, so I don't remember all that. Cool though. Clan of the Cave Bear was good (she really did her research) but the others did turn sort of soap opera-ish, especially when Ayla was hooking up with that other guy and Jondalar was all jealous blah blah blah. Maybe I should get the first book and re-read it.

[ShadowMom]

Originally Posted by OkieMama2three

I remember reading the first two or three in highschool, but honestly do not remember the breasfeeding references. But then again, in my mind it was a given that mothers breastfeed their babies, so I probably just kinda skipped over it cause I mean, yeah of course she was breastfeeding, what else was she gonna do?
Might have to re-read now....... I'm always up for some "mental bubblegum"

Well, it's not that they were BREASTFEEDING... it's the knowledge the author displays of it. For instance, the main character specifically states in the latest book (Shelters of Stone) that if a baby is weaned before age 3, they can be sickly and unwell. And that as soon as the babies in the books want to nurse, they are nursed. Those are fairly radical concepts for most people in the 80's, so she must have really done her research.

I would have much more expected references to jamming solid foods down a young infants mouth... the parents being taught to ignore their kids when they cry... all of those things.

It is really obvious to us now that someone fromthat time period would most likely not do those things, since it would put children at risk unnecessarily, but that doesn't mean that normal people have that sort of knowledge or perspective.

So, I think it speaks well of the research she must have done for the books as a whole. She has certainly taken a lot of poetic license... but there are many areas which do reflect our current understanding of that time period and the people living there.

For instance, Creb appears to be based on the remains of an actual Neanderthal found in a cave. I thought that was really interesting.

[ShadowMom]

Pardon me, CotCB was published in 1980, not 1984.

[wendy1221]

Originally Posted by RidentMama

I was very impressed with her referring to breastfeeding so often and how normal it was. Her books have a lot of depth (and the occasional um...intimate scene). In her latest book, there is a baby who is being raised on the sly by an older sibling (parents aren't interested in their kids at all), and they find a wetnurse and explain to the older sibling that fruit juice is not a substitute for breastmilk.

It was gruel, not juice. They didn't really have fruit juice back then. Remember the chewing and spitting to get juice. Blah!!!

I'm pretty sure the author is firstly an anthropologist, and an author second, so I enjoy the books a lot and try not to hold the so-so writing against her.

I think I read CotCB when I was about 10 years old. My mom was pretty AP, so I didn't think anything was weird about the way they parented at all.

[Sustainer]

I think she's a lactivist. She makes a point of saying things about breastfeeding that other writers wouldn't mention. You can hear her positive attitude behind her words.

I highly recommend the Earth's Children's series to anyone who's an AP parent or a lactivist.

[isabel rose]

I read CotCB when it came out (Iwas about9?) and the BF in it had an impact on how I thought about the whole thing... It sort of reminds you of what is "natural" for humans. We (my bro's & me)were all breastfed but had bottles as well, and were off the boob by 9mo.
However have to agree about the series later becoming soap opera about the woman who invented everything,from sewing needles to hairbraids although Jondalar's mother invented wine, so that made a change...
Ooh, was the Brother Wind series the one with Reindeer Moon and the girl who died giving birth to twins? If so I agree -a lot more realistic-seeming, or set further in the past.

[Arwyn]

First, let me just say that The Mamoth Hunters SUCKED. It SUCKED SUCKED SUCKED SUCKED. I couldn't put it down. It SUCKED.

Ahem. Anyway.

Of course the women of that time would have to nurse, but the point is the women of THIS time wouldn't have to write so positively about it. I mean, she could have talked about how awful it was that they had to breastfeed for a whole year, or had Ayla inventing the first formula or crap like that; but she didn't. She totally makes breastfeeding seem like a natural, beneficial, positive thing, and that deserves mad props.

Even if The Mamoth Hunters sucked.

[Sustainer]

Originally Posted by Arwyn

Of course the women of that time would have to nurse, but the point is the women of THIS time wouldn't have to write so positively about it. I mean, she could have talked about how awful it was that they had to breastfeed for a whole year, or had Ayla inventing the first formula or crap like that; but she didn't. She totally makes breastfeeding seem like a natural, beneficial, positive thing, and that deserves mad props.

Exactly.

[Miasmamma]

Originally Posted by TigerTail

I actually enjoy three page tree descriptions; the sex made me acutely uncomfortable for some reason. Give me Claire & Jamie anyday.

I agree! Gotta love the Outlander series!

[Celery]

Originally Posted by Arwyn

or had Ayla inventing the first formula or crap like that; but she didn't.

Yeah, that.

If only Ayla and Jondalar could have been as inventive in their sex lives - I got so sick of skipping ten pages every thirty pages or so.

I really enjoyed the second and third ones - all that craft!