or Connect
Mothering › Mothering Forums › Childhood and Beyond › The Childhood Years › Oh My G*D! 16yo boy asks my 3.5yo ds to - UPDATE in post 129
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Oh My G*D! 16yo boy asks my 3.5yo ds to - UPDATE in post 129

post #1 of 157
Thread Starter 
stick his tongue in the 16yo mouth. I'm physically ill about this.

My ds has been going to the same home daycare provider for about 1.5 years. L has a 16yo boy and a 9yo boy. Well, about 6mos ago, ds1 (3.5yo) came to dh and told him that 16yo gave ds1 "puppy dog kisses". (After asking ds1 more about this he demostrated WHAT a puppy dog kiss was - licking on the face). So, I asked L about it and she talked to 16yo and he said that he showed ds1 their puppy and explained to ds1 that dog give "puppy dog kisses", but that he did NOT demonstrate it to ds1.

Well, on Wednesday night, ds1 and I were sitting together being silly about how stinky ds's breathe was (he had garlic containing food for dinner ) and all of the sudden he said "16yo told me I had to stick my tongue in his mouth if I wanted to go downstairs to play." (L has a finished basement for the bigger kids to go down and play when her assistant is on-duty or her 16yo apparently.) I then asked ds1, "oh, did 16yo show you how to do that." he answered "yes" and then demonstrated for me.

Then ds1 said "are you mad?" to which I answered, no baby, I'm not. Then, ds1 asked if it was bad. I explained that 16yo is a "big boy" and HE should know not to do that to little boys. I then went on to tell ds1 that he shouldn't let 16yo do that anymore and say "NO, I'll tell (per the Protecting the Gift book" and go find L or her assistant.

Well, after ds went to bed on Wednesday night, dh and I decided that we will not allow our boys to go back there again. Period.

So, HOW CAN I BROACH THIS SUBJECT WITH HER? Obviously this is the 2nd incident, so I don't feel like my ds1 is making this up. I really don't. Now, I understand that L might not believe my ds, but I want to approach this in a gentle, non-judemental way. L is a FANTASTIC caregiver and her ds quite possibly is ruining her livelihood. (she is a single mom.) So, how would you talk with her?

ETA - I will be contacting the authorities, but I need to know HOW to approach L in the meantime.
-----------------------------------------
So I talked with L again on Saturday and she recalled a conversation in which she was explaining to ds1 and another daycare kid about "we cannot kiss babies on their mouths because our mouths and tongues have germs". After L was done talking with them, 16yo was near ds1 and the other child and ds1 asked more about our mouths/tongues having germs.

So, part of me thinks this was innocent on both parts. But, we're erring on the side of caution and the boys aren't going back.

But, the 16yo also offered to take a lie detector test. :

So, I really don't know what the whole story is, BUT after careful consideration, I'm not willing to make a report about this under these circumstances. This boy attends the school dh works for and he actually told L that maybe he should switch schools.
post #2 of 157
As bad as I would feel for the dcp, I would feel obligated to report this to the authorities. DCP might not take your story seriously, and there are other children in her care that need to be protected.
post #3 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunnysideup View Post
As bad as I would feel for the dcp, I would feel obligated to report this to the authorities. DCP might not take your story seriously, and there are other children in her care that need to be protected.
ITA.

This is really serious, and makes me sick to my stomach. Even if your boys don't go back there and never see 16yo again, that's not going to stop 16yo from finding another victim.

