I didn't know this!

[SundayInSeptember]

"I am not trying to be rude, and have never said to anyone "I look down upon you" or "you are a bad person" ect to someone who used drugs in labor. but i still feel it is wrong. It is poison, and the baby has no say in it. It is not ok to me and not excusable. "

I have never had an epidural. I didn't know this!

Does the epidural act as a temporary poison for the baby? Is this information given to you on the consent form? I am aware that some narcotics used for general surgery can be poisonous in high doses, but I didn't realize this was the case for epidurals.

I recognize that for true emergency situations, there are many necessary interventions used for good reason, and an epidural is likely one of them. But should epidurals be unavailable for a normal birth?

This sort of information is never in the main stream media, so we don't get all the facts like this.

[_betsy_]

I think she was quoting someone else? No idea where the quoted block came from, though.

I'm reserving comment until she has a chance to clarify.

[nova22]

I also got the impression that the quote was from someone else.

SundayInSeptember - If you have a few hours you could check out this link:

http://www.healing-arts.org/mehl-madrona/mmepidural.htm

You don't have to read all of it, though, to see some of the possible adverse effects of epidurals.

Also, HERE is a list of possible short-term and long-term side effects for both the mother and the baby.

I would not go so far as to call it a poison; I think that's an extremely strong would and has some very dangerous implications to it. I don't want to go around saying that mothers are poisoning their children because they ask for pain relief during labor.

In my experience, the most common side effects for women who have had epidurals are long-term migraine headaches, and backaches at the site of the epidural. HTH.

[Finch]

Originally Posted by _betsy_

I think she was quoting someone else

I certainly hope so. Since lots of mothers here have apparently "poisoned" their children.

[Flor]

I think she was quoting. She is asking for information on epidurals (which I don't have! ).

[SundayInSeptember]

I was quoting someone else--

--I would never say anything like that.

I need pain meds for a super-long overdue dental surgery and now I am worried about the poisoning effect, too...

...no, I would never say that. I should have just quoted the poisoning part. And if it applies to epidurals, it probably applies to all these meds they use for surgeries, etc.

Yuck. Back to the internet...more research is needed...grumble, grumble...

[Finch]

Well then I apologize for virtually biting your head off. Mea culpa.

[nova22]

Originally Posted by SundayInSeptember

--I would never say anything like that.

I need pain meds for a super-long overdue dental surgery and now I am worried about the poisoning effect, too...

...no, I would never say that. I should have just quoted the poisoning part. And if it applies to epidurals, it probably applies to all these meds they use for surgeries, etc.

Yuck. Back to the internet...more research is needed...grumble, grumble...

You should try posting in Health & Healing maybe. Make sure you say whether or not you're pregnant and what type of meds your dentist will use if you know.

[SundayInSeptember]

Thank you for your suggestion. I will post it over accordingly.

No wonder people are reluctant to subject the baby to a poisoning narcotic. Now I am worried about doing it to myself!

You learn something new every day...it's not necessarily good news, though!

[Jilian]

I don't think it's poison but many drugs given to laboring women are narcotics and do have potentially harmful side effects.

[jengacnm]

Whoever said this is probably in the same tribe as folks who say that formula is poison. Drugs for labor, and formula for babies, are not needed to the degree that they are used, but sometimes they are the best option.

ANY medication in pregnancy/labor is risk/benefit, not no drugs are good/all drugs are bad. You need dental surgery? Well, you need drugs for that. Your options are a) do the surgery without drugs, or b) don't do the surgery until you're no longer pregnant or breastfeeding. Neither of these seem like viable chioces.

Also, gum disease or a tooth infection can lead to preterm labor. Is it better to get the procedure done, narcotics and all, or to leave it alone, be in pain, and possibly have a preterm baby?

I encourage you to not take someone's opinion as scientific research. Medications are medications, not poison. They have side effects, known and unknown, but so do the conditions for which the medicine is needed. Each of us have to make the best decision we can with the information we have.

Jennifer

[lifescholar]

I try not to put drugs into myself unnecessarily. I only ever take ibuprofen, and only when I am unable to function without it (only for menstrual cramps). When I get a cold, I take Neo Citran, but everything else is herbal.

