He is FIVE!!!

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O.K, i have a new daycare boy who is in Kindergarten, and is five. He's a very young kindergartner, and really should not have been allowed in K until next year.

He really REALLY struggles in school. It's all hard for him, and he gets frustrated.

His mom is very nice, and fun, but not the typical Mom. She's um.... fun.. more fun than a Mom really should be. (Party fun) The kids see this fun more than they should. (They are our neighbors)

But, she also has an extremely short temper. So, I try not to tell her when I have problems with him, because she overreacts.

She and her boyfriend are splitting, and she and the children will be moving out of BF's house in a few weeks. Dad sees them every other week, but Mom and Dad don't get along at all.
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O.K, here is the problem. He is five. The other kids are a lot younger than him. I have kids from 12 months to 4 years.

He bullies the littlest kids. Last week, he got tired of hearing a two year old whine, so he kicked him in the head. He thought nothing of doing that. It didn't bother him a bit.

Today, he wanted the hotwheel that the 12 month old had in his hand. The 12 month old didn't give it up, so the five year old pushed his forehead back, while yanking the car from his hand. The 12 month old fell down and hurt his head. Again, this didn't bother him that the 12 month old was hurt. He doesn't seem to care if others cry, as long as it doesn't interfere with his fun.

I don't want to punish him, (well, I DO..but) I want him to WANT to treat the babies as if they are valuable. He sees them as "less than worthy". I want him to learn how to be a good friend. I want him to helpful and responsible.

How can I make him understand that the babies are human? Without making him feel like i'm always on his case?????

I need words to say, and actions too please.

[chfriend]

"I really need your help with the babies. Can you help me by....."

[4evermom]

What might work for a boy like my 5 yo is telling him the goal is to trick the baby into giving him what he wants w/o making the baby cry and explain one way to do that is to give the baby a toy he/she might like better and trade it. Personally, I think a little manipulation is a good skill to develop.

I know my ds has gotten to the age where he feels a bit superior to "babies" so I'm not surprised your daycare boy feels similarly. From his perspective, it probably rather sucks to be around younger kids who keep playing with the toys he wants and getting in his way. Would it be feasible to section off part of a room for the older kids and put the "choking hazard" toys (like that hotwheel car) over there?

If you are successful in getting the boy to trade, you can say "the baby seems happy with that toy". That will encourage him to be empathetic and observe what others are feeling. My ds can be empathetic but much of the time does not act that way especially if he isn't feeling happy.

[mamaduck]

I really wonder if this placement is not good for any of you. I would really search your heart about whether or not you can keep him, with the babies in your care. I can understand that considering termination is probably really hard. You want to be a positive influence in this child's life, but does your commitment to the other children come first?

If you decide to terminate him, you need to approach the mom in terms of HIS best interests (to be around children closer to his age) and perhaps provide a referral.

If you decide to keep him --- be prepared for hard work! You need to keep him by your side at all times, and coach his every move near the babies. He'll need to be removed and talked with every time he hurts another child. He'll need coaching (lots of coaching) about how to use his words.

I would not focus on his lack of empathy -- I don't think you can "make" someone feel empathy. I would focus on his behavior, and his self-expression.

I'm not usually in favor of charts, rewards, and such -- but in a group situation like this, with only one adult, and no consistant "back-up" from his parents -- I would consider a chart of some sort to help track his"violence free" days. Maybe a check mark or sticker in the AM, and then another in the PM -- each time he goes that stretch of time without hitting/hurting others. With lots of coaching from you so that he can experience being successful.

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Originally Posted by mamaduck

I really wonder if this placement is not good for any of you. I would really search your heart about whether or not you can keep him, with the babies in your care. I can understand that considering termination is probably really hard. .

I really don't want to let him go. In this case it truly ISN'T the money. I like him. He is having a very rough year, and the kids like him. He's the "big kid".

He isn't mean, naughty, or even agressive by nature. He is just inconsiderate. If that makes sense.

I made the mistake of telling his mom, and I wish I hadn't. When I deal with a problem, I consider it over. But, now he is grounded. (for a week)

[Laggie]

A five year old? Grounded? For a WEEK?

That is totally unreasonable. No wonder the child doesn't display any empathy - neither does his mom!

[UUMom]

Well...5 whole years old!

I know people should think someone who has only been walking and talking for *maybe* 4 years should understand everything...but the fact is, a 5 yr old is new to this world and doesn't have any experience dealing with our adult issues and shortcomings.

If the OP can't deal with him, that's fair. Give the parents notice to so he can get what he needs.

But just beacuse a 5 yr old doesn't have the skills to deal with group settings for hours a day doesn't mean there is anything wrong with the child. It's the adults in his/her life that need fixing.

[hhurd]

Originally Posted by UUMom

W
But just beacuse a 5 yr old doesn't have the skills to deal with group settings for hours a day doesn't mean there is anything wrong with the child.

Hip Hip Hooray! Thanks for saying that so bluntly.

To the OP, you sound like a great advocate (and a good friend) to the child. I hope he can stay in your care.

Plus, how do you ground a 5 yo?

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Originally Posted by hhurd

Plus, how do you ground a 5 yo?

I wondered that too. Grounded from what?

to the poster who was saying he is only five, and that I am expecting too much. I am not EXPECTING him to have empathy. I am trying to teach him empathy, or at least respect for the little ones. I just need good ideas how I can make him value the little ones, instead of thinking of them as "less than" himself. I want him to care about them. But, i don't expect him to come already with that in him. I want to teach it.

[Ruthla]

I think at this age you simply need to explain to him that hitting/kicking the babies isn't allowed. Empathy will come with time, for now he needs to simply learn that certain behaviors will not be tolerated and that X will happen if he doesn't follow the rules. Make it more fun to be gentle with the babies than it is for him to bully them.

Maybe if he uses violence to get a certain toy he loses the toy? I'm also wondering if maybe "time out" for 4 or 5 minutes after each of these violent episodes would be appropriate in this situation. I'm not normally a fan of "time outs" but it certainly seems more age-appropriate than being grounded for a week!

Look at it from his perspective: by hitting/pushing a baby, he gets the toy a few minutes faster. There needs to be some kind of disruption in his play when he does that, so that it becomes less disruptive to encourage the baby to give him the toy willingly rather than to take it via brute force.