You HAVE to contact the authorities, you are morally obligated to do so.
post #4 of 157
exactly, it needs to be reported there will be other children.
post #5 of 157
There are young children who need to be protected so I think that gentle needs to go out the window. I would tell her your dc are not going back and I would tell her why. Then I would contact the police and explain what your ds told you. Chances are there are other kids being abused and it needs to stop. Plus there's a 16 y.o. who needs to be stopped before this escalates. There are a million reasons why the 16 y.o. may have behaved in this manner, which while it does not excuse him, also needs to be addressed ASAP. It's not easy to do, but needs to be done.
post #6 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristyM26 View Post
There are young children who need to be protected so I think that gentle needs to go out the window. I would tell her your dc are not going back and I would tell her why. Then I would contact the police and explain what your ds told you. Chances are there are other kids being abused and it needs to stop. Plus there's a 16 y.o. who needs to be stopped before this escalates. There are a million reasons why the 16 y.o. may have behaved in this manner, which while it does not excuse him, also needs to be addressed ASAP. It's not easy to do, but needs to be done.
ITA
post #7 of 157
report it as some one who has been the little child report it if it was nothing then that is ok but if it is something then it is beter to have them know about it beter to be safe then sorry in this case
post #8 of 157
I am sorry for the caregiver, but I agree with everyone else in that this needs to be reported. There are other children at risk.

The 16 year old did this to your son, but already knows that your son tends to tell you about his day and happenings (ie - puppy kiss)....so likely the 16 year old would be more careful wiht your son then he might be with a child that seems less likely to tell. Just a thought.

We are mothers to our children, but also have a responsibility to mother all children and help them when needed.

Good luck! I don't envy you your position. Let us know how it goes.
post #9 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by peilover010202 View Post
ETA - I will be contacting the authorities, but I need to know HOW to approach L in the meantime.
I don't think you should tell her anything in the meantime. I think you need to contact the authorities first. It is not your job to worry about her livelyhood at this point. You need to protect your own young children (which you are doing) and other people's young children.
post #10 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by JElaineB View Post
I don't think you should tell her anything in the meantime. I think you need to contact the authorities first. It is not your job to worry about her livelyhood at this point. You need to protect your own young children (which you are doing) and other people's young children.
:

It would be best that they have no advanced warning. It seems to me your ds was being groomed for sexual abuse and it would be a good idea to have some research about this type of "grooming" in your pocket in case the police give you a blank look when you try to report it.
post #11 of 157
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by i'mmykid'$mom View Post
:

It would be best that they have no advanced warning. It seems to me your ds was being groomed for sexual abuse and it would be a good idea to have some research about this type of "grooming" in your pocket in case the police give you a blank look when you try to report it.

Yes, I agree with you. I believe ds was being groomed I reread some important parts of "Protecting the Gift" and it sickened me.
post #12 of 157


peilover, what's the history going on with the 16 year old?

Do you know if he has been abused?
post #13 of 157
Thread Starter 
Okay, so I did talk to L (sorry, didn't get your responses in time). She tells me that 16yo hasn't been left alone with the daycare kids EVER and that she's talked with both her boys about inappropriate language/touch so they are familiar with it. She said that 16yo is around the kids, but NEVER alone.

She also told me that she has heard "horror" stories about situations like this and has done her best to protect her kids by not allowing them any alone time with the children.

She asked if ds1 could have possibly misconstrued a conversation? Then she asked if dh and I would meet with her and 16yo. I agreed.

Honestly, it doesn't matter what she says. Our boys aren't going back. Do you really think I should still contact authorities given this information? Ideally, I should. But, in my situation - what would you do? Sure, I have to protect all children. I'm not denying that. Not at all. But, I did ask if she's ever had a complaint similar to this and she said never (although there is a 5yo girl who played dr with another child and had a complaint about that). This is a SMALL town and if I file a report - her business is gone. PERIOD. Regardless of guilt or innocence.
post #14 of 157
I would absolutely report it. There are plenty of serial abusers who are never found out until someone makes a report 5,6, or 7 kids down the road. Ask yourself if you could live with it if you didn't report it and he escalates and rapes a child 2 or 3 years down the road?
post #15 of 157
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by newmommy View Post


peilover, what's the history going on with the 16 year old?

Do you know if he has been abused?

His mother died at a young age and when his father married L, L adopted him. Well, a few years ago, 16yo's dad came out of the closet and divorced L. 16yo dad then moved in with his partner over an hour away.