So, I didn't want to use any drugs during labour! When you think about it, it's probably a baby's most vulnerable time, so I didn't want to mess with it more than need be!

I ended up induced, which wasn't great, but I was getting concerned about him, so I did it....and after 49 hours of labour (7 of which were oxytocin-induced), I was too exhausted to go on, and could definitely NOT have pushed!

So, it came down to 2 choices: epidural now, or c-section in a few hours(in which case I'd need an epidural anyways!) So I chose the epidural!

My son and I were both lucky to have absolutely NO negative side effects from the epidural. I'm not in a hurry to have one again, but I know that if it becomes necessary again, it's an option.

[Emilie]

The major side effect I had with ds's birth and epidural was the SWELLING. It made nursing almost impossible. My breasts were the size of bowling balls and tight. No milking would release the size and tightness of my nipples and breasts. It took 6 weeks to get him to latch correctly and we had to feed him out of a dropper.

The other side effects I feel..... were the trauma the hospital I birthed at put me thru. Taking my baby to observe him- trying to give him sugar water and treating me like crap.

I am not anti epidural. I feel it is overused and I think more women would not have epidurals if birth was talked about positively rather than negatively as it is.

[ledzepplon]

Originally Posted by lifescholar

I try not to put drugs into myself unnecessarily. I only ever take ibuprofen, and only when I am unable to function without it (only for menstrual cramps). When I get a cold, I take Neo Citran, but everything else is herbal.

Just wanted to throw in my two cents on this: "herbal" doesn't mean it's not a drug.

"Herbal" means made of herbs. A "drug" according to Merrian Webster dictionary is:

"a substance intended for use in the diagnosis, cure, mitigation, treatment, or prevention of disease . . . a substance other than food intended to affect the structure or function of the body. . . ."

So clearly, herbal doesn't mean "non-drug."

[BugMacGee]

So clearly, herbal doesn't mean "non-drug."

Especially since many pharmaceuticals are based on plant compounds.

Morphine comes from poppies
Digitalis comes from Fox Glove
Just to name a couple.....

And one of the original uses for one of the compounds in aspirin was to relieve labor pain. By the Egyptians IIRC.

[stacyann21]

Emilie: Swelling is actually a side-effect of IV fluids.

An epidural is a combination of several drugs. They are dangerous for the mother and baby. It's too bad most people don't do research before getting one.

[lifescholar]

Originally Posted by ledzepplon

Just wanted to throw in my two cents on this: "herbal" doesn't mean it's not a drug.

Very true!!

But herbal (I mean NATURAL herbal) stuff is better than "drug" drugs, right?? I really don't have time to research this stuff...I just go by what I hear, and what makes good sense....

[ledzepplon]

Originally Posted by lifescholar

Very true!!

But herbal (I mean NATURAL herbal) stuff is better than "drug" drugs, right?? I really don't have time to research this stuff...I just go by what I hear, and what makes good sense....

I guess it depends on the herb or pharmaceutical drug. EVERYTHING has side effects. The plus side of many pharm. drugs is that their production is carefully regulated, they generally come with clear instruction for use, and they are tested pretty rigorously. Herbals are nice because they are natural, but they can be harmful if misused or contaminated.

[applejuice]

DRugs can be a lifesaver in labor when they are needed. Clearly they are over used.

The problem I have heard over the years about local anesthetics as spinals, epidurals and blocks is that doctors tell the mothers that the medication does not reach the baby when in fact, all drugs reach the baby and effect the baby more profoundly than the mother.

[Romana]

The problem I have heard over the years about local anesthetics as spinals, epidurals and blocks is that doctors tell the mothers that the medication does not reach the baby when in fact, all drugs reach the baby and effect the baby more profoundly than the mother.

ITA. This is the big one in my estimation. So many women think (and are told by their doctors) that epidural medication will not reach the baby. However, the drugs in the epidural cross the blood/brain barrier and do reach the baby. So it's a risk mothers considering an epidural should be aware of, so they can make a truly informed choice. There are certainly situations where I would consider an epidural, but it frustrates me that so often they're handed to women like harmless candy when the woman deserves to know how it may affect both her and her baby.

Julia
dd 10 mos