I have no idea if he's ever been abused, but I suspect if he has, it's unknown.
post #16 of 157
I understand you're in a terrible position. But you did say you had no reason to doubt your son.

When the "puppy dog kisses" episode happened, it looks like you're saying what happened was she talked to her 16 yo, who 'explained' what the interchange had been. From that, I assume she wasn't there when the "puppy dog kisses" thing went down. But now she's saying he's never been alone with a child. That seems odd.
post #17 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by peilover010202 View Post
Okay, so I did talk to L (sorry, didn't get your responses in time). She tells me that 16yo hasn't been left alone with the daycare kids EVER and that she's talked with both her boys about inappropriate language/touch so they are familiar with it. She said that 16yo is around the kids, but NEVER alone.

She also told me that she has heard "horror" stories about situations like this and has done her best to protect her kids by not allowing them any alone time with the children.

She asked if ds1 could have possibly misconstrued a conversation? Then she asked if dh and I would meet with her and 16yo. I agreed.

Honestly, it doesn't matter what she says. Our boys aren't going back. Do you really think I should still contact authorities given this information? Ideally, I should. But, in my situation - what would you do? Sure, I have to protect all children. I'm not denying that. Not at all. But, I did ask if she's ever had a complaint similar to this and she said never (although there is a 5yo girl who played dr with another child and had a complaint about that). This is a SMALL town and if I file a report - her business is gone. PERIOD. Regardless of guilt or innocence.

That's such a tough call. And I don't have any advice for you except to listen to your instincts. I mean, this could be a REALLY bad situation. But it could also be something misunderstood. My daughter is 2 and recently made a comment about me hitting her to dh. He raised an eyebrow (obviously) and we asked her more about it. I mean, this child has *never* been hit. To my knowledge, she's never seen anyone get hit, spanked, etc. But she came up with it and seemed to have a pretty clear idea of something having happened between us. The best we can figure is she heard me and some other AP mamas at playgroup talking about spanking and GD and processed it in her own way. At this age, it's so hard to tell where the line is between their imaginations and the true lay of the land. I think the best you can do is listen to your instincts and your knowledge of this care provider. If she's really never allowed her son to be alone with the kids, it's hard to imagine things playing out exactly as described. But if you get the sense she's not quite on top of things, then there may be a real worry there.
post #18 of 157
Though I would feel badly for this WAHM, I still think you need to report this for the kids' sakes....and, if her boy needs help, this will (hopefully) get him some. Of course I agree that no matter what, you're children should not go back there.
post #19 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by peilover010202 View Post
His mother died at a young age and when his father married L, L adopted him. Well, a few years ago, 16yo's dad came out of the closet and divorced L. 16yo dad then moved in with his partner over an hour away.

I have no idea if he's ever been abused, but I suspect if he has, it's unknown.
Perhaps 16 yo is having some identity issues, if dad is gay...experimenting in some way with a small boy might be his way of figuring out who he is...not an excuse for his behavior and completely my own analysis, but just a thought.
post #20 of 157
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mammastar2 View Post
I understand you're in a terrible position. But you did say you had no reason to doubt your son.

When the "puppy dog kisses" episode happened, it looks like you're saying what happened was she talked to her 16 yo, who 'explained' what the interchange had been. From that, I assume she wasn't there when the "puppy dog kisses" thing went down. But now she's saying he's never been alone with a child. That seems odd.
Well, that's true and she even made the exception for that time (saying, well, besides that time, I honestly cannot recall a time...") She went on to explain that ds1 was crying to see the puppy (kept outdoors). And, that she allowed 16yo to take ds1 into the kitchen to the backdoor to see the puppy. She definitely does not have an open layout home, so there is no way she could have seen the exchange.

Perhaps given that situation, she has been more vigilant about protecting her own children as well.

I'm sorry just thinking this through...
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: The Childhood Years
Mothering › Mothering Forums › Childhood and Beyond › The Childhood Years › Oh My G*D! 16yo boy asks my 3.5yo ds to - UPDATE in post 129